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View Full Version : Realistic FO salary at Netjets


Wipeout
02-21-2019, 03:58 PM
Hey guys. I am a previous corporate (part 91) pilot that a year and a half ago left for the regionals. I am about to upgrade here at PSA but am curious about netjets. I really enjoyed that type of flying. What is a realistic salary plus soft time number for a first year FO at netjets? I would plan on the 7&7 schedule. Thanks for any insight that can be provided.


jetlag7
02-21-2019, 04:23 PM
Hey guys. I am a previous corporate (part 91) pilot that a year and a half ago left for the regionals. I am about to upgrade here at PSA but am curious about netjets. I really enjoyed that type of flying. What is a realistic salary plus soft time number for a first year FO at netjets? I would plan on the 7&7 schedule. Thanks for any insight that can be provided.Accounting for overtime and holidays, adding 10% to base salary should get you in the ballpark.

The FDPP program is still relatively new, but number-crunching flight and duty-times from past and present activity for myself and a few of my colleagues suggests an additional $15,000 - $30,000 seems to be a realistic average.

For a Year 1 FO on 7/7:

Salary: $63,814
+ 10%: $70,195
+ FDPP: $85,195 - $100,195

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

Guard
02-21-2019, 05:29 PM
Accounting for overtime and holidays, adding 10% to base salary should get you in the ballpark.

The FDPP program is still relatively new, but number-crunching flight and duty-times from past and present activity for myself and a few of my colleagues suggests an additional $15,000 - $30,000 seems to be a realistic average.

For a Year 1 FO on 7/7:

Salary: $63,814
+ 10%: $70,195
+ FDPP: $85,195 - $100,195

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

This is what Union and Chief Pilot are pitching, if your on Latitude or other "very heavily used fleet" you can probably go a little hire to $110K!


jetlag7
02-21-2019, 06:02 PM
This is what Union and Chief Pilot are pitching, if your on Latitude or other "very heavily used fleet" you can probably go a little hire to $110K!You are correct - some fleets earn more than others.

The OP asked for realistic first year SALARY -- not Total Compensation. Only 67% of FDPP is applied to salary (the rest to retirement) -- I was being conservative to account for this.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

MWilliams
02-21-2019, 06:13 PM
You are correct - some fleets earn more than others.

The OP asked for realistic first year SALARY -- not Total Compensation. Only 67% of FDPP is applied to salary (the rest to retirement) -- I was being conservative to account for this.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

I think you are in the ballpark for year one 7/7. Also remember the first 60-90 (indoc/initial/IOE) days of employment will be paid on the CC72 payscale.

Guard
02-22-2019, 04:46 AM
I think you are in the ballpark for year one 7/7. Also remember the first 60-90 (indoc/initial/IOE) days of employment will be paid on the CC72 payscale.

I've been waiting to go on IOE for over 2 months, very backed up on my fleet!

metro3
02-22-2019, 05:22 AM
I've been waiting to go on IOE for over 2 months, very backed up on my fleet!

Guard,

What fleet are you on?

Wipeout
02-22-2019, 10:13 AM
Thanks for all the replies guys. I will definitely do a bit more digging but it sounds like a pretty good deal despite the long upgrade times. Thanks again

Guard
02-24-2019, 11:42 PM
Guard,

What fleet are you on?

Latitude fleet

H8theReds
01-22-2020, 12:38 PM
How does commute work? Does company buy you a positive space ticket?

Flyfalcons
01-22-2020, 12:42 PM
Yes. Your responsibility is to get to your base by the briefed time on day 1. Company takes over from there.

Retractable
01-22-2020, 02:10 PM
Yes. Your responsibility is to get to your base by the briefed time on day 1. Company takes over from there.


That being said... thereís a ton of bases.

Hereís whatís listed for bases on the APC NJA profile...

DOMICILES
BED
ATL
AUS
BDL
BTV
BUF
BWI
CHS
CLE
CLT
CMH
COS
CVG
DAL
DCA
DEN
DFW
DRO
DSM
DTW
ELP
EWR
BIL
BOI
BOS
GRR
GSO
GSP
HOU
HPN
IAD
FAR
FSD
GEG
ABQ
BHM
ICT
ILM
IND
JAC
JAN
JAX
LAS
LAX
LGA
LIT
MAF
MCI
MCO
MDW
MEM
MFR
MHT
MIA
MKE
MLI
MSY
OKC
OMA
MSP
PBI
PDX
ORF
PDK
BNA
PHL
PHX
PIT
PNS
PSP
PVD
PWM
RIC
RAP
RDU
RNO
ROC
RSW
SAN
ORD
SAT
SAV
SDF
SEA
SFO
SGF
SHV
SJC
SMF
SNA
STL
SYR
TEB
TLH
TPA
TUL
TUS
TYS
VNY

C2078
01-22-2020, 08:08 PM
That being said... thereís a ton of bases.

