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View Full Version : getting walked out???


Eric Stratton
08-28-2007, 10:06 AM
Has anyone ever been walked out after turning in a letter or resignation?

My buddy's in the real world are always walked out after turning in their 2 weeks notice. (no compete clauses) I've never heard of it happening at the regional to major but what if you are leaving a major to go to another major? Can you give them a "I'm leaving but don't know exactly when" type notice. My buddy doesn't want to be out of work for a few weeks but wants to leave on a good note and give at least 2 weeks notice.

thank


7576FO
08-28-2007, 10:52 AM
Wow, I don't know.

In the last 3 years at AA, at least a dozen to 25 senior to me leave each year. The Seniority list just says Resigned. I only know of a few examples where they actually went.
One 767I FO with 15 years seniority went to FedEx. He left a $135,000 yr job to go start over.
Two that I know went to SWA.
One did a stand in stead furlough and is flying for EK, I e-mailed him last month and he likes it.
All were senior to me.

Me, I would never give notice until I had a scheduled class date.

SenecaDriver
08-28-2007, 10:53 AM
Not sure what you mean by Walked out. Do you mean with Security folowing with H.R. in tow?
I also work in the "Real world" now and If you give a notice and offer to stay for an undetermined period to help through the transition, I think most companies, including mine look faviorably on that and we also have a non-compete clauses.
The only people that get "Walked out" are the folks that have been fired or pose a risk and H.R. and security don't want any shenanigans.
I don't know the Airline world, but I would think if you are honest with them they will respond in kind. I know someone in the SWA pool and he informed his regional and they are cool as long as he gives them plenty of notice when he gets a class date.


Eric Stratton
08-28-2007, 11:22 AM
Not sure what you mean by Walked out. Do you mean with Security folowing with H.R. in tow?
I also work in the "Real world" now and If you give a notice and offer to stay for an undetermined period to help through the transition, I think most companies, including mine look faviorably on that and we also have a non-compete clauses.
The only people that get "Walked out" are the folks that have been fired or pose a risk and H.R. and security don't want any shenanigans.
I don't know the Airline world, but I would think if you are honest with them they will respond in kind. I know someone in the SWA pool and he informed his regional and they are cool as long as he gives them plenty of notice when he gets a class date.

That's exactly what I mean. You're done and we'll get someone else to fly your trips.

I know most regionals expect their pilots to be trying to leave for the majors and understand that a class date is not always known right away. In regards to leaving a major for another one I can see them being a little annoyed and letting you go on the spot.

bustinmins
08-28-2007, 11:42 AM
A friend of mine left SWA for FDX. When he emailed in his notice at SWA, his Chief Pilot said, why don't you just consider yourself done today. Send me your stuff.

Personally, while I admire the two-week notice, I wouldn't give one until you are sitting in class.

Case in point - A cargo guy gets a class at DAL. He does the "right thing" and turns in his two-week notice. Shortly after that, 9/11 happens and his class, scheduled for 9/15 is cancelled. He sends a request up the chain to say, "Please rescind (sp) my resignation." His request was denied and he was literally told - "Good luck with your career at Delta."

Eric Stratton
08-28-2007, 12:16 PM
A friend of mine left SWA for FDX. When he emailed in his notice at SWA, his Chief Pilot said, why don't you just consider yourself done today. Send me your stuff.

Personally, while I admire the two-week notice, I wouldn't give one until you are sitting in class.

Case in point - A cargo guy gets a class at DAL. He does the "right thing" and turns in his two-week notice. Shortly after that, 9/11 happens and his class, scheduled for 9/15 is cancelled. He sends a request up the chain to say, "Please rescind (sp) my resignation." His request was denied and he was literally told - "Good luck with your career at Delta."

Did your friend at SWA get paid for the time during his notice?

a buddy of mine was hired at a major pre 9-11 and told them he was leaving but never gave a 2 weeks notice because he hadn't gotten a class date yet. he was lucky enough to stay, but that was at a regional.

thanks

944Turbo
08-28-2007, 12:37 PM
Who does your "buddy" fly for?

7576FO
08-28-2007, 01:13 PM
Most of our Chief Pilots at AA are major major tools and huge cool-aid drinkers. I am just a number and they never let you forget it.

I could see them getting defensive and asking you for your ID while you're giving 2 weeks notice.

captjns
08-28-2007, 01:23 PM
Not uncommon for employees to immediately be escorted off the property depending on their level of employment to prevent sabotage. Same of pilots. It may be on a case by case basis also depending on the relationship between the employee and the supervisor.

mike734
08-28-2007, 03:33 PM
Here is some more advice from an old timer. Never give notice. When you want to quit, call in sick until you run out of sick time. Then let them know. Make sure you are home before they know or you may find yourself having to buy a ticket.

Xray678
08-28-2007, 03:48 PM
Here is some more advice from an old timer. Never give notice. When you want to quit, call in sick until you run out of sick time. Then let them know. Make sure you are home before they know or you may find yourself having to buy a ticket.


