Airline Pilot Forums

Airline Pilot Forums was designed to be a community where working airline pilots can share ideas and information about the aviation field. In the forum you will find information about major and regional airline carriers, career training, interview and job seeker help, finance, and living the airline pilot lifestyle.




MX727
03-25-2010, 07:41 PM
Got these job listings from Curt Lewis & Associates, LLC:

Announcement (http://campaign.constantcontact.com/render?v=001qwhULkbmHDt7wcBccsxGh7uI2K23sYcSb32NRk WSRyWucjZReHVO3y44y3Zn9B-B2NRUClXSnZT0dWNIZa6pgAR_zu-XEFnb_ugReZdxB5I%3D)

Senior AOD Safety Specialist (FOQA) (http://fedex.hodesiq.com/careers/job_detail.aspx?User_ID=&FedexID=3131289&Locale=en)

AOD Safety Specialist (FOQA) (http://fedex.hodesiq.com/careers/job_detail.aspx?User_ID=&FedexID=3131288&Locale=en)

Free subscription to daily flight safety news here:

Flight Safety News Subscription (http://fsinfo.org/subscribe.htm)


MD11Fr8Dog
03-26-2010, 09:06 AM
Got these job listings from Curt Lewis & Associates, LLC:

Announcement (http://campaign.constantcontact.com/render?v=001qwhULkbmHDt7wcBccsxGh7uI2K23sYcSb32NRk WSRyWucjZReHVO3y44y3Zn9B-B2NRUClXSnZT0dWNIZa6pgAR_zu-XEFnb_ugReZdxB5I%3D)

Senior AOD Safety Specialist (FOQA) (http://fedex.hodesiq.com/careers/job_detail.aspx?User_ID=&FedexID=3131289&Locale=en)

AOD Safety Specialist (FOQA) (http://fedex.hodesiq.com/careers/job_detail.aspx?User_ID=&FedexID=3131288&Locale=en)

Free subscription to daily flight safety news here:

Flight Safety News Subscription (http://fsinfo.org/subscribe.htm)


I'll eat my hat, its up in my closet, if we ever get an acceptable agreement for a FOQA program!

MaydayMark
03-26-2010, 09:10 AM
Years overdue! A welcome change is in the works :D

Maybe our accident record finally got somebody's attention?


MD11Fr8Dog
03-26-2010, 09:18 AM
Years overdue! A welcome change is in the works :D

Maybe our accident record finally got somebody's attention?

I hope you're right! I'll be eating scrambled eggs if you are! :D

MX727
03-26-2010, 07:39 PM
I'm thinking (hoping?) the new VP of Training got here and immediately said: YGTBSM!

md11retiree
03-27-2010, 04:40 AM
Years overdue! A welcome change is in the works :D

Maybe our accident record finally got somebody's attention?

I tried hard to get FOQA and ASAP through 10 years ago when I worked for DW in ALPA Safety. Corporate lawyers had their own agenda. Now you might finally get it. Gate keeper was a major issue. Hope it sees new light.

ptarmigan
03-27-2010, 06:42 AM
I tried hard to get FOQA and ASAP through 10 years ago when I worked for DW in ALPA Safety. Corporate lawyers had their own agenda. Now you might finally get it. Gate keeper was a major issue. Hope it sees new light.

Just curious, what is the incentive for the company for this? They have this data now, and full access. An agreement would just reduce their access and slow it down with gate keepers.

md11retiree
04-09-2010, 06:18 AM
Just curious, what is the incentive for the company for this? They have this data now, and full access. An agreement would just reduce their access and slow it down with gate keepers.

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. DW & EL had a verbal agreement that FOQA data could only be identified by the union gate keeper. FDX has wireless and downloadable access to FOQA data cards in airplanes, but the info SHOULD be crew de-identified in a download. If you have a departure/arrival airport (not both allowed) and a time stamp, no rocket scientology needed here to figure out who the crew was plus, how many legs per day does a long haul a/c do? Duh! FDX needs a written agreement between the company and union to protect against any move by the FAA to obtain FOQA data. FDX might be sitting on a potential problem IF the FAA demanded data WITHOUT FOQA protection. FOQA is needed to spot possible trends that might be leading to an incident and is preventable. DW thinks that FOQA and ASAP will be implemented very shortly for FDX. It's been in the works for 10-repeat 10-years. Hope this helps.

XUSair
04-09-2010, 08:31 AM
USair had both FOQA and ASAP programs up and running in 1999. They also went from the worst safety record in the industry to the best. These programs work! USair was serious about safety, not just lip service. The blame game ended, the culture changed, and programs such as these were started. They even had an Enders type audit that they made available to the crew force ( imagine that). The sad fact is, safety is second to control at FedEx. Maybe some long overdue real changes are on the horizon. Too bad it is a decade late.

MX727
04-09-2010, 08:46 AM
FDX needs a written agreement between the company and union to protect against any move by the FAA to obtain FOQA data. FDX might be sitting on a potential problem IF the FAA demanded data WITHOUT FOQA protection.


In 2001, the FAA issued FAR 13.401(e) which states: "Except for criminal or deliberate acts, the administrator will not use an operator's FOQA data or aggregate FOQA data in an enforcement action against that operator or its employees when such FOQA data or aggregate FOQA data is obtained from a FOQA program that is approved by the administrator."

More info from 2004 advisory circular:

AC-120-82 (http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/0/40c02fc39c1577b686256e8a005afb0a/$FILE/AC120-82.pdf)

In short, FDX has no protection right now from the FAA accessing the QAR information. But, in order to get the FOQA program approved to protect them from the FAA, they have to agree with the union not to use the data for disciplinary actions. So, they have been stuck, because they just couldn't come to terms with the thought of giving up control to the gatekeeper, even in the interest of safety. They have been more interested in the prospect of discipline than protecting themselves from the FAA. Hopefully they have finally seen the light.

MaydayMark
04-09-2010, 09:15 AM
USair had both FOQA and ASAP programs up and running in 1999. They also went from the worst safety record in the industry to the best. These programs work! USair was serious about safety, not just lip service. The blame game ended, the culture changed, and programs such as these were started. They even had an Enders type audit that they made available to the crew force ( imagine that). The sad fact is, safety is second to control at FedEx. Maybe some long overdue real changes are on the horizon. Too bad it is a decade late.

Many of the major airlines were insightful enough to see the benefits of these safety programs many years ago. It would be difficult to explain Fedex's thought process, especially considering our horrendous safety record. :eek: AT least now maybe they've seen the light ... (good job JP!)

md11retiree
04-09-2010, 10:50 AM
Many of the major airlines were insightful enough to see the benefits of these safety programs many years ago. It would be difficult to explain Fedex's thought process, especially considering our horrendous safety record. :eek: AT least now maybe they've see the light ... (good job JP!)

Mayday...we talked about this years ago. It was very easy to explain the FDX thought process ten years ago: they were dealing with a new contract and ASAP + FOQA were on the backburner to more important issues such as $$$ and work conditions. You and I hopefully put safety first and money a very close second. The lawyers think the opposite. Also, I took a group of union folks up to USAir back in 2000 to view their ASAP and FOQA in-place programs and was very impressed. They had company/union committees for both. As I said, you will have them in place, hopefully, very soon.