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mike734
09-11-2007, 03:02 PM
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/070911/20070911006160.html?.v=1

Not so good news for the East.


afhercdriver
09-11-2007, 03:18 PM
What does it really say? I am having a hard time picking it out. Help?

Jim

flaps 9
09-11-2007, 03:24 PM
USAPA has received more than 2300 requests from both east and west US Airways pilots to request a representation election from the National Mediation Board. Election request documents continue to arrive. A request count of 50% of eligible pilots, plus one, is required for an election to be held. During the follow-on election a simple majority of voting pilots will determine the new collective bargaining agent. USAPA anticipates that it will begin representing the US Airways pilots in the first quarter of 2008.



I highly doubt there are ANY requests from those on the west side :cool:


mike734
09-11-2007, 03:38 PM
What does it really say? I am having a hard time picking it out. Help?

Jim
National Association Abandons East Pilots, Seniority


The headline says it all.

afhercdriver
09-11-2007, 03:48 PM
National Association Abandons East Pilots, Seniority


The headline says it all.

Easy enough!

RedBaron007
09-11-2007, 05:50 PM
How many pilots are on the East side and how many are on the West? I'd assume there are more on the East, but how many more?

I agree it's not good news for East to have ALPA opposed to changing the agreement, but I'd think it's better that things are looking good for creating an in-house union. Maybe I'm missing something though?

HPilot
09-11-2007, 07:16 PM
Ah yeah, and the arbitration will still stand. This all achieves what?

Eric Stratton
09-12-2007, 02:35 PM
Are they actually saying that mergers should only be date of hire only???

Molon Labe
09-12-2007, 08:30 PM
In answer to the question by Eric Stratton," are they saying that they should be date of hire only?" The short answer is Yes Sort Of , in that all the past mergers at USAIR have essentially gone that way even when there were significant differences with regard to equipment size and nature and character of the flying. i.e. Piedmont. The Piedmont pilots some of whom saw the B767 come onto the property and flew it from that moment forward were a bit aghast when 5 years after the date of the merger they were blown clean off of the airplane and replaced by AAA (All American Airways) pilots who had an earlier date of hire. There is something of a sense of entitlement at USAIR East based on the past history of date of hire outweighing virtually all other considerations. Since date of hire has not trumped all other cards in this situation they are unhappy to say the least.

cactusmike
09-12-2007, 09:43 PM
ALPA National changed merger policy about 1992, after the US Air/PSA/Piedmont merger. DOH was removed as a criteria of merger policy.

Prater and National came out with this yesterday:

Dear Fellow Pilots,
During the month of August, I traveled to pilot bases up and down the East Coast to talk to you—and listen to you—about the ongoing merger dispute.

I appreciate the thoughts and pleas of the many pilots who came out to meet with me. Their emotions ran strong, and they spoke from the heart. I heard from many East pilots who say that they hate the Nicolau award and would rather live under the current bankruptcy-negotiated contract than submit to this award. I heard from other East pilots who disagree, recognizing that there are significant gains and meaningful career protections to be had under a new single agreement. We spent many hours together, and it was clear that all of these pilots—including the handful from the West who attended—are committed to their careers and their future.

On September 14, I’ll meet with pilots in Phoenix. I know that I’ll hear many West pilots also speaking from the heart, wanting to know why their union has not yet presented the seniority award under our own policies.

Whether from East or West, however, it is also clear that too many pilots are not aware of the facts that underlie this situation. Over and over during my recent visits, it was clear that they had been provided with incorrect information. When I explained the facts, they often responded, “I didn’t know that.”

It is time to hear the facts again and make decisions based on facts. In this newsletter, and in communications to come, ALPA will tell you the facts. Yes, they are the facts as we, your ALPA brothers and sisters from other airlines, see them, and, yes, some of you may disagree. I’ve personally lived through numerous mergers and, regardless of the pain of a new seniority list, my fellow pilots and I have managed to separate the merger wars from our contract negotiations. Despite the failure of your leaders to find a mutual agreement during the seniority integration, I believe you can successfully reach a solution between your pilot groups. Failure to achieve consensual agreement between the East and West union leaders to negotiate a contract with more than parity would be a shame for us and a disaster for the families of US Airways.