Hereís whatís listed for bases on the APC NJA profile...

DOMICILES
BED
ATL
AUS
BDL
BTV
BUF
BWI
CHS
CLE
CLT
CMH
COS
CVG
DAL
DCA
DEN
DFW
DRO
DSM
DTW
ELP
EWR
BIL
BOI
BOS
GRR
GSO
GSP
HOU
HPN
IAD
FAR
FSD
GEG
ABQ
BHM
ICT
ILM
IND
JAC
JAN
JAX
LAS
LAX
LGA
LIT
MAF
MCI
MCO
MDW
MEM
MFR
MHT
MIA
MKE
MLI
MSY
OKC
OMA
MSP
PBI
PDX
ORF
PDK
BNA
PHL
PHX
PIT
PNS
PSP
PVD
PWM
RIC
RAP
RDU
RNO
ROC
RSW
SAN
ORD
SAT
SAV
SDF
SEA
SFO
SGF
SHV
SJC
SMF
SNA
STL
SYR
TEB
TLH
TPA
TUL
TUS
TYS
VNY

One of the best, if not the best feature of the job, no doubt. Oh, you forgot Hewittís DAB 😉

C2078
01-22-2020, 08:53 PM
For the new folks or the potential new folks, this would be my advice. First of all, money isnít everything, but, after doing a very comprehensive financial analysis this past week, man, the numbers are staggering. One simple example. I left as a
mid 40ís topped out Captain for Brown. Conducted a side by side analysis of retirement scenarios. One key item makes the comparison completely lopsided (from a financial point of view), the Defined Benefit (AKA the pension). When I retire at 65, counting on a slashed SS benefit (figuring 50% of what my benefit will be due to crooked politicians) and my pension, I will BARELY have to touch my 401k, should be able to withdraw only the interest generated, leaving my capital intact, if I so choose. I had a healthy 401k when I left NJ, but when you want to receive 75% of your pre retirement income during retirement (the minimum most financial planners recommend), the 401k will get depleted way more rapidly.

If under 40, a big 6 is the way to go (Fedex, Brown, SW, and the 3 Legacies), but especially Fedex and Brown. Walking away with a $100k/year pension is simply unmatched. If you can put in 30 years, Delta is a compelling job. The DC is about the same with others, but the PS and cash over cap will grow rapidly if you have enough time. All this assuming things are like they are today.

NJ has many good things, fly from home, decent pay, good benefits, interesting flying, etc. And some simply do not like the airlines, valid point. Even before I had started applying to Fedex and Brown, I had not done such a detailed analysis as the one done this week, including not only pay but the entire scope of the job. Pay for a new guy is not even remotely close, but for a Captain wanting to jump ship, no doubt that is a much harder decision. Schedule, well, that is also not remotely close. Not as far as days worked but as in manipulation. On 7/7 you have very limited options, on CC you pray to get your preferences. At Brown, I bid something fairly close to what I want and have high success trading/moving trips to fit my needs. Jumpseating is another invaluable element. Some
people like predictability, others love not knowing what they are doing in the next 24 hours, no right or wrong answer. I used to love winging it every day, not so much as I got older. I enjoy knowing I am going to have dinner at X restaurant in 2 weeks, for example. But this may not be important to some.

So for the new guys, if itís money you are after, itís not even a fair fight. If you are looking at other things such as not having to commute, very valid point!! But beware, I flew the Phenom (AKA Phlem) for a while, trust me, you DO NOT want to get stuck in that thing for 3+ years, and that is most likely where you will start, if you donít fit out (yes, some have been getting other fleets, but plan for worst case scenario). You will develop hunchback syndrome 😳.

Posted on this thread as it pertains to potential job seekers.

Retractable
01-23-2020, 12:33 AM
Your post really has zero to do with NetJets and should be moved by moderators.

C2078
01-23-2020, 04:50 AM
It has everything to do with folks considering going to NetJets, or FOís currently there, and the options available to them. You may not like what I wrote, but it is completely relevant to this thread. Suppressing information wonít change the facts.

Retractable
01-23-2020, 05:25 AM
It has everything to do with folks considering going to NetJets, or FOís currently there, and the options available to them. You may not like what I wrote, but it is completely relevant to this thread. Suppressing information wonít change the facts.


C2078,

Iíve said all along that Iím happy for any perceived success that a pilot experiences when leaving NetJets for greener pastures. Iíve also been in this business long enough to know that ďgreenerĒ is a very subjective thing that time has ultimate control over.

A few thoughts to ponder.