He is right. Think of it this way, if they were going to let you go for some reason, would they give you two weeks notice?

Two weeks notice is nice to have, but there is no legal precedent for it. You leave an airline, the odds are very, very small you will be going back there anyway. I would wait til I was in class at my new airline before giving notice.

Outofthebox
08-28-2007, 06:14 PM
He is right. Think of it this way, if they were going to let you go for some reason, would they give you two weeks notice?

Two weeks notice is nice to have, but there is no legal precedent for it. You leave an airline, the odds are very, very small you will be going back there anyway. I would wait til I was in class at my new airline before giving notice.

Problem is you can not do this. Your new employment will ask for a letter of resignation and a phone number to the chief pilot to make sure you are not getting paid by two companies. I would wait until you have a class date and two weeks out drop the notice if you are not sure how you will be treated.

JetJocF14
08-28-2007, 06:23 PM
When I left Eastern to go to work for Flying Tigers I walked into the chief pilot office in Atlanta at 4:45 P.M. and gave my notice I'll be leaving and start work on monday with another airline. Funny thing is that in the ALPA contract if for some reason it did not work out you had something like 30 or 60 days to come back. Don't believe that works today. But concur the 2 week notice is a pipe dream. I would not give my notice till I was assured I had a class date.... Just my thoughts..........;)

JetJocF14
08-28-2007, 06:24 PM
Here is some more advice from an old timer. Never give notice. When you want to quit, call in sick until you run out of sick time. Then let them know. Make sure you are home before they know or you may find yourself having to buy a ticket.

AMEN BROTHER...........:rolleyes:

cbire880
08-28-2007, 07:42 PM
If you did give two weeks notice and they escorted you out immediately, you would be eligible for unemployment. It would count as a layoff technically. You were available for work and the company decided they didn't need your services. Go collect you check, would might not be too bad depending on the state you live in.

Packer Backer
08-28-2007, 08:41 PM
If you did give two weeks notice and they escorted you out immediately, you would be eligible for unemployment. It would count as a layoff technically. You were available for work and the company decided they didn't need your services. Go collect you check, would might not be too bad depending on the state you live in.

Most places that do "walk you off", give you 2 weeks severance instead of having you work your last 2 weeks. So no unemployment.

lostplanetairman
08-28-2007, 09:10 PM
If you did give two weeks notice and they escorted you out immediately, you would be eligible for unemployment. It would count as a layoff technically. You were available for work and the company decided they didn't need your services. Go collect you check, would might not be too bad depending on the state you live in.

Only for the two weeks in which they accepted your resignation early--after that, you resigned and are ineligible.

HRDiva

Eric Stratton
08-29-2007, 07:09 AM
Problem is you can not do this. Your new employment will ask for a letter of resignation and a phone number to the chief pilot to make sure you are not getting paid by two companies. I would wait until you have a class date and two weeks out drop the notice if you are not sure how you will be treated.

that's the problem. he also doesn't know if he'll get 2 weeks notice before the class date.

mike734
08-29-2007, 07:35 AM
When I worked for Mesa years ago, there was a down turn in the industry so the company offered $5000 for anyone who would quit. I guess they did not want to incur the expense of a layoff and the associated training, unemployment etc. Anyway, one of our Brasilia captains got hired by SW so he told them he was leaving and expected to collect the five grand. Nope! They refused to pay because he had another job! Thanks again Jonathan O.

He made his last revenue trip to someplace like Santa Rosa or Stockton and called the company. Either they pay or he walks. They didn't pay so he rented a car and drove home leaving 30 pax stranded. He is now a 15 year SW captain.

Mesa did a similar thing to All WestAir pilots the last days of WestAir. They told them there would be a bonus to all those who stayed until the end. When the end came they changed their story and said the bonus was only for those without a collective bargain agreement. Thank you JO.

Most management is not as bad as JO and Mesa. If other airlines management has a problem with you leaving with short notice they can look no further than JO and airlines like Mesa if looking for someone to blame.

edznaz
08-29-2007, 06:18 PM
Tried to quit my "real job" in IT, and they basically asked to negotiate a part-time deal for me. The big boss supports it, but the guy in the middle is being snarky, trying to cut me off. I've been in class for CAE plus doing 40hr/week remotely. Now the middle guy informs me he either has to resolve or accept my resignation tomorrow. I gave them a "terms" outline, and told them I'm OK whatever they decide. I gave them a weeks notice before I left for class, burning vacation while they figure it out. Of course, I had to step in and put out a fire for them, and now they are giving me grief. The whole "two weeks" thing is outdated. My only concern is the reference, and I have that worked out with the big boss.

Rook
08-29-2007, 06:28 PM
He made his last revenue trip to someplace like Santa Rosa or Stockton and called the company. Either they pay or he walks. They didn't pay so he rented a car and drove home leaving 30 pax stranded. He is now a 15 year SW captain.





Epic mike!

