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View Full Version : Envoy's low wages makes the news


povertyeagle
04-21-2019, 12:11 PM
Many employees struggle to survive in low wage jobs.

“I have co-workers who are on public assistance,” said James McKnight, who works for Envoy, a subsidiary of American Airlines. “Then the more I started talking to people sure enough I found out I do have co-workers who sleep in their cars in the employee parking lot and I’m like how is that possible.”

With a starting pay of $9.48 an hour – and hours often limited to 30 or less per week – it is not unusual for Envoy employees to make as little as $15,000 to $18,000 a year.

After two decades with the company, McKnight earns $43,000 a year. He lives frugally. Takes public transportation. But he doesn’t complain. He says he is better off than most.

“We do have an underground food pantry bank,” he explained. “So, if somebody is short, somebody will bring canned goods in, I’ve brought canned goods in, I’ve brought spaghetti and stuff like that for co-workers myself.”

In a written response, Envoy said it continues to try and negotiate a new contract with its workers:

“Envoy recognizes the hard work performed by its Customer Service Agents and has negotiated meaningful compensation, benefit and job security enhancements at the bargaining table with its Agents, and will continue to negotiate in good faith until a final agreement is reached.”


https://miami.cbslocal.com/2019/04/21/mia-forgotten-workers-low-wages-poor-treatment-miami-international-airport/


Cujo665
04-21-2019, 12:31 PM
Envoy is enabled to pay low wages due to the availability of SNAP and other benefits for low income workers. Those programs were originally designed for unemployed. The biggest corporate bailout programs ever was making those social safety net programs change from serving the unemployed to “low income.”

It allowed places like Envoy to continue paying low substandard wages which increased corporate profits... and forced taxpayers to make up the wage difference with expanded social programs.

Democrats get “credit” for helping the poor, when in reality it helps the corporation by increasing their profits and allowing them to continue paying substandard wages. The corporations love social safety net programs for the same reason, it increases corporate profits which can be reinvested into the company reducing corporate taxes to zero. So, they get the benefit, without paying for it.
Without the safety nets for “Low income” employers would have been forced to raise wages to a living income long long ago.

It’s the biggest scam ever.
Corporations are happy paying lower wages and getting higher profit
Low income folks are happy because the govt “cares” about them.
Democrats are happy because the low income folks are dependent upon them to keep those programs running, keeping them in power.

Return to safety nets for unemployed only, and watch how fast employers are forced to pay a living wage. Employees gain self respect and dignity from no longer needing public assistance, employers are forced to pay realistic wages, and government and politicians aren’t as powerful anymore.

dera
04-21-2019, 01:35 PM
It’s the biggest scam ever.
Corporations are happy paying lower wages and getting higher profit
Low income folks are happy because the govt “cares” about them.
Democrats are happy because the low income folks are dependent upon them to keep those programs running, keeping them in power.



And that is why the system will never change.
Old politicians know how it works.
"We all know what needs to be done to fix it. We just don't know how to get re-elected after we've done it".


Varsity
05-01-2019, 07:48 AM
Turning a profit off government handouts and cadets parents subsidizing FO wages. :(

Voski
05-01-2019, 09:06 AM
It never ceases to amaze me the number of FOs (cadets) living at home with mom and dad. :rolleyes:

Varsity
05-01-2019, 10:22 AM
It never ceases to amaze me the number of FOs (cadets) living at home with mom and dad. :rolleyes:

In their defense. It's pretty difficult to make ends meet on envoy's $1600/month FO salary.

pitchattitude
05-01-2019, 10:36 AM
It never ceases to amaze me the number of FOs (cadets) living at home with mom and dad. :rolleyes:
That’s why Envoy works the cadet program for everything they can. Kids that live at home with no responsibilities that have never had a real job and don’t know any better.

MD-11Loader
05-01-2019, 10:52 AM
That’s why Envoy works the cadet program for everything they can. Kids that live at home with no responsibilities that have never had a real job and don’t know any better.

