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View Full Version : AE Performance Bonus Award


ERAUAV8TR
05-03-2019, 03:23 PM
Did anyone get the AE Performance Bonus Award? I canít ever remember not getting it, even if it was just a small part. Where is the communication on why we didnít get? Last I knew is we were hitting our marks. Strange! Did the criteria change? Any information?


moon
05-03-2019, 03:52 PM
Did anyone get the AE Performance Bonus Award? I canít ever remember not getting it, even if it was just a small part. Where is the communication on why we didnít get? Last I knew is we were hitting our marks. Strange! Did the criteria change? Any information?

No crew got it. New metrics on turn times. Missed it all 3 months. Envoyed!

Varsity
05-03-2019, 04:14 PM
They changed it to the T0 times, which is completely impossible to achieve (25minute turns in the 145, 30 in CRJ/175) considering everyone stands in the jet bridge for half an hour waiting on the piedmont rampers to unload the valet checked bags. Hence they no longer have to pay it out.

Typical Envoy.


pitchattitude
05-03-2019, 07:44 PM
I thought it was pretty ridiculous when Envoy put out the latest version of optimized boarding. It is hard enough to make the extended turn times at a hub, let alone the shorter ones at an out station. Rather than building in more time in the schedule which would allow a catch up if a previous flight was late, it now makes all subsequent flights late.

BUT, since Mesa couldnít make its times, AAG gave them more block time. See article and quote from it below.

https://skift.com/2019/02/05/american-airlines-warns-one-of-its-regional-airlines-to-improve/

American also will schedule more block time for many Mesa flights, a move that should allow Mesa to pad on-time performance. Flights that had been slated as late could now arrive on-time, according to DOT guidelines.

But Envoy would rather just take away performance bonuses from employees. Another example of tripping over dollars to save dimes and hurting themselves rather than helping themselves since they would have to reward the employees.

moon
05-03-2019, 08:03 PM
I thought it was pretty ridiculous when Envoy put out the latest version of optimized boarding. It is hard enough to make the extended turn times at a hub, let alone the shorter ones at an out station. Rather than building in more time in the schedule which would allow a catch up if a previous flight was late, it now makes all subsequent flights late.

BUT, since Mesa couldnít make its times, AAG gave them more block time. See article and quote from it below.

https://skift.com/2019/02/05/american-airlines-warns-one-of-its-regional-airlines-to-improve/

American also will schedule more block time for many Mesa flights, a move that should allow Mesa to pad on-time performance. Flights that had been slated as late could now arrive on-time, according to DOT guidelines.

But Envoy would rather just take away performance bonuses from employees. Another example of tripping over dollars to save dimes and hurting themselves rather than helping themselves since they would have to reward the employees.

That sounds like a raise for MESA pilots too. Pad our times!

smtx123
05-03-2019, 09:12 PM
They changed it to the T0 times, which is completely impossible to achieve (25minute turns in the 145, 30 in CRJ/175) considering everyone stands in the jet bridge for half an hour waiting on the piedmont rampers to unload the valet checked bags. Hence they no longer have to pay it out.

Typical Envoy.

Theyíre planning less than 30 min turns on the 175 now. Had a few 25 min turns last month.

NoValueAviator
05-04-2019, 06:07 AM
Pay cut. Lol

3GreenKSNA
05-04-2019, 06:23 AM
Theyíre planning less than 30 min turns on the 175 now. Had a few 25 min turns last month.Not sure how that's even possible. Both inbound and outbound planes full, a couple of wheel chairs, running out of overhead bin space, all of these can blow the 30 minute turn time out the window.

Other than a new tagline does anyone know what the definition is of this new "optimized boarding?"

-Keep the dirty side down

pangolin
05-04-2019, 06:28 AM
Optimized boarding means send pax during cleanup and preflight. Pax can be sent when catering and cleaners are on board.

bigtime209
05-04-2019, 06:31 AM
Optimized boarding means send pax during cleanup and preflight. Pax can be sent when catering and cleaners are on board.

And that's IF they even get cleaners a chance to get onboard. I've had flight after flight after flight go out with an absolutely filthy airplane because they don't want to hold boarding and give the cleaners a chance to clean the cabin. Embarrassing.

