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View Full Version : What Would You Do Different?


Tanker Biff
12-24-2018, 07:47 AM
For those folks who have been with the company long enough to feel comfortable sharing, what would you do differently if you were starting today, based on all the knowledge you have acquired thus far? Were there some mistakes you made in the beginning? Are there some great tricks you picked up along the way that could have helped you when you started?


MySaabStory
12-24-2018, 07:56 AM
For those folks who have been with the company long enough to feel comfortable sharing, what would you do differently if you were starting today, based on all the knowledge you have acquired thus far? Were there some mistakes you made in the beginning? Are there some great tricks you picked up along the way that could have helped you when you started?

I would go back in time and take the job offer at America West instead of holding out for AA. I would be a hell of a lot more senior.

In all seriousness...this industry is impossible to predict. Itís all about timing, a lot of luck, right place / right time with a pinch or skill and personality.

PRS Guitars
12-24-2018, 08:19 AM
Are you joining us? My advice is, after IOE is complete, and youíre comfortable on the line, your main job is to learn the contract & PBS. Read everything you can about PBS, read the PBS reports and learn about coverage days, how they work, where you fall. Iím amazed at the number of pilots that donít know how to bid or understand the system. Many could do better than they do.

If youíre military, you need to learn the industry, in terms of contracts, work rules etc. Understand where we sit.


Tanker Biff
12-24-2018, 08:23 AM
Are you joining us? My advice is, after IOE is complete, and youíre comfortable on the line, your main job is to learn the contract & PBS. Read everything you can about PBS, read the PBS reports and learn about coverage days, how they work, where you fall. Iím amazed at the number of pilots that donít know how to bid or understand the system. Many could do better than they do.



If youíre military, you need to learn the industry, in terms of contracts, work rules etc. Understand where we sit.



Yes, Iíll be starting in February and very excited about the shift from mil to civ flying. Thanks for the advice. Are you saying when you started you were unaware of the resources available to get up to speed on PBS and/or contract specifics?


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aggie02
12-24-2018, 09:12 AM
Are you joining us? My advice is, after IOE is complete, and youíre comfortable on the line, your main job is to learn the contract & PBS. Read everything you can about PBS, read the PBS reports and learn about coverage days, how they work, where you fall. Iím amazed at the number of pilots that donít know how to bid or understand the system. Many could do better than they do.

If youíre military, you need to learn the industry, in terms of contracts, work rules etc. Understand where we sit.

Can you provide a little more advice on PBS? Iím a newhire, Iíve done the core and advanced learning modules on aapilots. Iíve read what I could find on the APA site. While I now have a basic understanding of PBS, I donít feel I know enough to ďworkĒ the system. Other than trial and error, do you have a recommendation for resources to learn more?

Sliceback
12-24-2018, 09:49 AM
A guy told me LiteSabre has the ability to show what trips went junior to you. If you're solving at a low Layer (1-x), and trips you thought were better are going to guys junior to you, it's time to get smarter about using PBS.

You can also look at the individual bid awards on the PBS 3XP link on APA's website. That will also show which trips went junior to you. If you see trips there that you didn't get look at your PBS constraints and try to understand why you weren't awarded those trips.

PRS Guitars
12-24-2018, 10:27 AM
Can you provide a little more advice on PBS? Iím a newhire, Iíve done the core and advanced learning modules on aapilots. Iíve read what I could find on the APA site. While I now have a basic understanding of PBS, I donít feel I know enough to ďworkĒ the system. Other than trial and error, do you have a recommendation for resources to learn more?

I donít have a magic formula, but the biggest thing is understanding how the system processes bids. Knowing your seniority and bidding realistically. That is the biggest thing, if you are 90%, youíre not getting Christmas off as a line holder most likely. So donít waste 6 layers trying to do so. I donít look to see what trips went jr to me on the pbs report. I look at where LC & LH coverage starts relative to me. Thatís on the report, but 9 out 10 guys probably donít even know about it.

Understand how reserve can be great if you bid smartly. I flew 1 trip in December, Iím done until January for example.

Send me a PM and we can discuss this after Christmas.

EMBFlyer
12-24-2018, 06:04 PM
Can you provide a little more advice on PBS? Iím a newhire, Iíve done the core and advanced learning modules on aapilots. Iíve read what I could find on the APA site. While I now have a basic understanding of PBS, I donít feel I know enough to ďworkĒ the system. Other than trial and error, do you have a recommendation for resources to learn more?

If you don't understand a function or are unsure of something, call the Help Desk! It's staffed by people that have worked with the system for over 2 years. Do not waste your time by asking a PBS question on Facebook or...God forbid, C&R. You'll get 40 different answers to the same question and all of them will be wrong.

ACEssXfer
12-24-2018, 10:32 PM
I donít have a magic formula, but the biggest thing is understanding how the system processes bids. Knowing your seniority and bidding realistically. That is the biggest thing, if you are 90%, youíre not getting Christmas off as a line holder most likely. So donít waste 6 layers trying to do so. I donít look to see what trips went jr to me on the pbs report. I look at where LC & LH coverage starts relative to me. Thatís on the report, but 9 out 10 guys probably donít even know about it.

Understand how reserve can be great if you bid smartly. I flew 1 trip in December, Iím done until January for example.

Send me a PM and we can discuss this after Christmas.

Pls explain "coverage days"?

Battlinbear21
12-25-2018, 01:32 AM
Would have went to Compass in 08 😜 100% agree about learning PBS. been spending overnights trying to learn the language. Must have cracked the code, got layer 2. 5 overnights at ďhomeĒ and 17 days off w 80 creds. Still a probi goon, but bidding 50% on the 190. Seniority is by far the most important thing to me personally. Thank you to all who answered our questions on here. Somehow my trip is red today w 39 rsv. Ho Ho Ho.