1) UPS likes NetJets pilots. Everyone who they hired from NetJets worked somewhere else prior, yet those same pilots werenít hired until now. The experience gained here is something UPS likes. Logically, your intent to steer prospective pilots FROM NetJets is steering them AWAY from UPS. If you believe UPS to be the end all be all of career destinations, why would you steer prospectives away in this manner?

2) Where do you think the robots will be installed first?

It certainly wonít be here at NetJets.

With all of the places we go and all of the service that is required by and expected by our Owners, no robot will ever replace us. Now THATíS job security. UPS management tolerates the pilots. Actually, they hate you. The labor management relationship is toxic at UPS. The first chance they have to replace one pilot in the cockpit or both, theyíll be the first. Look at the drone division UPS just began... not only is it staffed and running, they went so far as to make news by showcasing female captains theyíve recruited for it (nothing against female pilots at all, but to make the news headline by showcasing that instead of drones is very creative). They WANT to make the news splash. They are drooling at the opportunity to replace that line item cost called labor.

Get that money while you can. If they half the pilots required with some enhanced auto flight system called Hal 2000, your upgrade will be short lived and your career earnings there greatly minimized.

C2078
01-23-2020, 05:54 AM
I am pretty sure I mentioned big 6, not only UPS. Brown emphasized only because I have a bit better perspective.

Yes, management only has us because they need us, not because they like us. Having said that, do you think AJ, Alan, Sean actually care about you?

While I do think cargo will start single pilot and/or pilotless operations before pax, the one point not many people talk about is the type of aircraft the cargo world flies vs pax. Cargo tends to operate older planes, with decades old technologies, 2nd hand birds. Adapting these planes to single pilot/pilotless operation will be nearly impossible. Now, newer planes which are much more automated might be easier. We shall see!!

Again, my post was not meant to bash NJ, that is why I mentioned money isnít everything. There are other intangibles that people value, which are completely legitimate. I do think people make better decisions when they have ALL the info in front of them. After that, you make it and live with it. I have no doubt I would be happy at NJ if still there (at least happier then when I left, I was miserable), questioned my decision big time first few months. Now looking back, one regret is not having started earlier pursuing this job.

NetJets seems to be doing well, on solid financial footing, having righted the ship after near collapse, many tough financial decisions had to be made. Very happy for my many friends still there. Potential new hires should have it pretty good going forward.

My only point, and this being a thread for potential new folks, look at ALL your options consider ALL the variables, donít focus on just one element. Money, schedules and flexibility, commuting, aircraft, vacation, retirement, etc. Among the several points I was trying to make, and PURELY from a financial point of view, I stand by my opinion, mo comparison whatsoever. And from another point of view, aircraft (very high likelihood of getting assigned Phenom), I also stand by my opinion, as I do have direct knowledge, the plane is very uncomfortable and it was miserable. First airplane EVER I had to see a chiropractor on a consistent basis. I did several coast to coast trips with a stop mid country somewhere, 6:30-7 hours in the cockpit with a quick fuel stop, I was trash after. No way you do this, have a 10-11 hour rest period and right back at it. I personally had to fatigue after those days.

DH2time
01-23-2020, 06:09 AM
C2078,

Iíve said all along that Iím happy for any perceived success that a pilot experiences when leaving NetJets for greener pastures. Iíve also been in this business long enough to know that ďgreenerĒ is a very subjective thing that time has ultimate control over.

A few thoughts to ponder.

1) UPS likes NetJets pilots. Everyone who they hired from NetJets worked somewhere else prior, yet those same pilots werenít hired until now. The experience gained here is something UPS likes. Logically, your intent to steer prospective pilots FROM NetJets is steering them AWAY from UPS. If you believe UPS to be the end all be all of career destinations, why would you steer prospectives away in this manner?

2) Where do you think the robots will be installed first?

It certainly wonít be here at NetJets.

With all of the places we go and all of the service that is required by and expected by our Owners, no robot will ever replace us. Now THATíS job security. UPS management tolerates the pilots. Actually, they hate you. The labor management relationship is toxic at UPS. The first chance they have to replace one pilot in the cockpit or both, theyíll be the first. Look at the drone division UPS just began... not only is it staffed and running, they went so far as to make news by showcasing female captains theyíve recruited for it (nothing against female pilots at all, but to make the news headline by showcasing that instead of drones is very creative). They WANT to make the news splash. They are drooling at the opportunity to replace that line item cost called labor.

Get that money while you can. If they half the pilots required with some enhanced auto flight system called Hal 2000, your upgrade will be short lived and your career earnings there greatly minimized.

some thoughts to ponder

1) NJA owes is success to a tax plan that is always evolving. The Bonus/Accelerated depreciation schedulers. The Capital Asset depreciation schedules, etc etc etc. NJA has its growth and itís survival based on rich people being able to subsidize their ďtoysĒ on the back of the taxpayers. There is a greater chance of the tax law changing than ANY change to automation completely taking over the cockpit anytime soon. Current tax plan is unsustainable so it will change, the question is how much and what parts.