But Swayne made them a video teaching them how to pick up OT.

Voski
05-01-2019, 11:24 AM
but swayne made them a video teaching them how to pick up ot.

lololololol

SonicFlyer
05-01-2019, 11:41 AM
These numbers seem off... I'm not buying it.


But for those who believe this, why does the union let the company get away with it? :confused:

pitchattitude
05-01-2019, 12:05 PM
These numbers seem off... I'm not buying it.


But for those who believe this, why does the union let the company get away with it? :confused:

I have wondered the same thing. Class action law suit claiming false advertising? Of course we would have to wait until after it hasn’t happened to prove their numbers were wrong. I don’t know keep screen shots of the Envoy recruiting page lies?

crj700
05-01-2019, 03:06 PM
But Swayne made them a video teaching them how to pick up OT.

Is Swayne still a thing? I haven't heard or seen anything from him lately.

dera
05-01-2019, 03:40 PM
In their defense. It's pretty difficult to make ends meet on envoy's $1600/month FO salary.

1600? Where do you come up with these numbers?

On reserve, my first paycheck is around 1100. I pick up OT pretty aggressively, my last second paycheck was 2200. First year new hire FO. Thats 3300, take home, per month.

I find it hard to believe my numbers would be somehow different from normal.

Cyio
05-01-2019, 04:08 PM
1600? Where do you come up with these numbers?

On reserve, my first paycheck is around 1100. I pick up OT pretty aggressively, my last second paycheck was 2200. First year new hire FO. Thats 3300, take home, per month.

I find it hard to believe my numbers would be somehow different from normal.

I am convinced more and more each day you are the love child of crj700. Sure, you are getting lucky and live in base. However, more than 60% of our pilot group doesn't live in base and OT isn't as easy to pick up.

I know your next response, so save it. Envoy isn't for commuters blah blah blah. The bottom line is the flow is losing value by the day and we are under paid for what we do. Stop and think about it for a second. On any given day, we have hundreds of peoples lives in our hands and millions of dollars of equipment we are responsible for, all for $35000-$40,000 a year while spending a large part of our lives away from loved ones. Let that sink in.

The flow can go away at any time once the PP's are gone and we are left with sub-standard wages with **** poor quality of life. Sure things are great sitting reserve in base, but you are the minority and you can find yourself stuck at Envoy for a long time if things go south. You will wish you didn't defend the company so much and had higher pay.

The real question Dera is why do you consistently come on here and defend the company while trying to justify industry leading bottom wages, qol and reserve rules? What do you have to gain from this?

Stop defending the company and encouraging others to come here, you are doing them a disservice and only helping the company.

bigtime209
05-01-2019, 04:18 PM
I am convinced more and more each day you are the love child of crj700. Sure, you are getting lucky and live in base. However, more than 60% of our pilot group doesn't live in base and OT isn't as easy to pick up.

I know your next response, so save it. Envoy isn't for commuters blah blah blah. The bottom line is the flow is losing value by the day and we are under paid for what we do. Stop and think about it for a second. On any given day, we have hundreds of peoples lives in our hands and millions of dollars of equipment we are responsible for, all for $35000-$40,000 a year while spending a large part of our lives away from loved ones. Let that sink in.

The flow can go away at any time once the PP's are gone and we are left with sub-standard wages with **** poor quality of life. Sure things are great sitting reserve in base, but you are the minority and you can find yourself stuck at Envoy for a long time if things go south. You will wish you didn't defend the company so much and had higher pay.

The real question Dera is why do you consistently come on here and defend the company while trying to justify industry leading bottom wages, qol and reserve rules? What do you have to gain from this?

Stop defending the company and encouraging others to come here, you are doing them a disservice and only helping the company.

He has management potential written all over. ALPA is trying to secure gains for the pilot group as we continue to fall further and further behind our peers and Dera is over here on public forums yakking about how great things are around here.

dera
05-01-2019, 04:27 PM
I am convinced more and more each day you are the love child of crj700. Sure, you are getting lucky and live in base. However, more than 60% of our pilot group doesn't live in base and OT isn't as easy to pick up.