EnyFlyr
05-04-2019, 06:35 AM
Ohh the irony. We are all waiting on that pay raise and what did we get ? A niceee

Pay cut. Lol

NoValueAviator
05-04-2019, 06:50 AM
have you guys seen the cleaners sprinting down the aisle spraying that Fabreeze-like stuff over each shoulder yet?

I felt bad but Iím sure mgmt would be pleased.

buddies8
05-04-2019, 07:15 AM
Write it up.

griff312
05-04-2019, 08:18 AM
This is soooooo sad.... Less than 30 turn times on the 175, or CRJ (with pax waiting on valet bags), no time for catering or cleaners, (still waiting on fuel), no time to clean lavs, (still waiting on air start cart), no time for anything (waiting on push crew). What kind of low budget operation are we turning in to!?!?

Delta has it right. They sell an "experience". We herd cattle.

I would much rather take a 5-10 minute delay on an impossible 23 minute turn time, and provide a presentable product.

I don't get the obsession with T-0. Block out with a 5 minute delay on an overblocked flight, make up 15 minutes reroute, block in 10 mins early. Still blows a gasket over 5 min blocking out delay.
Block out 6 minutes early, wait 20 minutes for push crew to unscrew something, ramp and alley is blocked for another 10 minutes, get jerked around all over the place reroute so add 10 more minutes, land, go to box and wait on a gate for another 30 minutes, ramps is blocked, one more lap around the airport, finally block in a total of 1 hour 10 minutes late. No one says a word...

Oh well.

pitchattitude
05-04-2019, 08:38 AM
This is soooooo sad.... Less than 30 turn times on the 175, or CRJ (with pax waiting on valet bags), no time for catering or cleaners, (still waiting on fuel), no time to clean lavs, (still waiting on air start cart), no time for anything (waiting on push crew). What kind of low budget operation are we turning in to!?!?

Delta has it right. They sell an "experience". We herd cattle.

I would much rather take a 5-10 minute delay on an impossible 23 minute turn time, and provide a presentable product.

I don't get the obsession with T-0. Block out with a 5 minute delay on an overblocked flight, make up 15 minutes reroute, block in 10 mins early. Still blows a gasket over 5 min blocking out delay.
Block out 6 minutes early, wait 20 minutes for push crew to unscrew something, ramp and alley is blocked for another 10 minutes, get jerked around all over the place reroute so add 10 more minutes, land, go to box and wait on a gate for another 30 minutes, ramps is blocked, one more lap around the airport, finally block in a total of 1 hour 10 minutes late. No one says a word...

Oh well.

This whole obsession with turn times actually hurts the company (including AAG) performance numbers and is something AAG controls. They would be so much better off to just make outstation turns about 40-45 and hubs 50-60. Get everything done and out on time and if the previous flight IS a a few minutes late it doesnít cascade the rest of the day until the next lull. It not like planes and crews are always running full tilt. There usually is some point where plane and crew has several hours to sit. Just spread it out a bit. I realize some of the extended plane sits are for maintenance, but still. Yes, we donít get paid during that time, but I would rather have an extra ten minutes and not be rushed taking a c**p, eating or just getting a coffee so I can get everything else done as well.

Cyio
05-04-2019, 09:14 AM
Doug Parker strikes again.

Jamesthunder
05-04-2019, 10:12 AM
This whole obsession with turn times actually hurts the company (including AAG) performance numbers and is something AAG controls. They would be so much better off to just make outstation turns about 40-45 and hubs 50-60. Get everything done and out on time and if the previous flight IS a a few minutes late it doesnít cascade the rest of the day until the next lull. It not like planes and crews are always running full tilt. There usually is some point where plane and crew has several hours to sit. Just spread it out a bit. I realize some of the extended plane sits are for maintenance, but still. Yes, we donít get paid during that time, but I would rather have an extra ten minutes and not be rushed taking a c**p, eating or just getting a coffee so I can get everything else done as well.

You guys don't understand, the less time on a gate, the more time the planes can be making money. That's why ole dougie is the CEO and we're a bunch of peons.

