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View Full Version : Fdx- Cdg-hkg


Dakota
03-16-2010, 04:23 PM
I noticed that they are a few HKG-CDG trips in open time. Is this a new leg? I thought we stopped in Almaty before going to CDG. Just curious.


hyperone
03-16-2010, 04:52 PM
Are you on the ALPA E-mail list? Here's the latest from ALPA about these pairings.

MD11 Captain RFO PairingsTuesday, March 9, 2010 7:33 PM
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: "fdxmec-fastread" <[email protected]>

MD11 Captain RFO Pairings
The Company has scheduled Captains as RFOs in the MD11 Bid Pack for APR2010 for the new CDG-HKG-CDG route. See Section 12.D.8.a.i. These pairings are designated as “1-CAP.”

Per the CBA section 22.B.2 and the FOM 2.39, the Captain of Record will be the Senior Captain ONLY on double crewed flight segments. On any single augmented flight segment, the PIC is always the Captain holding the “full crew” pairing. In the example pairing below, the Captain awarded this pairing will be the designated RFO on all segments except the one from HKG-CDG (double augmented). On that leg, the PIC will be determined by system seniority.


3017 TH REPORT AT 07:18 (02:18 L.T.) EFFECTIVE APR 01 ONLY
1 CAP
DAY FLT. EQP DEPARTS (L.T.) ARRIVES (L.T.) BLK. BLK. DUTY CR. LAYOVER
01TH 0008 F16 MEM 0818(0318) CDG 1659(1859) 08:41 BH/DH
PULLMAN BERCY HOTEL 011-33-1-446-73400 08:41 10:11 08:41 CDG 51:06
TRANS BY URBANRIDE-CHABE LIMO 011-33-141-209-500
03SA 0038 F26 CDG 2135(2335) DEL 0550(1120) 08:15 DH/BH
ITC MAURYA 011-91-11-2611-4444 08:15 09:45 08:15 DEL 33:50
TRANS BY ITC MAURYA 011-91-11-2611-4444
05MO CX0694 343 DEL 1810(2340) HKG 2345(0745) 05:35
SHERATON HKG HTL & TOWERS 011-852-23-69-1111 00:00 08:05 05:35 HKG 32:35
TRANS BY PARKLANE LIMOUSINE 011-852-2377-0733
07WE 0279 F16 HKG 0950(1750) CDG 2234(0034) 12:44 DH/BH
HOTEL CONCORDE LA FAYETTE 011-33-1-40-68-50- 12:44 14:14 12:44 CDG 18:36
TRANS BY URBANRIDE-CHABE LIMO 011-33-141-209-500
08TH 0005 F16 CDG 1840(2040) STN 1953(2053) 01:13 DH/BH
08TH 0005 F16 STN 2053(2153) EWR 0431(0031) 07:38
COURTYARD BY MARRIOTT-ELIZABETH 908-436-9800 08:51 11:21 08:51 EWR 28:04
TRANS TO GOLDEN TOUCH/II 973-565-2440/USE VANS
TRANS FR COURTYARD BY MARRIOTT-ELIZABETH 908-436-9800
10SA DL5687 E75 EWR 1005(0605) MEM 1303(0803) 02:58
00:00 04:28 03:00M
CREDIT HRS: 62:00T BLK HRS: 38:31 LDGS: 5 TAFB: 222:15

AFW_MD11
03-16-2010, 05:03 PM
Are you on the ALPA E-mail list? Here's the latest from ALPA about these pairings.

MD11 Captain RFO PairingsTuesday, March 9, 2010 7:33 PM
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: "fdxmec-fastread" <[email protected]>

MD11 Captain RFO Pairings
The Company has scheduled Captains as RFOs in the MD11 Bid Pack for APR2010 for the new CDG-HKG-CDG route. See Section 12.D.8.a.i. These pairings are designated as “1-CAP.”

