Airline Pilot Forums

Airline Pilot Forums was designed to be a community where working airline pilots can share ideas and information about the aviation field. In the forum you will find information about major and regional airline carriers, career training, interview and job seeker help, finance, and living the airline pilot lifestyle.




SteveCostello
06-29-2012, 07:42 AM
Two quick questions I have as I consider the possibility of working towards a corporate aviation career:

1.) What are corporate fliers doing when they aren't flying, studying, simming, flight planning, or otherwise directly involved with the flight operations of the company aircraft?

2.) There is a lot... a LOT... of job dissatisfaction on APC from those in Part 121 operation. The folks that are unhappily employed (or... have decided to leave the field, but still hang around here for years, for some reason) spread a fairly dark cloud over this place, and I can certainly see why. Does that same cloud darken Part 91 and Part 135 operations to the extend it does for commercial ops? Sure... the experience is different everywhere, some places are not going to be great, some places are excellent. But the cloud over the commercial operations is pretty darned pervasive, and it seems like they are always in deep IMC with regards to their career outlook. Is it at least MVFR over here in the 91/135 world?


Mink
06-29-2012, 10:50 AM
It depends...

1. At my operation, I have volunteered to take on a few projects when not flying. I have the expertise (safety stuff) and I have the time. But outside of flying, prepping to fly, minor paperwork after flying, or training, we don't have to do anything. Sit home and watch Oprah. Wait, she's ben cancelled. Anyway...

2. I've only been in corp aviation 3.5 years, but it seems to me there are a handful of really good, satisfying, well-paying corp jobs and a whole $hitpot of crappy ones. But like everything in aviation, it's a progression and you can expect to pay your dues at a less-than-optimum job for a while until something better presents itself. As for the issues the 121 guys deal with, each job has its goods and bads. I have no union protection and my schedule is completely fluid. But I fly flawless jets to interesting places and work for/with good people and get paid well.

No "one size fits all" answer, but I do think there are some gem corp job out there that don't get much press. Trick is finding them and getting in the door.

Mink
06-29-2012, 11:11 AM
Just to add, a friend at a major corp flight department has a very solid schedule, and gets extra pay for any additional non-flying duties (ex: Fleet Standards guy, etc.).


N9373M
06-29-2012, 11:38 AM
http://badjocks.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/danny-noonan-caddyshack.jpg

Good luck finding that gem!

galaxy flyer
06-29-2012, 12:02 PM
Mink has it about right, as usual. The "additional duties" can be what you put into them, some like safety very rewarding and interesting. They might even produce skills that keep you employed sans medical.

There are a boatload of misery out there. The "high wealth" individuals especially. I get around to some that would wonderful, some not $1million would get me to do. One, a family son on honeymoon invited the pilot's wives and all three couples had honeymoons in Europe for 15 days. Others, not so much.

The quality ones have good support programs, scheduled days off, best corporate benefit packages. Think of it as a marriage with the possibility of cheap divorce.

GF

BoilerUP
06-29-2012, 12:09 PM
Two quick questions I have as I consider the possibility of working towards a corporate aviation career:

1.) What are corporate fliers doing when they aren't flying, studying, simming, flight planning, or otherwise directly involved with the flight operations of the company aircraft?

Anything I want.

2.) There is a lot... a LOT... of job dissatisfaction on APC from those in Part 121 operation. The folks that are unhappily employed (or... have decided to leave the field, but still hang around here for years, for some reason) spread a fairly dark cloud over this place, and I can certainly see why. Does that same cloud darken Part 91 and Part 135 operations to the extend it does for commercial ops? Sure... the experience is different everywhere, some places are not going to be great, some places are excellent. But the cloud over the commercial operations is pretty darned pervasive, and it seems like they are always in deep IMC with regards to their career outlook. Is it at least MVFR over here in the 91/135 world?