In Unity,


Captain John Prater
President


Jump to:
MERGER POLICY MEC ACTIONS EXECUTIVE COUNCIL ACTIONS COLLECTIVE BARGAINING

MERGER POLICY

Fact
ALPA Merger Policy was written and revised over many years by ALPA Boards of Directors and Executive Boards. These governing bodies consist entirely of local council representatives or MEC chairmen from pilot groups throughout our union (including an AAA representative who served on the committee that developed the 1991 policy modification following the mergers of Ozark–TWA, Republic–Northwest, Delta–Western, Piedmont–USAir, and others in the post-deregulation era). They are pilots just like you, and every one of them was elected by their brother and sister pilots.

Fact
ALPA Merger Policy strictly limits the role of ALPA National in seniority integration. That policy—as adopted by pilot representatives—states:

The role of ALPA in seniority integration is solely to provide the process by which the affected pilot groups on ALPA airlines arrive at the merged seniority list for presentation to management, through their respective merger representatives, using arbitration if necessary.

During your arbitration hearings, there was only one protest filed. The AAA MEC protested a submission by the AWA Merger Committee—a contract-costing document produced for the use of the Joint Negotiating Committee—and ALPA ruled to exclude the document.

Fact
Under ALPA Merger Policy, your MEC-elected merger representatives are completely responsible for the merged seniority list. Here is what ALPA Merger Policy says:

Responsibility for the merged seniority list falls upon the respective merger representatives with ALPA National in a neutral position on the merits.

Fact
When your elected reps submitted the seniority dispute to arbitration, they knew exactly what the Merger Policy says on the subject—that “the Award of the Arbitration Board shall be final and binding on all parties to the arbitration” and “shall be defended by ALPA.” Merger Policy further states that the “merged seniority list will be presented to management and ALPA will use all reasonable means at its disposal to compel the company to accept and implement the merged seniority list.”

Fact
Because arbitration takes the decisions away from line pilots, this procedure was the method of last resort after your LEC reps and your Merger Committees failed to come to an agreement through negotiations or mediation. In the AAA–AWA case, Arbitrator Nicolau, observing that the positions of both Merger Committees would create future conflict, called both sides to a special meeting in the midst of his deliberations and gave them one last opportunity to come to an agreement on their own before he acted. It is important to note that neither side made a move. [Transcript of arbitration hearing’s last day]

Fact
Both ALPA Merger Policy and the Transition Agreement bar management from using an integrated list until there is a single collective bargaining agreement for the new merged airline. Your management, both MECs, the pilot groups, and ALPA’s president still need to get an agreement completed before the seniority list can be implemented. A decision by the Executive Council on the US Airways MEC’s request to set aside the award still wouldn’t answer the question of how to translate the seniority award into use.

[return to top]


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MEC ACTIONS


Excerpt from US Airwaves, Summer 2005

Fact

ALPA and your MECs sent out extensive communications from the time the merger was announced in 2005, informing you of the process and the consequences, and telling you why negotiating and mediating were the best routes to take. (In addition, Air Line Pilot’s May 2006 issue published a four-page article explaining the entire process.)
US Airwaves, Summer 2005
AWA MEC Bulletin, September 2005
AWA Merger Mania, July 2005
What Every Pilot Needs to Know About Mergers, Air Line Pilot, May 2006

Fact
Your MEC and your merger representatives hired your merger counsel and paid for counsel out of your merger assessments. Your MEC and merger representatives, with that merger counsel’s assistance, determined all elements of the strategy for your negotiations, including your arbitration.