I know your next response, so save it. Envoy isn't for commuters blah blah blah. The bottom line is the flow is losing value by the day and we are under paid for what we do. Stop and think about it for a second. On any given day, we have hundreds of peoples lives in our hands and millions of dollars of equipment we are responsible for, all for $35000-$40,000 a year while spending a large part of our lives away from loved ones. Let that sink in.

The flow can go away at any time once the PP's are gone and we are left with sub-standard wages with **** poor quality of life. Sure things are great sitting reserve in base, but you are the minority and you can find yourself stuck at Envoy for a long time if things go south. You will wish you didn't defend the company so much and had higher pay.

The real question Dera is why do you consistently come on here and defend the company while trying to justify industry leading bottom wages, qol and reserve rules? What do you have to gain from this?

Stop defending the company and encouraging others to come here, you are doing them a disservice and only helping the company.

I just have a problem with lies and half-truths.
You guys seriously think your three-man-campaign here will cause any significant movement on either side?
That's some serious delusion of grandeur right there.

I'm not encouraging anyone to come here. But I'm trying to provide facts, so they can decide it themselves. You just lose all credibility you have when you don't stick to the facts.

I'm not "getting lucky" and live in base - I lived in DFW before I applied, and I am stuck here. There was a chance that I might have had to commute for a bit, who cares? I chose the regional with the most stable DFW base. So far it's working out for me.

And hey, how about this? The best way to secure movement, flow etc, is to get new hires through the door. If that door closes, suddenly we get stagnation, flow restrictions and so on. That's what you want?

BIueSideUp
05-01-2019, 05:09 PM
1600? Where do you come up with these numbers?

On reserve, my first paycheck is around 1100. I pick up OT pretty aggressively, my last second paycheck was 2200. First year new hire FO. Thats 3300, take home, per month.

I find it hard to believe my numbers would be somehow different from normal.

Smh dude...

dera
05-01-2019, 05:35 PM
Smh dude...

Yeah? Is there something wrong in picking up OT on reserve?

BigZ
05-01-2019, 06:07 PM
I am convinced more and more each day you are the love child of crj700. Sure, you are getting lucky and live in base. However, more than 60% of our pilot group doesn't live in base and OT isn't as easy to pick up.

I know your next response, so save it. Envoy isn't for commuters blah blah blah. The bottom line is the flow is losing value by the day and we are under paid for what we do. Stop and think about it for a second. On any given day, we have hundreds of peoples lives in our hands and millions of dollars of equipment we are responsible for, all for $35000-$40,000 a year while spending a large part of our lives away from loved ones. Let that sink in.

The flow can go away at any time once the PP's are gone and we are left with sub-standard wages with **** poor quality of life. Sure things are great sitting reserve in base, but you are the minority and you can find yourself stuck at Envoy for a long time if things go south. You will wish you didn't defend the company so much and had higher pay.

The real question Dera is why do you consistently come on here and defend the company while trying to justify industry leading bottom wages, qol and reserve rules? What do you have to gain from this?

Stop defending the company and encouraging others to come here, you are doing them a disservice and only helping the company.
You're thinking of cr700, crj700 is a normal person.

Houpilot2001
05-01-2019, 06:22 PM
Yeah? Is there something wrong in picking up OT on reserve?

No, not if you like days off.

dera
05-01-2019, 06:25 PM
No, not if you like days off.

Yep, 8 days off is great. I wish our reserve rules were better and we could pick up more.

Houpilot2001
05-01-2019, 06:31 PM
Yep, 8 days off is great. I wish our reserve rules were better and we could pick up more.

Out of curiosity, is your last name Martin or Warren? Jeezus dude.