When I left my regional I gave my '2 weeks' but my current gig rushed to put me in class so it actually ended up being 10 days. I had to call in sick for my last 3 trips to get my finances straight (downgraded the vehicle among other things). When I called crewskeds to call in 'sick' for my last trip they actually wished me well.

Skyone
08-29-2007, 07:33 PM
Bravado is great and makes everyone feel great. But one never knows when he/she might need a recomendation letter or similar from that boss you just walked out on. The future is too uncertain in this industry to figure you are hired for life at your new job. Do the right thing and give notice. Your new job might not work out for whatever reason and you just might want back in at you old. Let them be the asses.

I left my last job with a 30 day notice and believe I left on excellent terms. Gave them a little recovery time and still on speaking/email terms with them. But I do agree, never resign or indicate so until you have a sure thing with your new job. Just do the right thing. Just my two fils worth.

vagabond
08-29-2007, 07:51 PM
If you did give two weeks notice and they escorted you out immediately, you would be eligible for unemployment. It would count as a layoff technically. You were available for work and the company decided they didn't need your services. Go collect you check, would might not be too bad depending on the state you live in.

Unemployment law depends greatly on individual state statutes and case law. In Washington State, if you give two weeks notice and the employer does not allow you to serve out the two weeks (i.e., it asks you to leave right away or at some time before the two weeks is up), the case is adjudicated a termination/firing/discharge. At an unemployment hearing, the focus will shift to whether you had done something to cause your termination and whether this something rises to the level of "misconduct." "Layoff" is a very specific term with several elements that must be met first. People who are laid off are eligible for unemployment, and employers do not usually appeal this decision.

Spartan07
08-29-2007, 09:01 PM
Unemployment law depends greatly on individual state statutes and case law. In Washington State, if you give two weeks notice and the employer does not allow you to serve out the two weeks (i.e., it asks you to leave right away or at some time before the two weeks is up), the case is adjudicated a termination/firing/discharge. At an unemployment hearing, the focus will shift to whether you had done something to cause your termination and whether this something rises to the level of "misconduct." "Layoff" is a very specific term with several elements that must be met first. People who are laid off are eligible for unemployment, and employers do not usually appeal this decision.

You're definitely right about unemployment varying between states. Here in Oklahoma (Which can actually be pretty stingy with programs such as this) they even consider getting discharged from the military as being "beyond your control" and award full unemployment benefits.

captjns
08-29-2007, 10:59 PM
Here is some more advice from an old timer. Never give notice. When you want to quit, call in sick until you run out of sick time. Then let them know. Make sure you are home before they know or you may find yourself having to buy a ticket.

Don't forget to take your vacation days either.

bustinmins
08-30-2007, 04:44 AM
Did your friend at SWA get paid for the time during his notice?

a buddy of mine was hired at a major pre 9-11 and told them he was leaving but never gave a 2 weeks notice because he hadn't gotten a class date yet. he was lucky enough to stay, but that was at a regional.

thanks

I believe he was paid but I wouldn't testify to that in court if you know what I mean? We had that discussion well over a year ago. I'm doing well just to remember the meat of the story.

pullup
08-30-2007, 05:20 AM
Problem is you can not do this. Your new employment will ask for a letter of resignation and a phone number to the chief pilot to make sure you are not getting paid by two companies. I would wait until you have a class date and two weeks out drop the notice if you are not sure how you will be treated.

I know from personal experience that this is not true. I gave notice one day prior to my next trip. I used days off while in my first week of class. I'm not sure of the legality of using sick days, I didn't want to find out. My current employer could care less about my letter of resignation, as they never asked for one. My previous employers chief pilot said "good luck I hope you got something good". End of story.

pullup
08-30-2007, 05:23 AM
Oh, and my accrued vacation was paid out in full...

Huggy Bear
08-30-2007, 07:26 AM
He made his last revenue trip to someplace like Santa Rosa or Stockton and called the company. Either they pay or he walks. They didn't pay so he rented a car and drove home leaving 30 pax stranded. He is now a 15 year SW captain.



Leaving someone stranded in Stockton:(. Now that is just mean.

Eric Stratton
08-30-2007, 07:53 AM
Bravado is great and makes everyone feel great. But one never knows when he/she might need a recomendation letter or similar from that boss you just walked out on. The future is too uncertain in this industry to figure you are hired for life at your new job. Do the right thing and give notice. Your new job might not work out for whatever reason and you just might want back in at you old. Let them be the asses.

I left my last job with a 30 day notice and believe I left on excellent terms. Gave them a little recovery time and still on speaking/email terms with them. But I do agree, never resign or indicate so until you have a sure thing with your new job. Just do the right thing. Just my two fils worth.

can I assume that you were friends with them before you left. that would make all the difference in the world. my buddy is relatively new without close ties to the chiefs. I'm also assuming you were with your last company for a while...CAL???

mike734
08-30-2007, 01:34 PM
Leaving someone stranded in Stockton:(. Now that is just mean.
Yeah. The poor FO had to wait for a replacement.