Per the CBA section 22.B.2 and the FOM 2.39, the Captain of Record will be the Senior Captain ONLY on double crewed flight segments. On any single augmented flight segment, the PIC is always the Captain holding the “full crew” pairing. In the example pairing below, the Captain awarded this pairing will be the designated RFO on all segments except the one from HKG-CDG (double augmented). On that leg, the PIC will be determined by system seniority.


3017 TH REPORT AT 07:18 (02:18 L.T.) EFFECTIVE APR 01 ONLY
1 CAP
DAY FLT. EQP DEPARTS (L.T.) ARRIVES (L.T.) BLK. BLK. DUTY CR. LAYOVER
01TH 0008 F16 MEM 0818(0318) CDG 1659(1859) 08:41 BH/DH
PULLMAN BERCY HOTEL 011-33-1-446-73400 08:41 10:11 08:41 CDG 51:06
TRANS BY URBANRIDE-CHABE LIMO 011-33-141-209-500
03SA 0038 F26 CDG 2135(2335) DEL 0550(1120) 08:15 DH/BH
ITC MAURYA 011-91-11-2611-4444 08:15 09:45 08:15 DEL 33:50
TRANS BY ITC MAURYA 011-91-11-2611-4444
05MO CX0694 343 DEL 1810(2340) HKG 2345(0745) 05:35
SHERATON HKG HTL & TOWERS 011-852-23-69-1111 00:00 08:05 05:35 HKG 32:35
TRANS BY PARKLANE LIMOUSINE 011-852-2377-0733
07WE 0279 F16 HKG 0950(1750) CDG 2234(0034) 12:44 DH/BH
HOTEL CONCORDE LA FAYETTE 011-33-1-40-68-50- 12:44 14:14 12:44 CDG 18:36
TRANS BY URBANRIDE-CHABE LIMO 011-33-141-209-500
08TH 0005 F16 CDG 1840(2040) STN 1953(2053) 01:13 DH/BH
08TH 0005 F16 STN 2053(2153) EWR 0431(0031) 07:38
COURTYARD BY MARRIOTT-ELIZABETH 908-436-9800 08:51 11:21 08:51 EWR 28:04
TRANS TO GOLDEN TOUCH/II 973-565-2440/USE VANS
TRANS FR COURTYARD BY MARRIOTT-ELIZABETH 908-436-9800
10SA DL5687 E75 EWR 1005(0605) MEM 1303(0803) 02:58
00:00 04:28 03:00M
CREDIT HRS: 62:00T BLK HRS: 38:31 LDGS: 5 TAFB: 222:15

I think he might have been referring to the half-dozen + trips that popped into open time today for MARCH 2010 - not April???

But, of course, these trips were not part of the "known flying" we were going to be doing in March.

They just sprung up all of a sudden in one day to be placed into open time - and frozen to be directly divied out to whomever the company desires.

amazing to me how these 40, 50, even 81 CH Plus trips just fall out of the sky into the flight operation with little or no warning.

or......??.......no......surely the company wouldn't be hiding "known flying" in order to water down the BLGs (and now the SAM/BUV) in order to justify/extend 4A2b?

:confused: :rolleyes:


hyperone
03-16-2010, 05:27 PM
Sorry, not MEM based. If they are in March, then yes, they are very questionable. Speaking of ALPA, have you contacted Contract Enforcement about these pairings showing up and then being frozen? I don't have very much faith in their ability to change this, but at least we can register the protest.

Dakota
03-16-2010, 05:27 PM
Yeah, I'm on the ALPA e-mail list. I wasn't talking about April! I was curious about the trips that dropped into F/O Open time. The RFO's are F/Os; not Capts.

KnightFlyer
03-16-2010, 05:40 PM
New double crew routes must have 1 Cap and 1 F/O as RFOs for the first 3 months of the new route. The March ones that popped in should have a Cap RFO on the double crew leg.

trashhauler
03-16-2010, 06:35 PM
Yeah, I'm on the ALPA e-mail list. I wasn't talking about April! I was curious about the trips that dropped into F/O Open time. The RFO's are F/Os; not Capts.