BIueSideUp
05-01-2019, 06:46 PM
Yep, 8 days off is great. I wish our reserve rules were better and we could pick up more.

i WiSh I cOUld WoRk evERy dAy #livinthedream

dera
05-01-2019, 07:02 PM
i WiSh I cOUld WoRk evERy dAy #livinthedream

Sorry, I forgot you need your 18 days off. You should try a real job for a change, not that anyone would hire you with your work ethic.

bigtime209
05-01-2019, 07:17 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This guy is an absolute joke. Unbelievable.

moon
05-01-2019, 07:19 PM
Smh dude...

No one should be discouraged from picking up OT. The company would love for us to stop picking up OT. They have the reserve coverage to cover everything so by working OT we are extracting more money out of this stingy company. Especially if you only pick up a turn from a sequence and leave the overnight, still have to burn a reserve.

dera
05-01-2019, 07:25 PM
No one should be discouraged from picking up OT. The company would love for us to stop picking up OT. They have the reserve coverage to cover everything so by working OT we are extracting more money out of this stingy company. Especially if you only pick up a turn from a sequence and leave the overnight, still have to burn a reserve.

Yep. OT pays more than PSA rates. Dont see what the problem is picking it up.
The problem is these kids who just don't know how the world works.

TeeRainPULup
05-01-2019, 07:40 PM
Yep. OT pays more than PSA rates. Dont see what the problem is picking it up.
The problem is these kids who just don't know how the world works.

E175 Driver is that you? Been a long time glad to see you changed your name.

rld1k
05-01-2019, 08:41 PM
Yep. OT pays more than PSA rates. Dont see what the problem is picking it up.
The problem is these kids who just don't know how the world works.

PSA OT is 200%. Or are you comparing our OT to their regular hourly rate (lol).


Sorry, I forgot you need your 18 days off. You should try a real job for a change, not that anyone would hire you with your work ethic.

Yeah you guys are all lazy. Sure your wife will have a boyfriend while you're gone 80% of the year. You'll be back for 8 days a month so it won't be anything serious.

uavking
05-01-2019, 10:33 PM
Yep, 8 days off is great.

This explains alot. I'll bet Jody loves you, dude.

Plenty of folks here have worked real jobs before, and I for one have no desire to do that nonsense again. Time off, to do things besides get abused by crew scheduling or make up for other work groups IOT hit BS metrics, is one of the appeals of being an airline pilot in the first place.

Smutter
05-02-2019, 05:18 AM
Yep. OT pays more than PSA rates. Dont see what the problem is picking it up.
The problem is these kids who just don't know how the world works.

Wait, you're comparing our OT to PSA's regular rates? So, while they're making 20% more, and not working on days off, you're at work on a day off saying you make more then a psa pilot? Your logic is ****ed. Also cr700 was Andy in ord cpo, he had permission from Wilson to run that account to counter negativity. Not sure if cr700 is still used by them anymore.

crj700
05-02-2019, 05:25 AM
You're thinking of cr700, crj700 is a normal person.

I'm not sure about normal, but I appreciate the clarification. I'm definitely not the other guy.

Thedude86
05-02-2019, 06:46 AM
PSA OT is 200%. Or are you comparing our OT to their regular hourly rate (lol).


Not getting involved in the rest of the argument, but this particular statement is not correct. The only time we (PSA) get 200% is during the week that covers Thanksgiving and Christmas. It’s also an LOA for each season. It’s not certain we’ll get that this year.

We used to get critical that paid 150% during the rest of the year that was triggered by the reserve grid. Our union voluntarily gave that up along with a better 125% SDO for our new “premium pay” tier system. The old system was more complicated but it paid better.... and a heck of a lot better if you knew how to use it. I’m making $14/hour (18% raise) more with our new pay rates but will actually only make about 2% more than I was making with the old pay rates and better OT. And that was just using the 125% SDO. Days off are roughly the same, but I didn’t have to work as hard under the old system either.

I’m curious what you guy’s OT is like. Ours isn’t that great.

MD-11Loader
05-02-2019, 06:53 AM
Not getting involved in the rest of the argument, but this particular statement is not correct. The only time we (PSA) get 200% is during the week that covers Thanksgiving and Christmas. It’s also an LOA for each season. It’s not certain we’ll get that this year.

