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Emb170man
10-17-2018, 11:33 AM
Does anybody have a copy of the post made several years back by an American FO regarding doing his job and not everyone elseís? It was a narrative of one day of doing only his job, and not covering for everybody else. I remember he was deadheading, went to check in with the gate agent, the agent told him that she was too busy to deal with him and go have a seat, so he did...And sat right there until the flight already left, before you went back up to the gate agent to ask her if she now had time for him. On the next flight, when they did finally DH him out they made him check his bag, so when he finally got where he was going to operate a flight he had to go out and get his bag, recluse security, etc.


I thought I had saved a copy of the narrative, and was talking to another pilot about it today, but cannot find it and a search on here didnít retrieve results.

Thanks in advance


Name User
10-17-2018, 12:56 PM
I don't know of that one but I recently flew with a disgruntled ex-TWA guy. The CP had called him up and immediately started chewing him out. I have actually been next to another CA where the same CP shot first and then asked questions. In both instances this CP was blatantly in the wrong and had no idea of the situation.

Anyway, we were rescheduled for a different DH and the CA confirmed with scheduling a new shuttle pickup time. The time comes and goes...and goes...and goes...eventually he calls, we missed our DH and were released for the rest of the trip. Total CS cluster but this was directly related to the "do your job" thing after being chewed out.

I can't speak for him but IMO we are all well paid. Personally I don't support the do your job thing. Only because there is no way for the company to realize why people are disgruntled. It's not the pay. I hate to admit it but Wallstreet was right, the pay raises were a waste of money.

That being said this company is so mismanaged, from top to bottom. It's too big. They can't possibly control it.

Arado 234
10-17-2018, 01:05 PM
If it is a CS eff up, can't you listen to the tapes? Or do the recordings mysteriously disappear? What base are you referring to?


...
That being said this company is so mismanaged, from top to bottom. It's too big. They can't possibly control it.

I beg to differ about *big*. It seems to work over in ATL. That being said, I think AA made the right step in reducing middle management positions. I would like to add getting rid of *********s, but I don't think it complies with my recent online bias "training".


Name User
10-17-2018, 01:12 PM
If it is a CS eff up, can't you listen to the tapes? Or do the recordings mysteriously disappear?



I beg to differ. It seems to work over in ATL.

He was chewed out for a different reason. Don't want to go into it on here. But totally ignorant of what actually happened. He should've done a little research ahead of calling and going from 0-60 in 2.3 seconds.

I really don't know what it's like at Delta. Or United. All I know is it's really screwed up here and way worse than my regional was.

E190 Driver
10-21-2018, 08:12 AM
Does anybody have a copy of the post made several years back by an American FO regarding doing his job and not everyone elseís? It was a narrative of one day of doing only his job, and not covering for everybody else. I remember he was deadheading, went to check in with the gate agent, the agent told him that she was too busy to deal with him and go have a seat, so he did...And sat right there until the flight already left, before you went back up to the gate agent to ask her if she now had time for him. On the next flight, when they did finally DH him out they made him check his bag, so when he finally got where he was going to operate a flight he had to go out and get his bag, recluse security, etc.


I thought I had saved a copy of the narrative, and was talking to another pilot about it today, but cannot find it and a search on here didnít retrieve results.

Thanks in advance


You looking for this???

I'm just here to do a job, my job.​

5:00 AM show for a 6 o'clock go in SFO this morning. Took the 4:40 shuttle from the short layover, and after 4 stops, got through security at 5:10. Straight to the jet which sat all night. ​

Parking brake pressure sat around 2,000 PSI, in the orange band.​
3 of the 4 main tires with low pressure.​
A chip in a fan blade in the left engine.​
Cracked taxi light.​
2 of the 3 exterior emergency exit placards under the FO window deteriorated.​
Exterior Evacuation Slide placard on the forward galley door deteriorated.​