ERAUAV8TR
05-04-2019, 10:22 AM
You guys don't understand, the less time on a gate, the more time the planes can be making money. That's why ole dougie is the CEO and we're a bunch of peons.

I thought he was ceo because AA management all left for United after they saw bad things coming with us airways...also he has jail time so they promoted him.

smtx123
05-04-2019, 10:35 AM
Not sure how that's even possible. Both inbound and outbound planes full, a couple of wheel chairs, running out of overhead bin space, all of these can blow the 30 minute turn time out the window.

Other than a new tagline does anyone know what the definition is of this new "optimized boarding?"

-Keep the dirty side down
Yeah man, 25 min turn in JAN.

NoValueAviator
05-04-2019, 11:12 AM
It seems like the change is working as intended to me. They wanted to cut pay at Envoy, so they reduced the bonus and reduced the likelihood they would have to pay it. Mission accomplished.

und2015
05-04-2019, 11:17 AM
Itís ok, Swayne made a video about how to turn a plane in 25 minutes that should help.

Varsity
05-04-2019, 11:27 AM
Itís ok, Swayne made a video about how to turn a plane in 25 minutes that should help.

Embarrassing

MD-11Loader
05-04-2019, 12:26 PM
Itís ok, Swayne made a video about how to turn a plane in 25 minutes that should help.

Dammit! Why didnít he put this out earlier. We could have studied it and been able to comply with his guidelines. Way to cost us money! Sorry kids, Ramen noodles again tonight. Dadís boss Mr. Shirley decided to cut out bonuses and instead enrolled him in the Jelly of the Month Club.

havick206
05-04-2019, 12:48 PM
Wait, what, we are supposed to do 25 min turns?

Since when did we stop waiting for the your electronic signature is missing ACARS (to remind you to read the release) before calling the dispatcher to add more fuel?

uavking
05-04-2019, 03:23 PM
Itís ok, Swayne made a video about how to turn a plane in 25 minutes that should help.

Whew, that's good. Who needs captain DNR when we've got snazzy videos? Maybe he can make another one so I can visualize turning a CRJ or 175 in 30...

pangolin
05-04-2019, 09:35 PM
Whew, that's good. Who needs captain DNR when we've got snazzy videos? Maybe he can make another one so I can visualize turning a CRJ or 175 in 30...

Fastest turn Iíve done is 15 minutes. But neither inbound or outbound was full.

pitchattitude
05-04-2019, 10:42 PM
Fastest turn Iíve done is 15 minutes. But neither inbound or outbound was full.
Thereís the answer. We need to operate at 50% capacity.

BigZ
05-04-2019, 11:00 PM
Thereís the answer. We need to operate at 50% capacity.
Or bring back the Shorts and unload/load via the ramp.

pitchattitude
05-05-2019, 04:19 AM
Or bring back the Shorts and unload/load via the ramp.
That will bring the stream of cadets to halt as well. Win on two fronts.

f16jetmech
05-05-2019, 04:03 PM
I actually like the short turn times. If I'm sitting @ an out station, that's less time on my overnight or getting home sooner on go home day. Just my 2 cents.

NoValueAviator
05-05-2019, 04:33 PM
Meanwhile, the CA is frantically rolling fixes into the FMS while youíre twiddling your thumbs and posting on APC lol

Honestly I like shorter turns too, slightly less unpaid time Iíve got to endure to earn my meager wages; however, this is not actually shortening turn times. The only effect on the line has been taking away the bonus.

Pedro4President
05-05-2019, 04:51 PM
Meanwhile, the CA is frantically rolling fixes into the FMS while youíre twiddling your thumbs and posting on APC lol

Honestly I like shorter turns too, slightly less unpaid time Iíve got to endure to earn my meager wages; however, this is not actually shortening turn times. The only effect on the line has been taking away the bonus.

I donít think anyone has ever complained about short turn times until it started hitting us in the pocket books.

Naviator
05-05-2019, 06:07 PM
So what exactly are we as pilots bonuses on? Is it the whole system overall turn performance?