2) NJA has not demonstrated to anyone the ability to weather a financial downturn. They almost went under in 2009 with losses of almost 1B in one year. Since then things have improved but we are in the tail end of a growth cycle, it will change and then we will see if the untested NJA model will survive.

3.) Once Uncle Warren dies what happens to his empire? NJA stayed because Warren has a soft spot for aviation. Itís the glamour he craves in the industry. NJA is a laggard in his portfolio but he has been able to keep the investors at bay as he is Uncle Warren. Will Greg Able keep it? Who knows?

So much more to life than just money. I didnít leave NJA cause of money, though the majors pay a TON more for the same amount of work. I left because of the toxic culture and the degrading QOL at NJA. I left because life is about enjoyment and for me NJA wasnít cutting it. I post on here just to keep the Bartender honest, something he doesnít like to do often enough.

NJA isnít a bad job but itís a tough career. Itís waking up at 0430 for a 0500 show then on duty for 11 hours only comprising of 2 legs. Loading bags, and donít think you can buy off the rampers to do it all the time. Loading catering. Picking up after people. Emptying trash. Arranging fuel and toilet service etc etc etc. it isnít hard but itís time consuming and after day 6 you will be tired and irritable. Havenít seen your wife and kids in a week. Now multiply that by 25 years, do you want to be doing it at age 65? Thatís your choice and only your choice.

My point is donít look at Bartenders jaded posts as the end all be all. Itís his perspective. He lucked out in a lot of ways. Bought his first 121 gig at Gulfstream, hired on at a major, furloughed (thus his bitterness), went to NJA during the hiring boom. Upgraded quickly and even got a super midsized cabin for a bit out of seniority order. Itís been a charmed life for him, well except the Philly speeding incident, but a charmed life for him at NJA.

Flyfalcons
01-23-2020, 06:36 AM
Wow I had no idea that UPS pays more than NJA; thank you for shining a light on the truth - an answer to the question that no one thought to ask. I mean, of course the answer to a basing question at NJA is that UPS pilots get paid more. You just gotta think fourth dimensionally, Marty!

Fredturbo
01-23-2020, 06:53 AM
Simply one data point but guy I met at a party in LA last week is a 2015 hire A320 FO. The topic of profit share came up. He said with his $195K in salary, he would make about 30K in profit share plus $5K in profit share 401k match. This was in addition to $30K in straight 401k match ($65K total in company $$$$). Said he gets most weekends off as well. Not sure about how many days he flew to get all that scratch, however. He also did say he gets First class about 1/2 the time with his family when they fly to Europe.

Flyfalcons
01-23-2020, 07:27 AM
I guess the answer to any NJA-related question now is, "This how how much someone makes elsewhere". :confused:

Fredturbo
01-23-2020, 07:37 AM
I guess the answer to any NJA-related question now is, "This how how much someone makes elsewhere". :confused:
Now you are getting it.

Flyfalcons
01-23-2020, 08:20 AM
Well thank goodness you're here to educate, Fred. I imagine people have a very difficult time finding that information otherwise.

DH2time
01-23-2020, 12:19 PM
Well thank goodness you're here to educate, Fred. I imagine people have a very difficult time finding that information otherwise.


Well it is hard to get the correct info. We have guys asking questions and a bartender continues to lie. Now the moderator has stated many times itís not his job to fact check, fair enough, so that means the ones who want the truth to be seen have to follow up and clean up after the bartender and set the record straight.

MWilliams
01-23-2020, 12:44 PM
Well it is hard to get the correct info. We have guys asking questions and a bartender continues to lie. Now the moderator has stated many times itís not his job to fact check, fair enough, so that means the ones who want the truth to be seen have to follow up and clean up after the bartender and set the record straight.

What years did you fly for NetJets or are you still there?

avi8er
01-23-2020, 01:23 PM
Itís very interesting to see all these posts in the fractional world. There are no bickering in any other company posts except for NetJets. Why is that? Seems like guys interested in OX Jets, flex Jets ect are more cordial and actual helpful. Also, I notice it seems to be one Particular poster against everyone else.

Flyfalcons
01-23-2020, 01:55 PM
Well it is hard to get the correct info. We have guys asking questions and a bartender continues to lie. Now the moderator has stated many times itís not his job to fact check, fair enough, so that means the ones who want the truth to be seen have to follow up and clean up after the bartender and set the record straight.
was there a lie involved when answering a question about basing here? Or maybe someone asked about how much one can make at UPS? Because I may have missed that, so help me out here.