All of these trips in open time start in the March bid month, but none of the HKG - CDG or CDG - HKG flights actually occur until the APR bid month.

AFW_MD11
03-16-2010, 06:52 PM
All of these trips in open time start in the March bid month, but none of the HKG - CDG or CDG - HKG flights actually occur until the APR bid month.

If it was "known flying" it should have been in the March Bidpack then.

Are you trying to say the company didn't know we'd be operating these flights until today?

trashhauler
03-16-2010, 09:28 PM
If it was "known flying" it should have been in the March Bidpack then.

Are you trying to say the company didn't know we'd be operating these flights until today?

No, not saying that at all. I should have known better then respond to something here. I was answering a question that somebody posted. So, BACK OFF!!!

pilot141
03-16-2010, 11:12 PM
Relax, Francis.

I get his point - check trip 2401/25MAR.

Starts in the March bid month, but the actual HKG-CDG leg doesn't occur until 29 MAR, which is the first day of the April bid month.

It seems to me that if the company knew that a HKG-CDG leg would occur on the first day of the April bid month they could build a trip in the March bidpack that covered it.

Instead, they drop a trip into open time with a double-deadhead and over $10,000 of bank money to fly one leg.

Right now they are only showing a basic crew on that leg, but I wonder if they will try to staff it with one captain and 3 FOs in order to save money/screw the crew force?

I don't know, but it seems fishy to me.

AFW_MD11
03-17-2010, 05:01 PM
Relax, Francis.

I get his point - check trip 2401/25MAR.

Starts in the March bid month, but the actual HKG-CDG leg doesn't occur until 29 MAR, which is the first day of the April bid month.

It seems to me that if the company knew that a HKG-CDG leg would occur on the first day of the April bid month they could build a trip in the March bidpack that covered it.

Instead, they drop a trip into open time with a double-deadhead and over $10,000 of bank money to fly one leg.

Right now they are only showing a basic crew on that leg, but I wonder if they will try to staff it with one captain and 3 FOs in order to save money/screw the crew force?

I don't know, but it seems fishy to me.

That was EXACTLY my point. The company MUST HAVE KNOWN about these trips all along, and they SHOULD have been included in the March bidpacks.

between CA, FO, RFO, and RF2 there were a total of 15 XTRA pairings generated totalling roughly 730 CH adding, on average, 48+ CH per pilot to the flying schedule for March/April - zero of which was added into/accounted for in either March or April bidpacks.

my point is that the company knew about this flying all along, and held it out of both March and April bidpacks in order to artificially LOWER BLGs (and SAM and BUV)

question is.....who at the union is questioning this and/or holding the company accountable for this type of manipulation of the flight schedule?

2cylinderdriver
03-17-2010, 06:34 PM
That was EXACTLY my point. The company MUST HAVE KNOWN about these trips all along, and they SHOULD have been included in the March bidpacks.

between CA, FO, RFO, and RF2 there were a total of 15 XTRA pairings generated totalling roughly 730 CH adding, on average, 48+ CH per pilot to the flying schedule for March/April - zero of which was added into/accounted for in either March or April bidpacks.

my point is that the company knew about this flying all along, and held it out of both March and April bidpacks in order to artificially LOWER BLGs (and SAM and BUV)

question is.....who at the union is questioning this and/or holding the company accountable for this type of manipulation of the flight schedule?

Q: Have you contacted the Union to ask these questions?

The Walrus
03-17-2010, 06:38 PM
Q: Have you contacted the Union to ask these questions?

He posted it on APC, isn't that enough?

AFW_MD11
03-17-2010, 06:54 PM
Q: Have you contacted the Union to ask these questions?

A: yes

(I'll post any info/replies I get from ALPA - but don't hold your breath)



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