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View Full Version : 60% Failure Rate at ABX


motorclutch
01-06-2019, 09:01 AM
Sad but true. All candidates who failed required additional simulator periods and exceeded 60 hours of OE.
ABX is officially a scumbag airline. Thanks to team Soaper.


Diesel8
01-06-2019, 10:48 AM
Deleted - wrong thread

JohnBurke
01-06-2019, 11:33 AM
These were given extra sim sessions, 60+ hours of OE, and still washed out and were let go?


johnny150
01-06-2019, 12:13 PM
These were given extra sim sessions, 60+ hours of OE, and still washed out and were let go?



ABX is scrapping the bottom of the barrel, 50% of our entire pilot group is on reserve... things aren’t looking very promising


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nitefr8dog
01-06-2019, 02:52 PM
ABX is scrapping the bottom of the barrel, 50% of our entire pilot group is on reserve... things aren’t looking very promising


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Get that resume ready for Omni and ATI....get to work for JV! Yippee!

Excargodog
01-07-2019, 04:39 PM
From today’s recently updated ABX profile:

Minimums:
2,000TT, 1,000ME, 500 turbine and ATP.

Preferred minimums:
College degree.

What you need:
Unrestricted ATP (Airline Transport Rating) with an airline category multi-engine class rating 1,500 hours total fixed-wing flying time.

What you will do:
You will be flying well maintained BEoeing 767-200F and 767-300F aircraft around the world as a first officer for ABX Air. You will be a member of a team that is responsible for the safe, efficient and on-time operation of our aircraft while ensuring satifaction to our customers.

Training is held at Wilmington, OH. You will experience comprehensive training that allows us to operate in Category III B conditions. You will be supported by a team of experienced airline professionals to help you "Move the Mission." Trainee has to provide own lodging and transportation

767 FO base pay: $42,366 annually

Most Jr. 767 Captain was hired 09/06/1996

Monthly guarantee: 68 hours
Reserve guarantee: 68 hours



I mean seriously, trying to hire a 767 FO for LESS THAN entry level pay for most regionals? Not to mention the regionals are PROVIDING ATP training and giving signing bonuses of up to $17.5K. For a 68 hour guarantee at $52 to start? And an upgrade time for a newbie of....wait for it...OVER TWENTY-TWO YEARS?. :eek:

Why ever wouldn’t THAT work out?

johnny150
01-07-2019, 04:43 PM
Most all of the regionals provide far more job security then ABX. Many provide flow through. Many of the regionals are wholly owned.


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OhSnapAF
01-07-2019, 05:05 PM
Sad but true. All candidates who failed required additional simulator periods and exceeded 60 hours of OE.
ABX is officially a scumbag airline. Thanks to team Soaper.

The pay and work rules made ABX a scumbag airline, long ago...

EndOfTimes
01-07-2019, 05:21 PM
Yes, sadly, we are now unquestionably a scumbag airline. When we were just a somewhat lower cost FedEx/UPS type operation it was a career airline. Now we are a great option for ambitious third world pilots. Come get a 767 type and who knows what the future holds!

motorclutch
01-07-2019, 05:30 PM
Remember Joe Hete fell in love with scumbag operations when he met Jim Basset. Hete was more than happy to pimp out his chief pilot and standards manager in order to break the strike. Every man has a price don’t they JV and MW?

EndOfTimes
01-07-2019, 05:57 PM
You have stumped me Bubba..Who is Basset? Thanks for not retiring from APC, your posts are priceless. Keep tossing that napalm!

freighthound
01-07-2019, 08:30 PM
You have stumped me Bubba..Who is Basset? Thanks for not retiring from APC, your posts are priceless. Keep tossing that napalm!

Was the owner of Amerijet when they went on strike.

No Land 3
01-08-2019, 02:59 AM
1996, was a freshman in High School. If I was hired on by ABX at that point in my life, I'd be the most junior CA today... That's seriously ducked up.

Buckinfantastic
01-08-2019, 04:16 AM
From today’s recently updated ABX profile:



I mean seriously, trying to hire a 767 FO for LESS THAN entry level pay for most regionals? Not to mention the regionals are PROVIDING ATP training and giving signing bonuses of up to $17.5K. For a 68 hour guarantee at $52 to start? And an upgrade time for a newbie of....wait for it...OVER TWENTY-TWO YEARS?. :eek:

Why ever wouldn’t THAT work out?

Don't forget you have to provide your own lodging during training in scenic, bustling Wilmington, OH!

No wonder people are washing out/leaving immediately. Voluntarily putting yourself in this position just doesn't make sense. There are plenty of better places to be.

captjns
01-08-2019, 05:40 AM
Don't forget you have to provide your own lodging during training in scenic, bustling Wilmington, OH!

No wonder people are washing out/leaving immediately. Voluntarily putting yourself in this position just doesn't make sense. There are plenty of better places to be.