Did I mention this thing sat all night at a maintenance base?​

Anyway, a MX team showed up to work. Then they quit. Apparently AA schedules a maintenance shift change right at the morning push with all the so-called critical flights. New team shows up. Work is being done with all the passengers politely watching from their assigned seats. Departure time keeps getting pushed back. At 7:00, the #1 tells us the flight is canceled and they're deadheading on the 7:10 flight to DFW. So are we. Maintenance tells me the jet is OTS because 2 brake metering valves are leaking.​

We gather our stuff, (well most of it, my CA left his earpiece in the jet), and head to the new gate. A manager, Kevin, is working the 7:10 flight. He's stressing. Tells us he's putting us on the next flight, not this one, and to leave him alone. No problem, just means we will be late for our return flight, but we aren't in charge of manning, deadheading, scheduling or SFO, so we sit in those cool round red chairs out of the way and watch the show. Long lines, cell phones out everywhere, agents gate checking bags, and the manager running around trying to keep up. ​

7:10 comes and goes. The gate door is shut. A gate agent makes the following page in the terminal, "Kevin, return to gate 57. The captain (working the flight) wants to talk to you." Kevin refused to talk to him. The door opens again, and agents are sending down more passengers. Important-looking people are talking to their respective travel departments and jockeying for position at the gate to get the last few seats. Apparently, they tried to close the flight out with 20 empty seats and a long line at the gate from our canceled flight. The captain called bull[Content Deleted].​

Our names are called. We weave through the important people to the gate. The agent looks at us, "What's up?" "We don't know, you called our names." "Oh, you're deadheading?" Again, we don't know. "Go sit down." OK.​

5 minutes later, our names are called again. "You're on. We're checking your bags." "How will we get our bags in DFW?" They are "Escort Tagged". They will be brought up the jet bridge in DFW with strollers and wheel chairs. "OK, cool". All middle seats in coach, my favorite! We push at 7:33, 23 minutes late. Critical flight canceled and another D+23... We arrive in DFW A+8...​

On a side note, our crew breakfasts were not provided on the deadhead, so we hadn't eaten since the night prior. ​

Our departure back to SFO was scheduled at 12:40, so we figured AA had the flight boarded and ready. We are standing on the jetbridge waiting for our bags. Passengers are deplaning. They're done. The crew leaves and another shows up. Still no bags. Oh , and no keys or vests to go find our bags. We wait. After all, baggage handlers know how to do their jobs, and it's not my job to prod everybody along. We're all highly trained professionals. They board the next flight so we clear the jetbridge into the gate area. They finish and the agent asks us what's going on. We tell her the story. She goes to check. At that time, almost an hour after we arrived, crew tracking calls. "Why aren't you at the next flight?" Captain tells her our story. Here we are. No bags, no manuals, no keys, no nothing. Oh and by the way, we haven't eaten since last night. Tracking says nourishment's hotels and limos' arena. ​

Tracking calls back. She called the ramp manager. The ramp manager gave her the crew chief's cell phone number. She asked the chief about our bags with the "Escort Tags" on them. He told her no way was he going to carry them up the jetbridge stairs so he left them on the ramp. After a while, he took them to baggage claim. She said he was ****ed. We told her that's fine, just have them delivered to the departure gate, which did board on time, ready to go at 12:40. It's now 13:40-ish. ​

Nobody can deliver our "escort bags" to the new gate, so we go outside security and grab 'em. Come back through security in D, catch the train over to C and to the new gate. No agent, door shut. (Remember when a key would allow us to get to the jet? Not my problem anymore.) Screw it. I walk to McDonald's. Did I mention we hadn't eaten since the night before and it's 14:00 now?. I get back to the gate. The captain's studying the 18-foot-long flight plan. The agent lets me down the jetbridge. ​

Upon entering the jet, the flight attendant says, "Can you make a PA and tell these passengers why you're late?" She's standing next to a first class passenger in the galley. I say, "Well hi there, I'm Bill. How are you?" Eyeballing my little McDonald's bag, she says, "I'm not getting paid, we boarded over an hour ago, and I can't get off to get food like you have." "Hey I'm sorry, we haven't eaten since yesterday. We deadheaded in and AA lost our bags." I look at the passenger and say, "Hey there, how are you? Can you believe AA would lose our luggage?" He understood and was in a good mood. No problem with him. Just the FA.​

