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View Full Version : Continental question


arjanssen
08-13-2007, 07:28 AM
For those Continental folks.... What are the chances of a new hire getting assigned to a wide-body right away?

If the chances are good, what are the monthly schedules like? The reason I'm asking is that my wife and I want to live on the west coast, so I'd have to commute, but if you only have to do two long trips a month, it seems like it wouldn't be too bad.

What do you think?


757Driver
08-13-2007, 07:35 AM
For those Continental folks.... What are the chances of a new hire getting assigned to a wide-body right away?

If the chances are good, what are the monthly schedules like? The reason I'm asking is that my wife and I want to live on the west coast, so I'd have to commute, but if you only have to do two long trips a month, it seems like it wouldn't be too bad.

What do you think?

Previously we had 777 slots for new-hires in EWR. You will be on reserve for years, (777 or 757/767), and have 12 days off that the company will roll at their leisure. The 737 out of IAH is much more commutable than EWR. EWR trips start early and end very late. You will be on reserve less in EWR as IAH is pretty senior. Best bet for commuting as a newbie would be stick it out on the 757 out of EWR as they have very commutable schedules and you'll get to see just about every city on the European continent.

arjanssen
08-13-2007, 08:03 AM
Thanks 757.

Since I'm new to the airline lingo.... If I get EWR on the 757, I would be on reserve a lot? Reserve would mean I am in town and ready to go? How many trips a month can you expect flying the 757 out of EWR? 3-4?

Thanks


757Driver
08-13-2007, 08:14 AM
Thanks 757.

Since I'm new to the airline lingo.... If I get EWR on the 757, I would be on reserve a lot? Reserve would mean I am in town and ready to go? How many trips a month can you expect flying the 757 out of EWR? 3-4?

Thanks

As a lineholder I'd say at least 4. As a reserve the skies the limit. We have one of the crappiest contracts out there as it applies to our schedules, (see PBS), and the treatment of reserves. Basically you will be flying a lot as a reserve or junior lineholder. I'm speaking commutability as far as being on the 757 out of EWR.

CAL EWR
08-13-2007, 08:46 AM
As a junior line holder on the 756 sub base (flying both the 757 and 767) you will get 6 trips to Europe and 12 days off for quite a while. When you are senior enough to hold FO or IRO (International Relief Officer) on trips worth 16 or more hours you will get 5 trips or 15 or 16 days off a month. I would guess at a minimum a year or two (depending on growth and retirements) to hold 15 or 16 days off a month.

You will only hold 757 and not 767 on a regular basis until you are at least above the 40% in the base. That may take two or more years.

Hope this helps.

EWR 756 Captain

Ottopilot
08-13-2007, 11:54 AM
I'm 50% seniority on the 757 in EWR and I get about 6 trips per month. I hold about 13 days off. Some 2 day trips and some 3 day. I avoid one day trips. On reserve you will have to be within two hours of the airport. If you're coming from the West coast, you'll probably going to need a crashpad. I'm from the SF Bay Area and I moved. I live 1.5 hours from EWR in N.E. PA.

arjanssen
08-13-2007, 12:32 PM
Thanks all. Good info. You all fly more trips/month than I thought. It sounds like commuting would be pretty tough. I can see why you moved!

Ottopilot
08-13-2007, 12:52 PM
The hope of living where you want and commuting easy with 18-20 days off per month is not too good. Maybe if you were a senior widebody FO that lives nearby. Most of the senior FO's have 20+ years in. It's a big difference from 12 days off on reserve and 6 of those days are changed by the company. They can "roll" your days off at their whim. You can't even plan stuff on your days off, because you don't know when they are! Most pilots get 737 EWR, so plan on that and hope for what you want.

JoeyMeatballs
08-13-2007, 01:00 PM
The hope of living where you want and commuting easy with 18-20 days off per month is not too good. Maybe if you were a senior widebody FO that lives nearby. Most of the senior FO's have 20+ years in. It's a big difference from 12 days off on reserve and 6 of those days are changed by the company. They can "roll" your days off at their whim. You can't even plan stuff on your days off, because you don't know when they are! Most pilots get 737 EWR, so plan on that and hope for what you want.

That would be a dream for me :)

SEDPA
08-13-2007, 04:40 PM
Anyone out there know a secret to getting CAL to "move" on your app without anybody at CAL to help?? Thanks.

scrapdog
08-13-2007, 06:30 PM
Anyone out there know a secret to getting CAL to "move" on your app without anybody at CAL to help?? Thanks.