We used to get critical that paid 150% during the rest of the year that was triggered by the reserve grid. Our union voluntarily gave that up along with a better 125% SDO for our new “premium pay” tier system. The old system was more complicated but it paid better if you knew how to use it. I’m making $14/hour (18% raise) more with our new pay rates but will actually only make about 2% more than I was making with the old pay rates and better OT. And that was just using the 125% SDO. Days off are roughly the same, but I didn’t have to work as hard under the old system either.

I’m curious what you guy’s OT is like. Ours isn’t that great.

150% for everything and 200% for critical coverage

Thedude86
05-02-2019, 07:04 AM
150% for everything and 200% for critical coverage

So even 150% for normal open time pickup? No strings attached?

pitchattitude
05-02-2019, 07:35 AM
So even 150% for normal open time pickup? No strings attached?
Yeah. The string is it has to be available and you have to be able to pick it up.

EnyFlyr
05-02-2019, 07:52 AM
Yeah. The string is it has to be available and you have to be able to pick it up.

The OT out of dfw in the 145 is not even worth it most of the time

pitchattitude
05-02-2019, 09:05 AM
The OT out of dfw in the 145 is not even worth it most of the time

You don’t want to do an extra overnight to ACT?

Tyrion
05-02-2019, 11:59 AM
Sorry, I forgot you need your 18 days off. You should try a real job for a change, not that anyone would hire you with your work ethic.

The difference ... is that most "real jobs" (M-F 9-5) also have 8 days off a month. However, those guys get evenings at home, and they aren't 1000 miles away when their family needs them. Sure, we only "work" 20 hours in a week, but we are "at work" 100+ hours to get paid for those 20 hours.

That's why the preferred pilot schedule is something like 15 days at 6 hours each (90 hour month). Not this 1 leg and lost day crap. Picking up OT is a band-aid to give some people a little extra cash that brings them closer to industry standard. Giving up 2 days off for 3 hours of pay to do an ACT overnight just isn't worth it.

Smutter
05-02-2019, 12:33 PM
The difference ... is that most "real jobs" (M-F 9-5) also have 8 days off a month. However, those guys get evenings at home, and they aren't 1000 miles away when their family needs them. Sure, we only "work" 20 hours in a week, but we are "at work" 100+ hours to get paid for those 20 hours.

That's why the preferred pilot schedule is something like 15 days at 6 hours each (90 hour month). Not this 1 leg and lost day crap. Picking up OT is a band-aid to give some people a little extra cash that brings them closer to industry standard. Giving up 2 days off for 3 hours of pay to do an ACT overnight just isn't worth it.
Don't waste your breath on dera, he's either a troll or in the cpo

Cyio
05-02-2019, 02:27 PM
Don't waste your breath on dera, he's either a troll or in the cpo

I originally thought he/she was just a new hire that couldn't see the writing on the wall. After the posts they have made these last few days, they clearly are working for the company some how, just want to get reactions out of people, or completely and utterly clueless. I am not sure which is worse to be honest.

I haven't seen this level of anti pilot talk since cr700 or whatever that user was. Who knows, maybe the same person just under a different name now.

What gives you away is that if you are a pilot working the line, you would never fight increases in qol, pay etc because "you never worked a real job".

The poster above has it right. While we may only work 15 days a month, we are away from home those days vs someone working m-f gets to see their family every night. Not to mention, we are only paid when flying so sitting there doing walk arounds, waiting on a late airplane, waiting on maintenance all go unpaid.

Anyway, I would just ignore Dera if it wasn't for my need to make sure the company line isn't towed constantly around here by them.

Paid2fly
05-02-2019, 10:16 PM
Don't waste your breath on dera, he's either a troll or in the cpo







Maybe even both?

UncreativeUser
05-03-2019, 05:44 AM
Unbiased here, but dera has had a lot of facts to back up. His talk about OT literally cause someone else to say to say PSA gets 200% when that’s clearly wrong.