I walk around the jet. The captain comes down and we start making our nests. "Cabin's ready." SLAM. Ahhhh, peace behind the cockpit door. I've come to really like that door over the years. We're loading the box, flipping switches, all that cool stuff we do before we get paid. DING, DING. Captain answers, Yes? "Why aren't we moving yet?" Well, we just got here. Now we're running all those checklists we do before we go fly. A few minutes later, DING, DING. Yess? "Can you make a PA and tell these passengers why we're still sitting here?" I'm not making this up.​

Finally time to push. 14:50 local. D+130 minutes. BANG. The tow bar breaks. DING, DING. Yesss? "What was that??" Don't worry about it. We have it under control. Please let us do our jobs. MX inspects the jet. No problem. Meanwhile, the agent lets PAX off - without their bags... We can't leave without them. We finally push at 15:52 local. D+192.​



After the flight, one of the passenger got in the captain's face as he was deplaning, pointed his finger in his face and said, "You're a THUG! A union THUG! The captain replied, "Sir, you don't know me, but I assure you I'm nothing like that." Yes you ARE! A union THUG! and left.​

Maintenance came on and asked who the thug is. Captain fessed up. He laughed. Then he talked about a flight that canceled this morning because the crew "wrote up 19 items 20 minutes before departure". He got a bull[Content Deleted] look from the captain. Then he said, "Of course, the jet did sit here all night with our night shift."​

We get to the hotel and on the elevator. A guy says, "Hey, you're not the pilots that just came in from Dallas..." We braced and admitted it. No punches, but he said, "We heard you went to lunch before coming to the plane." He knows that not to be true now.​


The hardest part about this day was refraining from repeatedly stepping into the other departments and telling fellow employees what needs to be done. It is engrained in usto anticipate and fix problems we see coming. Once I overcame the urge to tell others how to do their jobs, it actually became quite entertaining to watch the operation.​

My advice to you is to not let the frustration of watching others without guidance raise your blood pressure, but to embrace the comedy of errors that ensues. ​

Do your job. No one else's. Do not tell others what needs to be done. Do not continually follow up.​
You called MX once. They are aware. No need to stress them out. The agent told you to sit down. She knows you're there. Don't stress her out. Roll with the flow. They're all highly-trained professionals. ​

It's a hard habit to break.​

Emb170man
10-21-2018, 08:18 AM
Thatís the one, thanks!!!

Name User
10-21-2018, 09:19 AM
Someone should forward that to Isom. Or a CP at least. It's so true. I haven't had that many things go wrong but if we just did our jobs this whole place would fall apart. Even more than it has.

I want this place to succeed, I just don't think managment does. Their goal is to collect their bonus and GTFO before it implodes.

ItnStln
10-21-2018, 09:29 AM
You looking for this???

I'm just here to do a job, my job.​

5:00 AM show for a 6 o'clock go in SFO this morning. Took the 4:40 shuttle from the short layover, and after 4 stops, got through security at 5:10. Straight to the jet which sat all night. ​

Parking brake pressure sat around 2,000 PSI, in the orange band.​
3 of the 4 main tires with low pressure.​
A chip in a fan blade in the left engine.​
Cracked taxi light.​
2 of the 3 exterior emergency exit placards under the FO window deteriorated.​
Exterior Evacuation Slide placard on the forward galley door deteriorated.​

Did I mention this thing sat all night at a maintenance base?​

Anyway, a MX team showed up to work. Then they quit. Apparently AA schedules a maintenance shift change right at the morning push with all the so-called critical flights. New team shows up. Work is being done with all the passengers politely watching from their assigned seats. Departure time keeps getting pushed back. At 7:00, the #1 tells us the flight is canceled and they're deadheading on the 7:10 flight to DFW. So are we. Maintenance tells me the jet is OTS because 2 brake metering valves are leaking.​