There are bitter people who hate their job in every segment of aviation...you just don't get large packs of them together at once in the bizav world like you do in an airline crew room. After all, misery loves company.

I liked my regional airline job, and I LOVE my corporate job, but I would not be opposed to going back to work at an airline in the right circumstance.

Its a job, and is what you make of it.

The Plainsman
06-29-2012, 04:01 PM
1. our department is small and we do everything from cutting grass to cleaning the hangar floor. Our owner has a collection of warbirds so we keep thise up as well. Company credit card and no bullsheyot from management.

2. a bad day on wall street or lack of judgement from some ceo's on capital hill can quickly ruin a decent corporate gig. Ive never been at a 121 oprator, cant speak for them, couldnt get anywhere with DAL a few years back, im a legacy there, 4 internals, north of 6k tt, nothing but crickets. oh well, not looking back now, happy with this 91 gig, on a SAN trip now, torrey pines inthe morning. couldnt do that flying the big iron.

good luck in your search....

USMCFLYR
06-29-2012, 04:08 PM
Two quick questions I have as I consider the possibility of working towards a corporate aviation career:

1.) What are corporate fliers doing when they aren't flying, studying, simming, flight planning, or otherwise directly involved with the flight operations of the company aircraft?

2.) There is a lot... a LOT... of job dissatisfaction on APC from those in Part 121 operation. The folks that are unhappily employed (or... have decided to leave the field, but still hang around here for years, for some reason) spread a fairly dark cloud over this place, and I can certainly see why. Does that same cloud darken Part 91 and Part 135 operations to the extend it does for commercial ops? Sure... the experience is different everywhere, some places are not going to be great, some places are excellent. But the cloud over the commercial operations is pretty darned pervasive, and it seems like they are always in deep IMC with regards to their career outlook. Is it at least MVFR over here in the 91/135 world?
Certainly among a portion of the crowd that frequents APC, but the forum is a place that many use to come to blow off steam too. It might be like going to an AA/NA meeting and wondering if the entire city is made up of addicts.

USMCFLYR

JetA PourHomme
07-01-2012, 11:34 AM
I'm pretty sure almost every pilot in the Exxon Mobile flight department has secondary duties besides flying but still relate to the flight department I.E. safety.

I think every flight department will be different, and Exxon is probably one of the better ones to be at.

conquestdz
07-02-2012, 07:06 AM
I briefly had a corporate job with other duties that included everything from washing the bosses car to shoveling hot asphalt and fixing construction equipment, to lying to his wife about what/who he had been doing. (All of this must have slipped his mind during the interview). I had to get the hell out of there.

11Fan
07-09-2012, 04:57 PM
It might be like going to an AA/NA meeting and wondering if the entire city is made up of addicts.

I belong to a different 12 Step Program, but I took a friend to a Gamblers Anonymous Meeting once because he was having issues in that area of his life.

As we were walking in, someone was selling 50/50 Tickets at the door.

Came to the conclusion that there was no recovery going on there.

Std Deviation
07-10-2012, 06:01 AM
I'm pretty sure almost every pilot in the Exxon Mobile flight department has secondary duties besides flying but still relate to the flight department I.E. safety.

I think every flight department will be different, and Exxon is probably one of the better ones to be at.

Answers to your questions:
1.) Not all, but many
2.) Yes, it is quite posh over there.

DirectTo
07-10-2012, 03:37 PM
Outside of flying, planning to fly, etc., I (single pilot/plane op) oversee the maintaining of the plane, book hotels/cars/etc., and basically keep the plane and hangar clean. I fly typically three to four days a week, mostly day trips, with the occasional overnight. No weekends. Most trips are known at least two weeks in advance.

I did 121 previously and it's a night and day difference in how I look at my job. I tried not to tell people I worked for an airline, despised going to work really. Now I look forward to every flight, regardless of where we're going or how long it is. The people are outstanding, the flying is fun, and it's both challenging and rewarding to run the whole show yourself.