That cr700 person was for sure with the company considering he/she would always say things like “industry leading flow” instead of flow.

Dera doesn’t talk like that, she/he is stating facts but these facts are coming from a DFW 175 point of view, the highest QOL potential in the entire company. Throw in the fact he/she lives in base and now you have the absolute best QOL possible here.

My biggest concern is the QUALITY of applicants. It’s only a matter of time before cadets and good RTP guys/gals start to get watered down. I’d like to be prideful of this company but I hope management starts to show its pride in us back because looking at AirPortal, we all do a pretty great job at all our bases and aircraft.

We need more than just a thanks. Normally, I’d be fine with that if my union-less friends didn’t operate the exact same equipment I do and get paid more for it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cyio
05-03-2019, 06:28 AM
Unbiased here, but dera has had a lot of facts to back up. His talk about OT literally cause someone else to say to say PSA gets 200% when that’s clearly wrong.

That cr700 person was for sure with the company considering he/she would always say things like “industry leading flow” instead of flow.

Dera doesn’t talk like that, she/he is stating facts but these facts are coming from a DFW 175 point of view, the highest QOL potential in the entire company. Throw in the fact he/she lives in base and now you have the absolute best QOL possible here.

My biggest concern is the QUALITY of applicants. It’s only a matter of time before cadets and good RTP guys/gals start to get watered down. I’d like to be prideful of this company but I hope management starts to show its pride in us back because looking at AirPortal, we all do a pretty great job at all our bases and aircraft.

We need more than just a thanks. Normally, I’d be fine with that if my union-less friends didn’t operate the exact same equipment I do and get paid more for it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sorry, I forgot you need your 18 days off. You should try a real job for a change, not that anyone would hire you with your work ethic.
Yep. OT pays more than PSA rates. Dont see what the problem is picking it up.
The problem is these kids who just don't know how the world works.
Yep, 8 days off is great. I wish our reserve rules were better and we could pick up more.
You guys make it sound like these step letters really are handed out like candy. I don't know about other bases, but in DFW i know of one, and let's just say he totally deserved it.

These are some or the reasons people are irritated with them. It would seem that they are at times actively trying to push back against improvements because they have had an OK time.

The person has zero empathy for the fact that over 60% our workforce are commuters, MOST not by choice. They like to spout off things like 1 step letter in all of DFW as if they actually know what they are talking about. Its all nonsense that does nothing but hurt the rest of the pilot group while defending some of the actions of the company.

Thats the issue.

UncreativeUser
05-03-2019, 07:08 AM
These are some or the reasons people are irritated with them. It would seem that they are at times actively trying to push back against improvements because they have had an OK time.



The person has zero empathy for the fact that over 60% our workforce are commuters, MOST not by choice. They like to spout off things like 1 step letter in all of DFW as if they actually know what they are talking about. Its all nonsense that does nothing but hurt the rest of the pilot group while defending some of the actions of the company.



Thats the issue.



I see, I do agree with you on the lack of empathy due to his geographical upbringing (can’t fault him for that), yes a good chunk of commuters work here and since we only have 4 bases it’s kinda hard to uproot and move. I am doing that myself soon anyways but as a commuter right now it can get pretty rough.

With that said, being on the line I’ve never even heard of a step letter until this point so it must not be as common unless I’m not around the action. I know rumors can be spread too so I’m a “believe nothing of what you hear and half of what you see” kind of person.

This company needs improvement, but it’s not the worst and does some things right. That’s where the OK attitude comes from. From the time at least when I applied however, Envoy was and (maybe still is) considered a tier 1 regional to work for. We still have all the wonderful American Eagle guys and girls here that provide terrific insight that inspire me to be the best pilot I can and they deserve better too.

My point, we need to make something happen and show that we are and can be the best regional in the world. Whether that will last for years or a day something needs to happen, we have to be competitive or our pilot group will suffer on quality pretty quickly and captains are going to have to babysit.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

NoValueAviator
05-03-2019, 07:13 AM
There is no way for joe line pilot to gather data about step letters. However, it is widely understood that they’re easier to get in Chicago or NY.