No offense - but it more than likely won't happen. CAL is very big on the "know the guy and I can vouch for him" deal. And I think that's a good thing honestly.

goarmy
08-13-2007, 08:10 PM
I ditto the last one 100 %!! The apple does not fall to far from the tree.

FlyingW
08-13-2007, 08:49 PM
Guam seems to be out west.:D What are the chances of getting that right out of training?

Ottopilot
08-14-2007, 01:31 AM
When I was hired, two people from every class went to Guam. Guam is so far West, I call it East. It's not Hawaii. Some people love and some hate it. I didn't like the flying there, so I wanted EWR. It's a small base, but there usually some room in it for new guys.

SabreDriver
08-14-2007, 05:04 AM
When I was hired, two people from every class went to Guam. Guam is so far West, I call it East. It's not Hawaii. Some people love and some hate it. I didn't like the flying there, so I wanted EWR. It's a small base, but there usually some room in it for new guys.

Guam is a cool place, love it or not, it is and will always be "the trailer park of the Pacific" Tight knit bunch of folks out there, lots of interesting flying.

chazbird
08-14-2007, 06:46 AM
Why is having to know or flown with a CAL a pilot in order to get an interview a good thing? This may indicate: they don't know how to screen pilots properly themselves; or, they have plenty of applications but are maybe a bit lazy. By the way, IO psychology studies reveal letters of recommendation, when compared with more thorough evaluations, are poor predictors of future performance, in fact, I believe they are the worst. If CAL does a thorough evaluation after a letter of recommendation what does that say? Welcome to the club? Defending this issue is a bit odd, considering there's no "requirement" to have flown with (or even to know) a military pilot prior to UPT. I'm sure CAL hires a few "unknowns" - maybe to avoid lawsuits?

reCALcitrant
08-14-2007, 07:19 AM
Why is having to know or flown with a CAL a pilot in order to get an interview a good thing? This may indicate: they don't know how to screen pilots properly themselves; or, they have plenty of applications but are maybe a bit lazy. By the way, IO psychology studies reveal letters of recommendation, when compared with more thorough evaluations, are poor predictors of future performance, in fact, I believe they are the worst. If CAL does a thorough evaluation after a letter of recommendation what does that say? Welcome to the club? Defending this issue is a bit odd, considering there's no "requirement" to have flown with (or even to know) a military pilot prior to UPT. I'm sure CAL hires a few "unknowns" - maybe to avoid lawsuits?

Maybe we would be better off if there were. Notice most guard/reserve units hire this way and amazingly (real word?) enough most active duty guys say "I wish our unit was more like that one" about G/R. Just a thought.

HercDriver130
08-14-2007, 09:01 AM
I certainly can see the merits of having a letter of recommendation, but I would hate to think its a deal breaker.

scrapdog
08-14-2007, 09:16 PM
Why is having to know or flown with a CAL a pilot in order to get an interview a good thing? This may indicate: they don't know how to screen pilots properly themselves; or, they have plenty of applications but are maybe a bit lazy. By the way, IO psychology studies reveal letters of recommendation, when compared with more thorough evaluations, are poor predictors of future performance, in fact, I believe they are the worst. If CAL does a thorough evaluation after a letter of recommendation what does that say? Welcome to the club? Defending this issue is a bit odd, considering there's no "requirement" to have flown with (or even to know) a military pilot prior to UPT. I'm sure CAL hires a few "unknowns" - maybe to avoid lawsuits?

Wow, you're way off line. Not only does CAL do this, but so does DAL, UAL, FDX, UPS, SWA, and even JBL to a certain extent. Essentially every major airline that has a fight in today's market does some kind of "vouching" for. There's obviously a reason for that.

Let's take it a step further. In the "real" world of large corporations, big law firms, and physicians - the same damn thing happens every day. To get your foot in the door on most high level professional jobs, you need to know someone. You've got person A and person B with pretty much equal creditentials. Person A is completely off the street...person B knows multiple folks in management and has a very good repretoire with them. They say person B has a good attitude and is a hard worker. Maybe person A is as well, but no one has a clue where he/she came from. Who are they going to hire? Person B 99.9999 % of the time. That's a fact, Jack. No offense, but that's how life works.

So, are these HR folks lazy? Of course not. Networking is also a sign of initiative. The fact that people are sponsored by other folks means those candidates have gone out of their way to get to know fellow flyers at these majors and have asked for help. Maybe you're the one that's lazy. Let's call a spade a spade. If you want to get on at any major in today's world, you're going to have to know people. And I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Eric Stratton
08-14-2007, 09:49 PM
Wow, you're way off line. Not only does CAL do this, but so does DAL, UAL, FDX, UPS, SWA, and even JBL to a certain extent. Essentially every major airline that has a fight in today's market does some kind of "vouching" for. There's obviously a reason for that.