We gather our stuff, (well most of it, my CA left his earpiece in the jet), and head to the new gate. A manager, Kevin, is working the 7:10 flight. He's stressing. Tells us he's putting us on the next flight, not this one, and to leave him alone. No problem, just means we will be late for our return flight, but we aren't in charge of manning, deadheading, scheduling or SFO, so we sit in those cool round red chairs out of the way and watch the show. Long lines, cell phones out everywhere, agents gate checking bags, and the manager running around trying to keep up. ​

7:10 comes and goes. The gate door is shut. A gate agent makes the following page in the terminal, "Kevin, return to gate 57. The captain (working the flight) wants to talk to you." Kevin refused to talk to him. The door opens again, and agents are sending down more passengers. Important-looking people are talking to their respective travel departments and jockeying for position at the gate to get the last few seats. Apparently, they tried to close the flight out with 20 empty seats and a long line at the gate from our canceled flight. The captain called bull[Content Deleted].​

Our names are called. We weave through the important people to the gate. The agent looks at us, "What's up?" "We don't know, you called our names." "Oh, you're deadheading?" Again, we don't know. "Go sit down." OK.​

5 minutes later, our names are called again. "You're on. We're checking your bags." "How will we get our bags in DFW?" They are "Escort Tagged". They will be brought up the jet bridge in DFW with strollers and wheel chairs. "OK, cool". All middle seats in coach, my favorite! We push at 7:33, 23 minutes late. Critical flight canceled and another D+23... We arrive in DFW A+8...​

On a side note, our crew breakfasts were not provided on the deadhead, so we hadn't eaten since the night prior. ​

Our departure back to SFO was scheduled at 12:40, so we figured AA had the flight boarded and ready. We are standing on the jetbridge waiting for our bags. Passengers are deplaning. They're done. The crew leaves and another shows up. Still no bags. Oh , and no keys or vests to go find our bags. We wait. After all, baggage handlers know how to do their jobs, and it's not my job to prod everybody along. We're all highly trained professionals. They board the next flight so we clear the jetbridge into the gate area. They finish and the agent asks us what's going on. We tell her the story. She goes to check. At that time, almost an hour after we arrived, crew tracking calls. "Why aren't you at the next flight?" Captain tells her our story. Here we are. No bags, no manuals, no keys, no nothing. Oh and by the way, we haven't eaten since last night. Tracking says nourishment's hotels and limos' arena. ​

Tracking calls back. She called the ramp manager. The ramp manager gave her the crew chief's cell phone number. She asked the chief about our bags with the "Escort Tags" on them. He told her no way was he going to carry them up the jetbridge stairs so he left them on the ramp. After a while, he took them to baggage claim. She said he was ****ed. We told her that's fine, just have them delivered to the departure gate, which did board on time, ready to go at 12:40. It's now 13:40-ish. ​

Nobody can deliver our "escort bags" to the new gate, so we go outside security and grab 'em. Come back through security in D, catch the train over to C and to the new gate. No agent, door shut. (Remember when a key would allow us to get to the jet? Not my problem anymore.) Screw it. I walk to McDonald's. Did I mention we hadn't eaten since the night before and it's 14:00 now?. I get back to the gate. The captain's studying the 18-foot-long flight plan. The agent lets me down the jetbridge. ​

Upon entering the jet, the flight attendant says, "Can you make a PA and tell these passengers why you're late?" She's standing next to a first class passenger in the galley. I say, "Well hi there, I'm Bill. How are you?" Eyeballing my little McDonald's bag, she says, "I'm not getting paid, we boarded over an hour ago, and I can't get off to get food like you have." "Hey I'm sorry, we haven't eaten since yesterday. We deadheaded in and AA lost our bags." I look at the passenger and say, "Hey there, how are you? Can you believe AA would lose our luggage?" He understood and was in a good mood. No problem with him. Just the FA.​