Retractable
01-24-2020, 03:03 AM
some thoughts to ponder

1) NJA owes is success to a tax plan that is always evolving. The Bonus/Accelerated depreciation schedulers. The Capital Asset depreciation schedules, etc etc etc. NJA has its growth and itís survival based on rich people being able to subsidize their ďtoysĒ on the back of the taxpayers. There is a greater chance of the tax law changing than ANY change to automation completely taking over the cockpit anytime soon. Current tax plan is unsustainable so it will change, the question is how much and what parts.

2) NJA has not demonstrated to anyone the ability to weather a financial downturn. They almost went under in 2009 with losses of almost 1B in one year. Since then things have improved but we are in the tail end of a growth cycle, it will change and then we will see if the untested NJA model will survive.

3.) Once Uncle Warren dies what happens to his empire? NJA stayed because Warren has a soft spot for aviation. Itís the glamour he craves in the industry. NJA is a laggard in his portfolio but he has been able to keep the investors at bay as he is Uncle Warren. Will Greg Able keep it? Who knows?

So much more to life than just money. I didnít leave NJA cause of money, though the majors pay a TON more for the same amount of work. I left because of the toxic culture and the degrading QOL at NJA. I left because life is about enjoyment and for me NJA wasnít cutting it. I post on here just to keep the Bartender honest, something he doesnít like to do often enough.

NJA isnít a bad job but itís a tough career. Itís waking up at 0430 for a 0500 show then on duty for 11 hours only comprising of 2 legs. Loading bags, and donít think you can buy off the rampers to do it all the time. Loading catering. Picking up after people. Emptying trash. Arranging fuel and toilet service etc etc etc. it isnít hard but itís time consuming and after day 6 you will be tired and irritable. Havenít seen your wife and kids in a week. Now multiply that by 25 years, do you want to be doing it at age 65? Thatís your choice and only your choice.

My point is donít look at Bartenders jaded posts as the end all be all. Itís his perspective. He lucked out in a lot of ways. Bought his first 121 gig at Gulfstream, hired on at a major, furloughed (thus his bitterness), went to NJA during the hiring boom. Upgraded quickly and even got a super midsized cabin for a bit out of seniority order. Itís been a charmed life for him, well except the Philly speeding incident, but a charmed life for him at NJA.


Of youíre asking me...

1) NJA has been very successful defending its interests against unfair taxation. Iím sure that trend will continue on the front side of legislation and the back side of decisions. To worry about taxes is to worry about the next rainstorm. The question is ďdo you have an umbrellaĒ?

2) The next downturn is already on the books for some future unknown date. Staffing, Owner agreements and fleet plans/acquisitions have been structured accordingly to avoid layoffs like were seen in the time period you mentioned. Frankly, if I were at Delta Or American, I would t want to be on the bottom 2,000 when it comes... Or the next 2000 who would become reacquainted with reserve and commuting. At NetJets, the plan for the next downturn began as soon as the recovery from 2009. I wonít get into specifics but if NetJets needed to retract into a recession mode to accommodate new Owner flying patterns, it simply would draw in a predetermined number of flying hours, retire some of the ďoldest of the newĒ jets early and FDP would dry up. Staff will he maintained.

3) Regarding Warren... heís never truly been ďhands onĒ at NetJets but it is fun to see him comment on NetJets and various other BRK companies. Heís getting on in the years, it true but the structure of his successorship has been in place for the better part of the same decade were discussing. I have zero worries about this new BRK management structure getting along with, understanding and supporting our CEO and company.


The rest of your drama is mostly inaccurate or diatribe. Readers should take them with a huge grain of salt.

When the best downturn does come, good luck to you.

Retractable
01-24-2020, 03:10 AM
Well it is hard to get the correct info. We have guys asking questions and a bartender continues to lie. Now the moderator has stated many times itís not his job to fact check, fair enough, so that means the ones who want the truth to be seen have to follow up and clean up after the bartender and set the record straight.


And again, because you donít agree, that doesnít mean the information is a lie.

You simply disagree.... but when the conversation turn to personal attack, you only prove your argument is thin and invalid. Thank you for that. Bruh. ;)

Retractable
01-24-2020, 03:15 AM
Itís very interesting to see all these posts in the fractional world. There are no bickering in any other company posts except for NetJets. Why is that? Seems like guys interested in OX Jets, flex Jets ect are more cordial and actual helpful. Also, I notice it seems to be one Particular poster against everyone else.


Great Question!

The negativity from a small number of former employees who have made it there personal mission to ďsave the worldĒ for other pilots considering employment at NetJets has simply become silly. Iím happy to provide my perspective that is not negative to allow others to make informed decisions. Most of us are pretty well adjusted, hard working and loyal employees who just come to work and do our jobs.