Idk about Dera. I think he is just a contrarian and whatever most people are saying, he’ll be saying the opposite.

pitchattitude
05-03-2019, 09:17 AM
There is no way for joe line pilot to gather data about step letters. However, it is widely understood that they’re easier to get in Chicago or NY.

Idk about Dera. I think he is just a contrarian and whatever most people are saying, he’ll be saying the opposite.
I do personally know of at least two people with step letters in DFW. One guy told me about his. He deserved it. He was out of the country while on reserve. The other guy I know nothing about but was with the union rep while he was on the phone. But yes, my experience with KC and the rest of the CPO in DFW has been very positive. They are quite reasonable. That being said, he is headed to the training center in June so not sure who is taking over and no way to know how things will be going forward.

moon
05-03-2019, 10:03 AM
I doubt many people go about telling everyone they fly with that they have a step letter. I don't think I would tell anyone unless there was a reason to tell them.

dera
05-03-2019, 05:23 PM
I doubt many people go about telling everyone they fly with that they have a step letter. I don't think I would tell anyone unless there was a reason to tell them.

...yet everyone knows they are being given out like candy and you will never flow because you can't avoid them...

You see the conflict here?

dera
05-03-2019, 05:31 PM
These are some or the reasons people are irritated with them. It would seem that they are at times actively trying to push back against improvements because they have had an OK time.

The person has zero empathy for the fact that over 60% our workforce are commuters, MOST not by choice. They like to spout off things like 1 step letter in all of DFW as if they actually know what they are talking about. Its all nonsense that does nothing but hurt the rest of the pilot group while defending some of the actions of the company.

Thats the issue.

I've said so many times it's getting old, my comments are 100% from live-in-base 175 FO point of view. They don't extend outside that scope.

I didn't say "1 step letter in all of DFW", read again, slowly, if you have hard time understanding what I said. I said I know of one, and he deserved it. If you ask around you'll find out, that most people really don't know anyone with one either. They are NOT handed out like candy like some people here claim, at least not in DFW.
And you really think my comments here affect the company in any meaningful way? You guys really have some serious delusions of grandeur - There's what, less than 1% of the pilot group who actually post here. The only reason why I bother is because you guys just spew your alternate facts trying to make it sound worse than it is.
Sometimes it's like watching a Trump press conference, in slow motion, on repeat.

Reality and facts is what people should stick with. I at least try, yeah sometimes I miss a few things, but at least try. Maybe you should try the same for a change.

ERAUAV8TR
05-03-2019, 06:41 PM
I've said so many times it's getting old, my comments are 100% from live-in-base 175 FO point of view. They don't extend outside that scope.

I didn't say "1 step letter in all of DFW", read again, slowly, if you have hard time understanding what I said. I said I know of one, and he deserved it. If you ask around you'll find out, that most people really don't know anyone with one either. They are NOT handed out like candy like some people here claim, at least not in DFW.
And you really think my comments here affect the company in any meaningful way? You guys really have some serious delusions of grandeur - There's what, less than 1% of the pilot group who actually post here. The only reason why I bother is because you guys just spew your alternate facts trying to make it sound worse than it is.
Sometimes it's like watching a Trump press conference, in slow motion, on repeat.

Reality and facts is what people should stick with. I at least try, yeah sometimes I miss a few things, but at least try. Maybe you should try the same for a change.

FO so ur experience with this company is very little and should be noted with ur comments.

dera
05-03-2019, 06:44 PM
FO so ur experience with this company is very little and should be noted with ur comments.

I think everyone here knows that. Sorry if U didn't. I mean, it only says "175 FO" as my position, maybe it's not obvious enough for u?

Tyrion
05-03-2019, 09:53 PM
I think everyone here knows that. Sorry if U didn't. I mean, it only says "175 FO" as my position, maybe it's not obvious enough for u?