Fact
The US Airways MEC and merger representatives argued in both the seniority negotiations and seniority arbitration that the seniority lists should be integrated on the basis of date of hire. That was absolutely their right to argue. Fact: In 1991 the ALPA Executive Board amended ALPA Merger Policy to remove date of hire as a factor referred to in the policy. The members of that Executive Board were MEC chairmen—pilots—from throughout the union.

Fact
The AAA and AWA Merger Committees selected George Nicolau as mediator/arbitrator for the seniority integration. Mr. Nicolau was chosen by merger attorneys for both sides alternately striking names from a list of 17 suggestions provided by ALPA. Here is what the US Airways merger representatives told the US Airways pilots in a hotline dated February 2, 2006:

“We wanted to secure [an arbitrator] to our satisfaction as soon as possible. We are pleased with the selection of George Nicolau.”

Fact
Once the MECs were unable to determine an acceptable fair and equitable solution, they turned total control over to the arbitrator. Not once did anyone from the two MECs even suggest that ALPA National take over the process or indicate in any way that anything was wrong with the process, which completely followed the Merger Policy. Your local council and merger reps understood their duties and responsibilities. If any of them now proclaim their ignorance of the process and the ramifications of their decisions, that is simply an attempt to avoid responsibility.

[return to top]


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EXECUTIVE COUNCIL ACTIONS

Fact
After the US Airways MEC requested that the Executive Council set aside the seniority award and order another arbitration, the Executive Council gave the AAA MEC a chance to prove that the award should be set aside even though Merger Policy states that the award is “final and binding.” To this date, the US Airways MEC has not offered evidence of any impropriety that would support a finding that ALPA has not provided the exact process that it was obligated to provide.

[return to top]


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COLLECTIVE BARGAINING

Fact
The Transition Agreement (as approved by both MECs and both pilot groups) provides that ALPA, the US Airways MEC, the America West MEC, and the management of US Airways/America West negotiate a single collective bargaining agreement covering a single corporation operating as a single airline. This includes provisions to develop and present a single seniority list through ALPA Merger Policy.

Fact
Financial analysis prepared by ALPA staff and presented to both MECs made it clear that the best opportunity for significant gains in collective bargaining within ALPA exists at the new US Airways. Here we have the strongest negotiating position, the best financial case, and the most leverage.

Fact
Absent the present controversy, ALPA and the two MECs would be well on their way to negotiating a strong, single collective bargaining agreement with substantial gains in all key areas—pay, benefits, and work rules. Pilots from both East and West need a new agreement, and they need it now. The current East collective bargaining agreement was driven by the second bankruptcy, and the West agreement by the ATSB process.

Fact
Until the day the seniority award was announced, the pilots of both groups wielded their leverage expertly. [Click here for an example.] Since that day, however, negotiations have stalled. The award controversy is squandering leverage that could benefit US Airways pilots and the entire profession for many years to come.

Fact
Only by working together can the East and West pilots make sure that they all get a fair share of the benefits of the merger. If you remain divided over the seniority award, the only one making money will be Doug Parker and his shareholders—money that should be going into pilots’ pockets.

Fact
ALPA has a plan. It’s called working together to provide some career protection and get a good contract with substantial economic gain. That is the work of the Rice Committee as assigned by the Executive Council. The Rice Committee (ALPA First Vice President Paul Rice [UAL], Captain Ray Miller [NWA], Captain Dave Webb [FDX], Captain Matt Marsh [CHA], Captain Paul Emmert [ALA], and Captain Larry Schulte [UAL ret., former EAL]) is working with representatives of both MECs, including the JNC, to put together real-world solutions that address the concerns of both the East and West pilots and bring them to agreement. This work is proceeding slowly because the challenges are so difficult, but all parties remain fully engaged in this process. [Click here for the current Rice Committee Report.]