Then thereís the contingent of former pilots who have moved on to various places who still, years later, return to attack and smear the company and the thousands who work here because they feel itís helpful to them in some sort of cosmic or personal way.

All we do is wish them luck with their choices as this economic cycle is currently in an up mode... but what goes up... well...

AntiPeter
01-24-2020, 05:35 AM
Great Question!

The negativity from a small number of former employees who have made it there personal mission to ďsave the worldĒ for other pilots considering employment at NetJets has simply become silly. Iím happy to provide my perspective that is not negative to allow others to make informed decisions. Most of us are pretty well adjusted, hard working and loyal employees who just come to work and do our jobs.

Then thereís the contingent of former pilots who have moved on to various places who still, years later, return to attack and smear the company and the thousands who work here because they feel itís helpful to them in some sort of cosmic or personal way.

All we do is wish them luck with their choices as this economic cycle is currently in an up mode... but what goes up... well...

True, but...

I remember a lot of negativity with other aspects of the pilot group as well, not just originating with former pilots. Like everywhere, NJA has had its extreme morale swings due to circumstances outside of pilot control.

With that said, NJA pilots have their own unique culture. Iíll leave it at that. What is displayed here reminds me of what went on in the union hall, at FBOs, on the line. Itís unique to NJA from what Iíve seen, for better or worse.

I wonder to this day where the culture comes from, canít say I have any idea.

DH2time
01-24-2020, 05:52 AM
Great Question!

The negativity from a small number of former employees who have made it there personal mission to ďsave the worldĒ for other pilots considering employment at NetJets has simply become silly. Iím happy to provide my perspective that is not negative to allow others to make informed decisions. Most of us are pretty well adjusted, hard working and loyal employees who just come to work and do our jobs.

Then thereís the contingent of former pilots who have moved on to various places who still, years later, return to attack and smear the company and the thousands who work here because they feel itís helpful to them in some sort of cosmic or personal way.

All we do is wish them luck with their choices as this economic cycle is currently in an up mode... but what goes up... well...


Ah right there Bartender, you claim you do not lie, but right there you lied. Where has any pilot ďsmeared the company and thousands....Ē. Every SINGLE one of us who disagree with your conflating and general lack of truth telling have said nothing bad about the company. We disagree with your statements on income, working conditions and so on but everyone has also made sure to include at one point in time that NJA is a good job. We all in some way owe something to NJA and that has also been stated many times before but we are making sure prospective employees get the truth about NJA and not just one persons perspective.

You are not NJA and NJA is not you. Itís your employer and thatís it.

Retractable
01-24-2020, 06:17 AM
Ah right there Bartender, you claim you do not lie, but right there you lied. Where has any pilot ďsmeared the company and thousands....Ē. Every SINGLE one of us who disagree with your conflating and general lack of truth telling have said nothing bad about the company. We disagree with your statements on income, working conditions and so on but everyone has also made sure to include at one point in time that NJA is a good job. We all in some way owe something to NJA and that has also been stated many times before but we are making sure prospective employees get the truth about NJA and not just one persons perspective.

You are not NJA and NJA is not you. Itís your employer and thatís it.


No, just you and a few other negative charges, name calling individuals who have seemingly little to actually debate.

DH2time
01-24-2020, 09:34 AM
No, just you and a few other negative charges, name calling individuals who have seemingly little to actually debate.

Oh come on man. I call you Bartender, cause that is ACTUALLY what you do. You throw around name calling like itís an Olympic sport.

I have tried to engage you in debate about tax laws and the benefit NJA gets and you gloss over it and hit the Federal Excise Tax, which I never discussed to begin with. I was referring to ADS, 3 vs 5 year schedules, bonus depreciation( that for the first time allowed 50 to 100 percent depreciation for aircraft in service), MACRS, Section 280F, 1986, 2001, 2017 and other tax law changes goosing the private aircraft industry. NJA is a giant tax shelter that provides transport, RTS admitted it during interviews many times. These laws can change on a moments notice, itís a counter to your argument that the economy is going to tank Alaska or all other 121 airlines. Nothing is guaranteed in this industry and just like you like to talk about M&A in the industry and the effects it will have, tax law changes will decimate NJA and management knows it.

Retractable
01-24-2020, 02:02 PM
Oh come on man. I call you Bartender, cause that is ACTUALLY what you do. You throw around name calling like itís an Olympic sport.

