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View Full Version : Any truth to this?


frozenboxhauler
03-16-2009, 09:30 PM
I was in Japan last week and was told by two different people that JAL/JAS had cancelled all of their pilot contracts with foreign nationals. any one else hear this?
fbh


CloudSailor
03-16-2009, 09:34 PM
Sadly it's true.

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/foreign/37712-jal.html

frozenboxhauler
03-16-2009, 09:54 PM
Sadly it's true.

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/foreign/37712-jal.html

Thanks Cloud, what a shame.
fbh


flyboy8272
03-17-2009, 07:49 PM
I think, during economic times like these, that US companies should be required to lay off all non-US citizens before laying of any US citizens... it's happening elsewhere! Protect our own!

cactusmike
03-17-2009, 09:20 PM
I think, during economic times like these, that US companies should be required to lay off all non-US citizens before laying of any US citizens... it's happening elsewhere! Protect our own!


Sure, trash the seniority list for xenophobia? Good luck with that. If someone is flying for a US carrier then they have a right to live and work in the USA.

Pilotpip
03-17-2009, 09:38 PM
How is that not a double standard? They're doing that to Americans with the right to live and work in other countries according to this.

Colnago
03-18-2009, 07:33 AM
How is that not a double standard? They're doing that to Americans with the right to live and work in other countries according to this.
It's far from a double standard because this pertains to contracting agencies of foreign nationals. It doesn't pertain to legal permanent residents of Japan. In other words, you could have been born in the US, fallen in love with a Japanese girl, married her, moved over there, obtained permanent residency in Japan and this wouldn't have applied to you because you're not part of some contracting agency. Same deal w/ the US.

ImEbee
03-18-2009, 07:33 AM
The difference is there is a much longer and complicated procecess to get a green card in the US versus foeign pilot contracts overseas. While its tough to see news of US pilots suffering from protectionism, its just not how our economy operates. Laying off foeign workers before Americans would seriously deepen the problems in our economy but would also seriously affect its recovery.

I mean really, we all know non-citizens who work our companies. Would you tell them to their face that you would rather see them laid off out of seniority just because they are not American?

Colnago
03-18-2009, 07:42 AM
I mean really, we all know non-citizens who work our companies. Would you tell them to their face that you would rather see them laid off out of seniority just because they are not American?
Well see, it's not so simple as some people would *like* it to be for whatever selfish reasons. You currently have legal non-citizens injecting money into our economy through consumer spending which in turn helps sustain whatever jobs we still have. To lay off green card holders would be unfair for just that reason, especially when they have undergone the LONG process to obtain the right to permanently live in this country. That's the whole point of obtaining permanent residency.

With regards to the JAL thing, I could see it being a double-standard if JAL would be laying off legal PERMANENT RESIDENTS of Japan. However, they're not doing that. They're laying off CONTRACT workers. As such, the whole idea of a double standard is just some bickering because people are very touchy right now in this economy and they resort to being xenophobes. It's an easy mentality!

If foreigners going to work contracts in Japan want to be protected from JAL layoffs, they could go the hard route like everyone else does who comes to the US and gets a green card and US FAA licenses. They can apply for Japanese permanent residency, and begin certification towards JCAB certification.

This world isn't easy, and I puke at the sense of entitlement some people have. There aren't any shortcuts.

ImEbee
03-18-2009, 08:06 AM
Agreed. My point was do those who pop off about Americans first really feel that way or are they reacting in fustration? Because when has the US ever benefited from "closing the borders" per say?

Colnago
03-18-2009, 08:18 AM
Agreed. My point was do those who pop off about Americans first really feel that way or are they reacting in fustration? Because when has the US ever benefited from "closing the borders" per say?
For sure, and I wasn't disagreeing with you at all. It's a silly thought which I think people react such way out of desperation/frustration, like you mentioned. By laying off all non-citizens, you'd be getting rid of a lot of talented professionals (e.g. scientists, surgeons, etc...) It's a ridiculous thought.

KoruPilot
03-18-2009, 03:37 PM
I wonder if this is a bit of a rash and desperate decision for which JAL is going to end up with a long term regret. They have had a large amount of foreign pilots, many Americans amongst them, for quite some time now.

At some point, possibly in the not too distant future, I would think they'd want more hulls in the air again. For that matter, cancelling all the contracts accounts for a large part of their pilot force. SQ is also getting rid of contractors, but not to such a degree, and so far my friends who have started there in the last six months are holding on to their jobs.

Quite simply, good pilots go to good contracts, as is the opposite true. Perhaps just another in a long line of bad decisions made by JAL over the past number of years. They must, at some point, look across the ramp at their once junior competition and winder how they do it.

cactusmike
03-18-2009, 09:43 PM
JAL has had gaijin pilots for over 50 years. I agree with you, I think this was a political decision to bow to the union that they will regret. It also gives their competitor some very well qualified pilots.

It looks like I will be staying where I am now for a while, since these guys should get the preferential treatment at ANA. More power to them, they need the job.