FullThrust
05-05-2019, 08:25 PM
Just fly slow. And by slow I mean fly no faster than the flight plan speed. You would be surprised how quickly the overblock adds up. You can still make A14 and score some overblock. All the company and DOT care about is A14 plus you saved some gas and added a few bucks to your paycheck. You just reinstated your bonus.

wiz5422
05-06-2019, 05:42 AM
Just fly slow. And by slow I mean fly no faster than the flight plan speed. You would be surprised how quickly the overblock adds up. You can still make A14 and score some overblock. All the company and DOT care about is A14 plus you saved some gas and added a few bucks to your paycheck. You just reinstated your bonus.


That is all fine and dandy until the first cancellation or reassignment and then all your overages are wiped out for the month. All you're doing is arriving late screwing the next crew and or passengers, very proffessional.

Pedro4President
05-06-2019, 06:46 AM
That is all fine and dandy until the first cancellation or reassignment and then all your overages are wiped out for the month. All you're doing is arriving late screwing the next crew and or passengers, very proffessional.

Flying flight planned speed isnít unprofessional.

f16jetmech
05-06-2019, 07:50 AM
Meanwhile, the CA is frantically rolling fixes into the FMS while youíre twiddling your thumbs and posting on APC lol

Honestly I like shorter turns too, slightly less unpaid time Iíve got to endure to earn my meager wages; however, this is not actually shortening turn times. The only effect on the line has been taking away the bonus.

I load the flight plan for my captains. I guess you could say I'm a pretty big deal.

NoValueAviator
05-06-2019, 08:51 AM
Flying flight planned speed isnít unprofessional.

Is it unprofessional when you get stuck behind a co. flight doing .64 for no reason and miss your commute?

Thanks dudes, hope the 6 mins over block was worth it. Please save this crap for going to the outstation.

buddies8
05-06-2019, 09:34 AM
I donít think anyone has ever complained about short turn times until it started hitting us in the pocket books.

Really, so much that you know.

Pedro4President
05-06-2019, 10:12 AM
Is it unprofessional when you get stuck behind a co. flight doing .64 for no reason and miss your commute?

Thanks dudes, hope the 6 mins over block was worth it. Please save this crap for going to the outstation.

When have you seen a flight plan at .64? I have never seen .64 planned for a flight. .715 is about the lowest I can recall.

NoValueAviator
05-06-2019, 10:56 AM
When have you seen a flight plan at .64? I have never seen .64 planned for a flight. .715 is about the lowest I can recall.

Anytime you have a panel missing, youíll be slower... are you on the 175 or something?

However, all signs point to this guy was doing the speed to ďreinstate his bonus,Ē not because he saw it on the release.

buddies8
05-06-2019, 11:26 AM
.69 saw that a few times and just laughed.

Shiner
05-06-2019, 11:37 AM
I have never understood why everyone is in such a hurry in a job where weíre paid by the minute.

Pedro4President
05-07-2019, 04:38 AM
I have never understood why everyone is in such a hurry in a job where weíre paid by the minute.

Well apparently NVA missed a commute home because someone was going .64 ahead of him to earn some extra money.

jake cutter
05-07-2019, 11:33 AM
Flying flight planned speed isnít unprofessional.



Maybe but it sure makes for a fun pax experience in cruise...

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190507/08cd28c76b6ec9b06a06f8fe1f8f70ec.jpg

und2015
05-07-2019, 12:02 PM
Flying at redline the whole way is useless when you get there so early that you have to wait 30 minutes for a gate. That seems to always be the case at Lga and itís always on go home leg.

pangolin
05-07-2019, 01:37 PM
Flying at redline the whole way is useless when you get there so early that you have to wait 30 minutes for a gate. That seems to always be the case at Lga and itís always on go home leg.

Seriously the difference in TAS between .76 and .79 is like 8 knots. You are talking about saving less that 3 minutes on the average regional route. Shortcuts save more time.

FullThrust
05-08-2019, 08:12 PM
I have never understood why everyone is in such a hurry in a job where weíre paid by the minute.

Exactly. Fly the flight planned speed. You will never get in trouble or have to carpet dance for flying as planned and mutually agreed upon by the dispatcher. And guess what? If we are chronically early, you better believe the next time they revise the blocks for that city pair it will be lower....congrats on getting another pay cut.

But by all means, continue flying redline to make your commute flight that is probably delayed by the time you get to the gate if its on AA.