I have tried to engage you in debate about tax laws and the benefit NJA gets and you gloss over it and hit the Federal Excise Tax, which I never discussed to begin with. I was referring to ADS, 3 vs 5 year schedules, bonus depreciation( that for the first time allowed 50 to 100 percent depreciation for aircraft in service), MACRS, Section 280F, 1986, 2001, 2017 and other tax law changes goosing the private aircraft industry. NJA is a giant tax shelter that provides transport, RTS admitted it during interviews many times. These laws can change on a moments notice, itís a counter to your argument that the economy is going to tank Alaska or all other 121 airlines. Nothing is guaranteed in this industry and just like you like to talk about M&A in the industry and the effects it will have, tax law changes will decimate NJA and management knows it.


Iím sorry, have I called you a name? Other than Bruh which is kind of cool...

The tax issues are being handled by some of the finest in the biz. In fact... if memory serves. Of the last tax issue, NJA won. Flex lost on the same issue.

The government isnít going to cut its nose off in spite of its face (senators and congressman traveling).

But why are you on a pilot board talking about taxes?

Letís Make the 737 Great Again!

How many MORE regulatory issues affect the airlines instead of NetJets? Answer: MANY!

DH2time
01-24-2020, 03:09 PM
Iím sorry, have I called you a name? Other than Bruh which is kind of cool...

The tax issues are being handled by some of the finest in the biz. In fact... if memory serves. Of the last tax issue, NJA won. Flex lost on the same issue.

The government isnít going to cut its nose off in spite of its face (senators and congressman traveling).

But why are you on a pilot board talking about taxes?

Letís Make the 737 Great Again!

How many MORE regulatory issues affect the airlines instead of NetJets? Answer: MANY!

Talking about taxes because NJA is uniquely exposed to tax law changes that other aviation businesses are not. You love to bash on 121s about how market forces will affect ones career BUT you gloss over the fact NJA has market forces AND tax forces that they have little control over. More of an unknown on fractional world moving forward.

Have I called you any names than Bartender? I think itís kind of cool

Retractable
01-24-2020, 04:01 PM
Talking about taxes because NJA is uniquely exposed to tax law changes that other aviation businesses are not. You love to bash on 121s about how market forces will affect ones career BUT you gloss over the fact NJA has market forces AND tax forces that they have little control over. More of an unknown on fractional world moving forward.

Have I called you any names than Bartender? I think itís kind of cool


I prefer Retractable. Mr. Retractable if youíre nasty.

91K is not at any more risk than 121 from various forms of tax. The govt makes more money from a vibrant Frac company than one handicapped by them. The IRS ultimately realizes this and gets what it wants (more) by promoting profitability and growth.

DH2time
01-24-2020, 05:48 PM
I prefer Retractable. Mr. Retractable if youíre nasty.

91K is not at any more risk than 121 from various forms of tax. The govt makes more money from a vibrant Frac company than one handicapped by them. The IRS ultimately realizes this and gets what it wants (more) by promoting profitability and growth.

IRS does not create tax laws brah. The do nothing more than enforce such laws. Tax laws are created from legislation. When the winds of politics change and the people realize the tax cuts did not make their life better, the laws will change. Uncle Warren staved off a reduction in bonus depreciation last time, but he is getting old and once gone the next guy will find it much harder to argue why a rich guy needs to be able to write off his 20M dollar airplane while everyone else is capped at a 10K SALT deduction.

Retractable
01-24-2020, 06:41 PM
IRS does not create tax laws brah. The do nothing more than enforce such laws. Tax laws are created from legislation. When the winds of politics change and the people realize the tax cuts did not make their life better, the laws will change. Uncle Warren staved off a reduction in bonus depreciation last time, but he is getting old and once gone the next guy will find it much harder to argue why a rich guy needs to be able to write off his 20M dollar airplane while everyone else is capped at a 10K SALT deduction.


Thatís why I referenced the Senate and the House a couple of posts ago. 😂

Shenzi105
01-25-2020, 05:26 AM
Oh come on man. I call you Bartender, cause that is ACTUALLY what you do. You throw around name calling like itís an Olympic sport.

I have tried to engage you in debate about tax laws and the benefit NJA gets and you gloss over it and hit the Federal Excise Tax, which I never discussed to begin with. I was referring to ADS, 3 vs 5 year schedules, bonus depreciation( that for the first time allowed 50 to 100 percent depreciation for aircraft in service), MACRS, Section 280F, 1986, 2001, 2017 and other tax law changes goosing the private aircraft industry. NJA is a giant tax shelter that provides transport, RTS admitted it during interviews many times. These laws can change on a moments notice, itís a counter to your argument that the economy is going to tank Alaska or all other 121 airlines. Nothing is guaranteed in this industry and just like you like to talk about M&A in the industry and the effects it will have, tax law changes will decimate NJA and management knows it.