ShyGuy
12-25-2018, 01:50 AM
I would have done it in July

viper548
12-25-2018, 02:43 AM
I would have moved to base sooner.

sailingfun
12-25-2018, 02:54 AM
For those folks who have been with the company long enough to feel comfortable sharing, what would you do differently if you were starting today, based on all the knowledge you have acquired thus far? Were there some mistakes you made in the beginning? Are there some great tricks you picked up along the way that could have helped you when you started?

Move to a major base and never commute!

OVBIII
12-25-2018, 03:08 AM
Move to a major base and never commute!

This holds true for me, everything else can be a crap shoot (like someone has said). BUT if you live in base itís easier to take the hard days in stride.

Clint
12-25-2018, 04:06 AM
Pls explain "coverage days"?
Coverage days are not determined until PBS runs. As senior pilots are awarded days off to the point where coverage no longer allows junior pilots to have those days off, they become coverage days. There are some bizarre algorithms that don't work in a linear method; junior pilots can sometimes get coverage days off based on bidding methods and requirements.

As to advice - I second the PBS and contract advice, as well as move to domicile ASAP. I commuted for 21 months before I was able to bid back to domicile (DFW). QOL improved exponentially when I was able to do that.

R57 relay
12-25-2018, 04:38 AM
I would have bid 727 F/O. I went for seniority and skipped it.

Because of the roller coaster state of US Air/ways finacial state I ended flying a lot of different aircraft. That I would do again. It gave me a lot of exposure to the training environment and different operating styles.

I'd worry less- it's usually not what you worry about that gets you.

I'd give my captains a little more slack when I was young.

I would get life insurance outside of the company and/or union earlier, at an amount higher than I thought I needed.

I would max out the union's disability while I was young and healthy.

Enjoy the ride, it goes by quick.

PRS Guitars
12-25-2018, 05:36 AM
Yeah, I meant to take the line out about a December reserve, forgot in my haste to post.:cool:

Cheddar
12-25-2018, 04:50 PM
I would have done it in July



Lol! Well said.


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PRS Guitars
12-26-2018, 09:22 AM
I also regret not moving to a domicile right away. Iím now contemplating a move, mainly for reasons other than the commute, but that certainly is in my decision matrix.

I wish I would have just moved to S.E. PA when I got hired onto the 190.

LIOG41
12-26-2018, 10:40 AM
Live in base. Bid the highest paying position in base when you can hold it. Save but have fun. Cause then youíre dead someday. Donít be a dick. Itís an easy job. Be smart donít overthink it. Stay in the books and donít be lazy.

A330FoodCritic
12-26-2018, 01:02 PM
Live in base. Bid the highest paying position in base when you can hold it.

Or live in base and bid the position that gives you the most days off and not be scheduling's female dog, just a thought.

ipdanno
12-26-2018, 02:00 PM
Not married that woman in 1984.

Thedude
12-26-2018, 02:19 PM
Ban all the guys that are within 5 yrs of retirement from voting on a contract.

jcountry
12-26-2018, 02:43 PM
Ban all the guys that are within 5 yrs of retirement from voting on a contract.

Now, you know.....

That idea actually has some merit.

(Not sure that 5 years is a good date, but definitely some time horizon..... Too many guys very close to retirement would literally pimp out their moms if they could.)

bigscrillywilli
12-26-2018, 03:25 PM
Why not 1 year? Canít vote your first year!!

Al Czervik
12-26-2018, 04:52 PM
Ban all the guys that are within 5 yrs of retirement from voting on a contract.

1st 5 years and last 5 years.


Actually, only guys at my exact longevity are allowed to vote.

Sliceback
12-27-2018, 05:36 AM
1st 5 years and last 5 years.


Actually, only guys at my exact longevity are allowed to vote.

And guys over 50. Or those that have been Captain a long time. Just think, in about 5 yrs only six guys would be deciding the contract.

R57 relay
12-27-2018, 07:48 AM
Or pilots with small children at home. Or millennials. Or baby boomers. Or...

DarinFred
12-27-2018, 10:14 AM
And floaters.

cocktimusprime
12-28-2018, 07:48 AM
Definitely floaters

full of luv
12-28-2018, 01:33 PM
I donít have a magic formula, but the biggest thing is understanding how the system processes bids. Knowing your seniority and bidding realistically. That is the biggest thing, if you are 90%, youíre not getting Christmas off as a line holder most likely. So donít waste 6 layers trying to do so. I donít look to see what trips went jr to me on the pbs report. I look at where LC & LH coverage starts relative to me. Thatís on the report, but 9 out 10 guys probably donít even know about it.

Understand how reserve can be great if you bid smartly. I flew 1 trip in December, Iím done until January for example.

Send me a PM and we can discuss this after Christmas.

Does your PBS offer a report that shows what everyone else bid and what they got after the results come out?

On Delta's system you can look at a "reasons" report and see everyone's bid and results and you can learn a lot from how others near your seniority bid, and what results they were able to achieve.

Clint
12-29-2018, 02:02 AM
Does your PBS offer a report that shows what everyone else bid and what they got after the results come out?

On Delta's system you can look at a "reasons" report and see everyone's bid and results and you can learn a lot from how others near your seniority bid, and what results they were able to achieve.
Each individual gets their own reason report through PBS. APA publishes PBS awards that show all pilots awards. It doesnít give a reason report, but it shows what days off they asked for, what days were coverage days, and what layer they were awarded in.