Let's take it a step further. In the "real" world of large corporations, big law firms, and physicians - the same damn thing happens every day. To get your foot in the door on most high level professional jobs, you need to know someone. You've got person A and person B with pretty much equal creditentials. Person A is completely off the street...person B knows multiple folks in management and has a very good repretoire with them. They say person B has a good attitude and is a hard worker. Maybe person A is as well, but no one has a clue where he/she came from. Who are they going to hire? Person B 99.9999 % of the time. That's a fact, Jack. No offense, but that's how life works.

So, are these HR folks lazy? Of course not. Networking is also a sign of initiative. The fact that people are sponsored by other folks means those candidates have gone out of their way to get to know fellow flyers at these majors and have asked for help. Maybe you're the one that's lazy. Let's call a spade a spade. If you want to get on at any major in today's world, you're going to have to know people. And I think there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

and maybe their fathers, brothers, mothers, sisters friends cousins roomate in college knows someone who can write you a letter or recommendation. I'm sure that person can really vouch for someone. Kind of like a guy I know who got a job at a major because he drove his friend to meet someone his parents knew. (an instructor in the training dept) This guy had 0 turbine pic and hadn't even applied but got an interview within a couple weeks and a class date shortly there after.

the fact jack is that it is "who you know and not what you know" and there is absolutely something wrong with that if you can't get hired any other way. Not all recommendations are truely valid and sometimes people should get a chance at a job because they are actually qualified and very competitive, not just because of some random connection.

by the way congratulations on knowing someone....;)

bearcat
08-15-2007, 05:51 AM
and maybe their fathers, brothers, mothers, sisters friends cousins roomate in college knows someone who can write you a letter or recommendation. I'm sure that person can really vouch for someone. Kind of like a guy I know who got a job at a major because he drove his friend to meet someone his parents knew. (an instructor in the training dept) This guy had 0 turbine pic and hadn't even applied but got an interview within a couple weeks and a class date shortly there after.

the fact jack is that it is "who you know and not what you know" and there is absolutely something wrong with that if you can't get hired any other way. Not all recommendations are truely valid and sometimes people should get a chance at a job because they are actually qualified and very competitive, not just because of some random connection.

by the way congratulations on knowing someone....;)

Hi Eric Stratton, damn glad to meet you. Your reply is self serving and therefore nobody is going to walk your crap in. however I am nice guy and if you PM me I'll be sure to help you out. Go to a lame airinc seminar. Tell them that you cannot get anyone to walk your stuff in. Good luck, sniveling gets you nowhere.

chazbird
08-15-2007, 07:34 AM
RE; Letters of recommendation. I was using CAL as an example, since it was the thread. I'm aware that DAL, SWA, FEDEX, UPS, etc. also tend to rely on or require recommendations. I don't think I'm lazy, I was just trying to make a point; I have good, very long term friends whom I've flown with at DAL, UAL, AWA/USAIRWAYS, ATA, FedEx, SWA, family at FedEx and ex-coworkers at SWA, CAL, Cathay, & Allegiant. I'm also aware that corporate flying (and some corporations in general) do the same. I'm not denying I haven't had a friend walk in a resume. True, it does show initiative to try and find someone to get you a recommendation, but sometimes someone's got to wonder how narrow that initiative might be. That person "knew" the other for how long? Under what circumstances? The jump-seat? An afternoon barbecue? But that's a better situation than someone with better experience or qualifications? I still think its a less than fair situation. When the US military starts this for new pilots, I wonder if its still a good thing.

Eric Stratton
08-15-2007, 07:56 AM
RE; Letters of recommendation. I was using CAL as an example, since it was the thread. I'm aware that DAL, SWA, FEDEX, UPS, etc. also tend to rely on or require recommendations. I don't think I'm lazy, I was just trying to make a point; I have good, very long term friends whom I've flown with at DAL, UAL, AWA/USAIRWAYS, ATA, FedEx, SWA, family at FedEx and ex-coworkers at SWA, CAL, Cathay, & Allegiant. I'm also aware that corporate flying (and some corporations in general) do the same. I'm not denying I haven't had a friend walk in a resume. True, it does show initiative to try and find someone to get you a recommendation, but sometimes someone's got to wonder how narrow that initiative might be. That person "knew" the other for how long? Under what circumstances? The jump-seat? An afternoon barbecue? But that's a better situation than someone with better experience or qualifications? I still think its a less than fair situation. When the US military starts this for new pilots, I wonder if its still a good thing.

chazbird you can't introduce logic into this discussion. it'll only make people's head hurt....:D