Why waste the cyberspace in completing an application knowing you’ve got to pay for your own accomodations? Pay... or do new hires have to pay an honorarium for the privilege of working for such a prestigious mob?

gumpscheck
01-08-2019, 12:00 PM
1996, was a freshman in High School. If I was hired on by ABX at that point in my life, I'd be the most junior CA today... That's seriously ducked up.

You are making me feel old! Never mind, I am old.

Reactivity
01-08-2019, 12:13 PM
The pay and work rules made ABX a scumbag airline, long ago...

Check your facts. You're exaggerating badly.

If our work rules made us a "scumbag airline", I seriously doubt management would be trying to get us to give them up. ABX does not have the highest pay rates thanks to the new contracts at Kalitta and ATI (pay and work rules being a major sticking point in current negotiations - we could have an ATI-like contract if we wanted to cave on all of that), but they're also not the lowest. For the same position and longevity, Atlas has lower rates with a lower guarantee.

ACMItrash
01-13-2019, 11:43 PM
How many busted out this month with a failed type?

nitefr8dog
01-14-2019, 06:38 AM
How many busted out this month with a failed type?
0...................

B727DRVR
01-14-2019, 01:02 PM
Hey Clutch,

I know that I have asked this before on the ABX forum, but this isn't anything new. You guys referred to the ABX Training Department in the 90's and early 2000's as the "Aryan Brotherhood"..., with failure rates so high, the FAA suposedly looked into why...

Are these guys back?:eek:

Reactivity
01-14-2019, 01:53 PM
You guys referred to the ABX Training Department in the 90's and early 2000's as the "Aryan Brotherhood"..., with failure rates so high, the FAA suposedly looked into why...

Are these guys back?:eek:

It's not the training. The training is fine. It's mostly the same people who were doing the training when I went through it just a few years ago.

The problem is the trainees. They now tend to be low time, inexperienced, without the level of skill necessary to succeed, and our training department isn't going to dilute the training or pass them simply for the sake of getting bodies on line.

motorclutch
01-14-2019, 03:36 PM
No it’s a new issue. Quality cut. We are becoming a “third world” training center. Hell one guy they hired had been flying a total of two years. He’s gone now, altering his logbooks. But the point is....this is what HR is hiring. Soapy and Flugelmeister have destroyed this place.

ACMItrash
01-19-2019, 12:29 AM
Sounds like more flying will be lost maybe it won't matter if they can't hire and wash out pilots. Do they give them the opportunity to resign or are they fired?

MarkThyme
01-19-2019, 03:27 AM
Sounds like more flying will be lost

What, specifically, are you referring to?

atpcliff
01-19-2019, 10:30 PM
It's not the training. The training is fine. It's mostly the same people who were doing the training when I went through it just a few years ago.

The problem is the trainees. They now tend to be low time, inexperienced, without the level of skill necessary to succeed, and our training department isn't going to dilute the training or pass them simply for the sake of getting bodies on line.

If your airline needs pilots, and the pass rate in training is too low, then training needs to be adopted to fit your new hire experience level. If you are getting the numbers you need online with a high failure rate, then it is not a (short term) problem.

My airline needs more pilots online, and we have adjusted our training to match our new hire experience level a number of times.

nitefr8dog
01-20-2019, 03:23 AM
If your airline needs pilots, and the pass rate in training is too low, then training needs to be adopted to fit your new hire experience level. If you are getting the numbers you need online with a high failure rate, then it is not a (short term) problem.

My airline needs more pilots online, and we have adjusted our training to match our new hire experience level a number of times.
Pretty sure they have dumbed down training in the last few yrs as much as they are willing to.....would probably rather let someone else roll one up in a ball.

motorclutch
01-20-2019, 05:17 AM
See you at the NTSB hearing.

nitefr8dog
01-20-2019, 06:40 AM
See you at the NTSB hearing.

Hopefully not us....like Cliff said....they have made multiple changes to accommodate new hires that don't know how to fly...ABX just cans them...

ACMItrash
01-29-2019, 01:49 AM
Hopefully not us....like Cliff said....they have made multiple changes to accommodate new hires that don't know how to fly...ABX just cans them...

You would think the sim ride in the interview would wash them out before they come to training and bust! Having a bust on your record makes it harder to get a real job. All training records are sent to any potential employer!

B727DRVR
02-05-2019, 08:21 AM
Thanks for that update...

I remember hearing about high failure rates at ABX in the ‘90’s, but it sounds like this is for different reasons. Best of luck to you guys and I hope things smooth out for you all..

ACMItrash
03-03-2019, 12:31 AM
Thanks for that update...

I remember hearing about high failure rates at ABX in the ‘90’s, but it sounds like this is for different reasons. Best of luck to you guys and I hope things smooth out for you all..
One can only hope.



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