Fact
Management has made recent proposals that increase pay, improve vacation, allow for greater contributions to retirement plans, and substantially enhance work rules. It’s clear that they are not finished bargaining and more significant improvements are possible. Management has also stated its willingness to consider reasonable career protection provisions that are mutually agreed to by both pilot groups. Your families can finally escape the bankruptcy and ATSB hell, but only if you tell your LEC reps to find the one solution that both East and West pilots can support

Molon Labe
09-13-2007, 08:57 PM
Hello to CactusMike, The jist of my comment is that USAIR East doesn't seem to realize that merger policy changed in 1992 and they don't like the post 1992 policy. The previous one served them so well against Piedmont and PSA. Much as date of hire served and is still over-serving some pilot group elements now some cannot mentally part with it. Hang in there!

cactusmike
09-13-2007, 10:11 PM
You hit the nail right on the head. It is hard to see why the East pilots have so much trouble with the concept.

No east pilot has lost seniority because of the Nicolau award. The West, however, has seen 517 pilots placed on top of us and our growth stopped. We don't whine about this because we just want the seniority list implemented so we can focus on a joint contract. The east has refused to negotiate on a joint contract and they have asked for separate operations indefinitely. The company, to their credit has said "no effing way".

IronWalt
09-13-2007, 11:01 PM
"No east pilot has lost seniority because of the Nicolau award."

I will remember this statement when I feel the staples in my back placed there by your 2005 hires who get to steal my seniority all because of the TWO FURLOUGHS that were my fault. If you think any of us getting stapled are going to sit quietly and not screw up this operation beyond recognition then you have another thing to figure out.

100 percent of the pilots on the east side have been screwed enough by past managements and our MEC's incompetance. We are not about to sit tight for you to screw us too.

I have been watching and listening to the east pilots since I have been back. I had thought they might settle down as the months went by. But the anger is getting worse. Not better. And it is going to effect everyone. East and West.

MrSuupafly
09-16-2007, 01:53 AM
USAPA has received more than 2300 requests from both east and west US Airways pilots to request a representation election from the National Mediation Board. Election request documents continue to arrive. A request count of 50% of eligible pilots, plus one, is required for an election to be held. During the follow-on election a simple majority of voting pilots will determine the new collective bargaining agent. USAPA anticipates that it will begin representing the US Airways pilots in the first quarter of 2008.



I highly doubt there are ANY requests from those on the west side :cool:



The most senior pilots on AWA's seniority list probably don't like the fact that 500+ guys are getting put ahead of them. They might do better with date of hire.

RedeyeAV8r
09-17-2007, 08:20 AM
The most senior pilots on AWA's seniority list probably don't like the fact that 500+ guys are getting put ahead of them. They might do better with date of hire.

I doubt any AWA (USAir West) Pilot wanted or thought they would do better with DOH, seeing how the Junior FO at USAir East (before recent furlough recalls) is a 1987 DOH.
The sad part of all this is even if the AAA East guys are successful at decertifying ALPA, they will still have to abide buy Nicholau's arbitration award on the seniority list, only now they will even further divide East and West. A great thing to happen in the middle of negotiations...........NOT!


All that will really get accomplished is they will add a few more years to the negotiation timeline.

We did this at FedEx and it cost us 10 years in negotiations.

HPilot
09-17-2007, 12:03 PM
"No east pilot has lost seniority because of the Nicolau award."

I will remember this statement when I feel the staples in my back placed there by your 2005 hires who get to steal my seniority all because of the TWO FURLOUGHS that were my fault. If you think any of us getting stapled are going to sit quietly and not screw up this operation beyond recognition then you have another thing to figure out.

100 percent of the pilots on the east side have been screwed enough by past managements and our MEC's incompetance. We are not about to sit tight for you to screw us too.

I have been watching and listening to the east pilots since I have been back. I had thought they might settle down as the months went by. But the anger is getting worse. Not better. And it is going to effect everyone. East and West.

What are you talking about? The list was made by an impartial arbitrator. Stapled? Where did you think you were going to end up? Ahead of active pilots from the acquiring company? You've got to be frigin kidding. We're not happy your senior guys got the top 500+ spots. Do you honestly think management will sit back and watch you try and screw up the company. Do you look down the barrels of loaded weapons as a hobby?



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