Eric Stratton
08-15-2007, 08:26 AM
Hi Eric Stratton, damn glad to meet you. Your reply is self serving and therefore nobody is going to walk your crap in. however I am nice guy and if you PM me I'll be sure to help you out. Go to a lame airinc seminar. Tell them that you cannot get anyone to walk your stuff in. Good luck, sniveling gets you nowhere.

exactly how is this self serving??? why do you think that no one would walk my stuff in, that hurts, a little, well maybe not. I've had my stuff walked in and walked others in too. I just think that too much weight is put on letter's than actual experience. I've done the lame air inc. seminar. what a joke that was. only 3 interviews scheduled and a job out of it. pathetic, total waste of money.

tell me who you work for and I'll let you know if I need help...

ps damn glad to meet you too....and never under estimate a good snivel

scrapdog
08-15-2007, 09:24 AM
RE; Letters of recommendation. I was using CAL as an example, since it was the thread. I'm aware that DAL, SWA, FEDEX, UPS, etc. also tend to rely on or require recommendations. I don't think I'm lazy, I was just trying to make a point; I have good, very long term friends whom I've flown with at DAL, UAL, AWA/USAIRWAYS, ATA, FedEx, SWA, family at FedEx and ex-coworkers at SWA, CAL, Cathay, & Allegiant. I'm also aware that corporate flying (and some corporations in general) do the same. I'm not denying I haven't had a friend walk in a resume. True, it does show initiative to try and find someone to get you a recommendation, but sometimes someone's got to wonder how narrow that initiative might be. That person "knew" the other for how long? Under what circumstances? The jump-seat? An afternoon barbecue? But that's a better situation than someone with better experience or qualifications? I still think its a less than fair situation. When the US military starts this for new pilots, I wonder if its still a good thing.

Chaz - here's the bottom line. You're exactly right...in that the "quality" of the rec also plays a major part. Any company worth their salt is going to question an internal rec if that is from a chance encounter at a barbque. And these major's like FDX, CAL, DAL, etc...see right through the bullsh*t. I'll give you my example. I had only one internal guy with CAL...however, he was a fellow military bubba in my squadron and I had flown with the guy on multiple occasions. He wrote me a solid letter and went to the CP for me in IAH. Case closed. On the flipside, there are dudes with multiple letters of rec that have never flown with their sponsors, but just happen to know them from family ties or as friends/acquantinces. There still trying. I know you get my drift. And thank you for being professional on here - very much unlike Eric Stratton.

scrapdog
08-15-2007, 09:27 AM
and maybe their fathers, brothers, mothers, sisters friends cousins roomate in college knows someone who can write you a letter or recommendation. I'm sure that person can really vouch for someone. Kind of like a guy I know who got a job at a major because he drove his friend to meet someone his parents knew. (an instructor in the training dept) This guy had 0 turbine pic and hadn't even applied but got an interview within a couple weeks and a class date shortly there after.

the fact jack is that it is "who you know and not what you know" and there is absolutely something wrong with that if you can't get hired any other way. Not all recommendations are truely valid and sometimes people should get a chance at a job because they are actually qualified and very competitive, not just because of some random connection.

by the way congratulations on knowing someone....;)

Hey clown, it's the quality of the rec as well. Dude, give me a break - all the major's see right through the bullsh*t letters of rec.

And thanks for the congrats - I actually know about 15 guys at 7 different majors. Oh by the way, I also have flown jets in the USAF for 7 years...that seemed to help slightly.

by the way, congratulations to you for being an d*ck.

arjanssen
08-15-2007, 10:40 AM
Wow, I'm going to quit starting threads! I seem to draw out controversy :) What was this thread about anyway?

Eric Stratton
08-15-2007, 11:00 AM
Hey clown, it's the quality of the rec as well. Dude, give me a break - all the major's see right through the bullsh*t letters of rec.

And thanks for the congrats - I actually know about 15 guys at 7 different majors. Oh by the way, I also have flown jets in the USAF for 7 years...that seemed to help slightly.

by the way, congratulations to you for being an d*ck.


does titto need a tissue???

stop acting like you weren't throwing stones earlier at chazbird. Saying he might be lazy and calling a spade a spade and my personal favorite "that's a fact, Jack". (hope you don't mind I used it too)

How far do you think that 7 years of USAF would have gotten you without the internal rec and your 15 friends. According to my internal source you wouldn't have gotten a second thought and that's a shame.

don't kid yourself not all majors see through all bs letters of rec if they are written correctly.

in regards to your last comment I'll leave you with some of my favorite clown comments

I know you are but what am I...or takes one to know one....

now lighten up chachi



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