I havent read you engage in any debate actually. I wish you would but from forum point of view, you have very little interest in debating with those that have different opinions and ofter revert to agressivity to try to make a point. You're not the only one of course, there's the same group of very disgruntled ones, which is fine, everyone is entitled to his/hers own opinion, but "debate" is definitely not the word that comes to mind, more like "arguing".

Shenzi105
01-25-2020, 05:33 AM
Hey guys. I am a previous corporate (part 91) pilot that a year and a half ago left for the regionals. I am about to upgrade here at PSA but am curious about netjets. I really enjoyed that type of flying. What is a realistic salary plus soft time number for a first year FO at netjets? I would plan on the 7&7 schedule. Thanks for any insight that can be provided.

It's very fleet dependent of course with Laitutde, 350 and Sovereign leading the FDP. But to give you an idea, I am on the Phenom and in January I am at $4500 in FDP and Holidays, not counting overtime, non-flight duty pay. Whatever plane, I believe that you will break $100K on the 7/7 Year 1.

Jkmsr
01-25-2020, 12:29 PM
It's very fleet dependent of course with Laitutde, 350 and Sovereign leading the FDP. But to give you an idea, I am on the Phenom and in January I am at $4500 in FDP and Holidays, not counting overtime, non-flight duty pay. Whatever plane, I believe that you will break $100K on the 7/7 Year 1.

I would say this is pretty reasonable. I am first year and looking like I will be breaking 100k without ever extending.

IslandHop
01-26-2020, 12:11 AM
How long is the application, interview, to class date process taking now-a-days?

How often are base changes allowed?

Do your paychecks get taxed based on the base you are assigned to or the state you claim residency in?

Typed and current on a P300 will this be taken into consideration when ac assignments are given out?

At what point do you receive aircraft assignment?

What has been the aircraft breakdown for classes lately?

Thanks ahead for the insight...

Retractable
01-26-2020, 05:07 AM
How long is the application, interview, to class date process taking now-a-days?

How often are base changes allowed?

Do your paychecks get taxed based on the base you are assigned to or the state you claim residency in?

Typed and current on a P300 will this be taken into consideration when ac assignments are given out?

At what point do you receive aircraft assignment?

What has been the aircraft breakdown for classes lately?

Thanks ahead for the insight...

1) Depends on a variety of factors... but Iíve heard as little as a couple of months interview to class.

2) Base changes can happen in a little as 14 days (last I heard) by use of a base change LOA

3) Taxes are based on your city/state of residency

4) AC assignments are given in class and have been Phenom 300 recently, subject to openings in other fleets such as Latitude, XLS, Sovereign, X.

5) Current class was made up of airline and corporate/frac. 66% Phenom. 33% Sovereign.

MWilliams
01-26-2020, 07:54 AM
How long is the application, interview, to class date process taking now-a-days?

Lately it has been about a 90 day process. However with the plans to hire 200 this year things can move quicker.

How often are base changes allowed?

7 days notice to change bases

Do your paychecks get taxed based on the base you are assigned to or the state you claim residency in?

Taxed is based off of the state you reside in

Typed and current on a P300 will this be taken into consideration when ac assignments are given out?

Every new hire goes through a full type rating course regardless if you are already type in the airplane you get assigned. Since November all pilot, with one exception to the XLS, have been sent to the phenom.

At what point do you receive aircraft assignment?

Last day of Basic Indoc

What has been the aircraft breakdown for classes lately?

All phenom with one XLS since November. The plan is to have other fleets assigned starting with the march class. We do have some in the hiring pool that will not fit in the Phenom.

Thanks ahead for the insight...

Answers in blue. Best of luck.

IslandHop
01-26-2020, 10:44 AM
Answers in blue. Best of luck.

Thank you for the info! Submit button here I come!

IslandHop
01-26-2020, 10:02 PM
Answers in blue. Best of luck.

One last one. Off topic sorry...

if on go home day, you would prefer to airline to another city which is a base but not your assigned base is this something that could be arranged or worked out? For example, based in MIA and I would like to end in JFK for personal reasons (I would ensure to be back at MIA for the start of my following rotation)

illinipilot
01-27-2020, 03:50 AM
One last one. Off topic sorry...

if on go home day, you would prefer to airline to another city which is a base but not your assigned base is this something that could be arranged or worked out? For example, based in MIA and I would like to end in JFK for personal reasons (I would ensure to be back at MIA for the start of my following rotation)

If traveling to a destination other than your crew base, you purchase the ticket on your own and Netjets will reimburse up to 90% of the cost of their original ticket getting you home.

IslandHop
01-27-2020, 07:30 AM
If traveling to a destination other than your crew base, you purchase the ticket on your own and Netjets will reimburse up to 90% of the cost of their original ticket getting you home.

Solid. Thank you