In the land of unicorns is more accurate of your views than simply 175 FO. Personally, I think you should change your position to "Head Cheerleader on the Envoy Pep Squad", but that's just my opinion.

Inclined plane
05-04-2019, 12:37 AM
And you really think my comments here affect the company in any meaningful way? You guys really have some serious delusions of grandeur - There's what, less than 1% of the pilot group who actually post here.



YES! Yes, many here DO think your comments actually hurt the pilot group by directly making the company seem like not such a bad place to work, and therefore you are acting as an unofficial recruiter, broadcasting that it’s not so bad at Envoy. Normally this isn’t a bad thing to just post the sorts of things you post, like favorable reserve times and other things that might seem attractive to a potential new hire, but do you really need to do that while we are trying to get raises, especially when our best chance at that is by hiring numbers to begin dwindling? So no, it’s not delusions of grandeur. It’s called common sense, which means to tread lightly during times the pilot group is in negotiations with the company. In other words, if you have something nice to say about our company, great but hey why not SAVE IT for when it wouldn’t literally be contrary to your pilot group’s best interest.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

martyByrde
05-08-2019, 09:39 AM
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/daily-labor-report/envoy-air-3-56-million-wage-settlement-gets-final-approval

buddies8
05-08-2019, 10:02 AM
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/daily-labor-report/envoy-air-3-56-million-wage-settlement-gets-final-approval

What a surprise, envoy not paying what it agreed to or required by law.
Shocking. But aside from that we have the lowest paid pilots and flow to american.

Houpilot2001
05-08-2019, 11:16 AM
What a surprise, envoy not paying what it agreed to or required by law.
Shocking. But aside from that we have the lowest paid pilots and flow to american.

Low pay + flow = FUPME

Varsity
05-16-2019, 07:42 AM
Boutique air now pays $72/hour for a king air captain. 80hr/month guarantee. How much more is a that than a 175 captain at Envoy? 20k?

Cyio
05-16-2019, 11:36 AM
Boutique air now pays $72/hour for a king air captain. 80hr/month guarantee. How much more is a that than a 175 captain at Envoy? 20k?

That’s a depressing bit of news, thanks for the kick in the nuts. lol.

dera
05-16-2019, 04:18 PM
Boutique air now pays $72/hour for a king air captain. 80hr/month guarantee. How much more is a that than a 175 captain at Envoy? 20k?

Most 135 PIC jobs pay better than regional PIC. Just FYI.

Jumpseatcrawler
05-16-2019, 04:40 PM
Most 135 PIC and other 121 regional jobs pay better than ENVOYregional PIC. Just FYI.

fixed it for you.

AeroEnvoy
05-16-2019, 06:49 PM
Customs and Border Protection just upped their pay too. They’re now offering 98k-109k first year depending on where you’re stationed and they are desperately hiring.

hindsight2020
05-16-2019, 07:06 PM
Customs and Border Protection just upped their pay too. They’re now offering 98k-109k first year depending on where you’re stationed and they are desperately hiring.

.....Because people are running away from that dumpster fire. Plus that's not a "pilot's" job. Flying is incidental to that job. That nuance is not something that an airline pilot should readily dismiss, if your motivations are to fly, get paid and slam-click for a living.

AeroEnvoy
05-16-2019, 07:22 PM
.....Because people are running away from that dumpster fire. Plus that's not a "pilot's" job. Flying is incidental to that job. That nuance is not something that an airline pilot should readily dismiss, if your motivations are to fly, get paid and slam-click for a living.

Just stating a fact. Obviously the job is not for you but neither is 121 to a lot of people.

CrowneVic
05-16-2019, 07:23 PM
.....Because people are running away from that dumpster fire. Plus that's not a "pilot's" job. Flying is incidental to that job. That nuance is not something that an airline pilot should readily dismiss, if your motivations are to fly, get paid and slam-click for a living.

At least there's a real retirement at the end of the rainbow.

Varsity
06-04-2019, 06:25 PM
It's a sinking ship for sure.