I walk around the jet. The captain comes down and we start making our nests. "Cabin's ready." SLAM. Ahhhh, peace behind the cockpit door. I've come to really like that door over the years. We're loading the box, flipping switches, all that cool stuff we do before we get paid. DING, DING. Captain answers, Yes? "Why aren't we moving yet?" Well, we just got here. Now we're running all those checklists we do before we go fly. A few minutes later, DING, DING. Yess? "Can you make a PA and tell these passengers why we're still sitting here?" I'm not making this up.​

Finally time to push. 14:50 local. D+130 minutes. BANG. The tow bar breaks. DING, DING. Yesss? "What was that??" Don't worry about it. We have it under control. Please let us do our jobs. MX inspects the jet. No problem. Meanwhile, the agent lets PAX off - without their bags... We can't leave without them. We finally push at 15:52 local. D+192.​



After the flight, one of the passenger got in the captain's face as he was deplaning, pointed his finger in his face and said, "You're a THUG! A union THUG! The captain replied, "Sir, you don't know me, but I assure you I'm nothing like that." Yes you ARE! A union THUG! and left.​

Maintenance came on and asked who the thug is. Captain fessed up. He laughed. Then he talked about a flight that canceled this morning because the crew "wrote up 19 items 20 minutes before departure". He got a bull[Content Deleted] look from the captain. Then he said, "Of course, the jet did sit here all night with our night shift."​

We get to the hotel and on the elevator. A guy says, "Hey, you're not the pilots that just came in from Dallas..." We braced and admitted it. No punches, but he said, "We heard you went to lunch before coming to the plane." He knows that not to be true now.​


The hardest part about this day was refraining from repeatedly stepping into the other departments and telling fellow employees what needs to be done. It is engrained in usto anticipate and fix problems we see coming. Once I overcame the urge to tell others how to do their jobs, it actually became quite entertaining to watch the operation.​

My advice to you is to not let the frustration of watching others without guidance raise your blood pressure, but to embrace the comedy of errors that ensues. ​

Do your job. No one else's. Do not tell others what needs to be done. Do not continually follow up.​
You called MX once. They are aware. No need to stress them out. The agent told you to sit down. She knows you're there. Don't stress her out. Roll with the flow. They're all highly-trained professionals. ​

It's a hard habit to break.​

That make a good movie.

EMBFlyer
10-21-2018, 11:28 AM
Someone should forward that to Isom. Or a CP at least. It's so true. I haven't had that many things go wrong but if we just did our jobs this whole place would fall apart. Even more than it has.

I want this place to succeed, I just don't think managment does. Their goal is to collect their bonus and GTFO before it implodes.

That was during September to Remember in 2012.

Arado 234
10-21-2018, 11:37 AM
I enjoyed the read.

Cheddar
10-22-2018, 02:30 AM
It hasnít gotten any better. I love my job, enjoy flying with 99% of the people I work with and really like getting paid... but this place is a disaster.

We have middle managers that are flat out incompetent, and lie to cover. We have mostly good CPs, but they donít have the tools to fix things and cannot seemingly call out other departments for their incompetence or falsehoods.

CS is a *******show, and is run by some self admitted pilot-haters.

I used to think ďthis management teamĒ actually wanted to run an airline (yes, I was optimistic) and maybe they do - but apparently have no idea how. We are continually told we donít matter, and they know more than the folks on the ground. I had no idea you could manage to p*ss off your frontline employees so quickly. Ok. Whatever.

Where before you had enthusiasm and optimism, you have apathy and disillusionment. The CEO canít even follow up and get our pay sheets legible. A promise from two years ago. Everything is an empty promise - to the employees and our customers.

They. Donít. Care. About. Us.

All I can hope for is Wall Street gets sick of us and the board puts in a team with vision and competence.

Regardless, Iíll be as safe and professional as I can. I will trust others to do so. If they canít, Iíll watch with a bemused look on my face and keep drinking my coffee. Otherwise, Iíll say it in the nicest way possible: FUPM




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