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View Full Version : 104 HR March Schd / Allegiant Air


INXS
02-20-2014, 05:36 PM
Wow, my schedule is 104 hours for March, OK, but Pref Bid + Part 117 = Mucho flying :confused:

MD80 Captain / Line Holder


MatthewAMEL
02-20-2014, 05:53 PM
111 for Jan. 105 for Feb. 103 for Mar.

My personal fav is I am at 32.3 hours (in 7 days) thanks to a 4+2 day with 1 day off then another 3 day.

But, hey...these rules are all about mitigating pilot fatigue.

BTW - it's not just Allegiant, I'm at the Tranny.

tailendcharlie
02-21-2014, 04:04 AM
I fear Allegiant are burning the furniture to heat the house. With understaffed-driven schedules like these what is going to happen as we head into 2015 is the rolling 1000 hour/365-day lookback is gonna bite them. Do the math. 9 80-hour months plus 3 93-hour months = 999 hours. They are going to be sitting there trying to run 100 hr. lines for March 2015 and realize it's caught up to them - pilots are simply not legal to do it. And this will continue ad-infinitum every time they hit a busy month. Only a massive hiring/upgrade plan starting immediately - which frankly the training department probably couldn't handle - would avert yet another "crisis".


sailingfun
02-21-2014, 04:41 AM
I fear Allegiant are burning the furniture to heat the house. With understaffed-driven schedules like these what is going to happen as we head into 2015 is the rolling 1000 hour/365-day lookback is gonna bite them. Do the math. 9 80-hour months plus 3 93-hour months = 999 hours. They are going to be sitting there trying to run 100 hr. lines for March 2015 and realize it's caught up to them - pilots are simply not legal to do it. And this will continue ad-infinitum every time they hit a busy month. Only a massive hiring/upgrade plan starting immediately - which frankly the training department probably couldn't handle - would avert yet another "crisis".

If your flying 100 hours a month it's highly likely you will exceed 100 in a rolling 28 days at some point. Several airlines are either not tracking this or doing it incorrectly leaving the pilot with a FAR violation. This is a hard thing to track so the ALPA or some other app is almost mandatory.

sailingfun
02-21-2014, 04:43 AM
111 for Jan. 105 for Feb. 103 for Mar.

My personal fav is I am at 32.3 hours (in 7 days) thanks to a 4+2 day with 1 day off then another 3 day.

But, hey...these rules are all about mitigating pilot fatigue.

BTW - it's not just Allegiant, I'm at the Tranny.

I thought the AirTran guys were always saying they had good work rules in their contract?

SrfNFly227
02-21-2014, 04:45 AM
I fear Allegiant are burning the furniture to heat the house. With understaffed-driven schedules like these what is going to happen as we head into 2015 is the rolling 1000 hour/365-day lookback is gonna bite them. Do the math. 9 80-hour months plus 3 93-hour months = 999 hours. They are going to be sitting there trying to run 100 hr. lines for March 2015 and realize it's caught up to them - pilots are simply not legal to do it. And this will continue ad-infinitum every time they hit a busy month. Only a massive hiring/upgrade plan starting immediately - which frankly the training department probably couldn't handle - would avert yet another "crisis".

I've been saying for a while that this is a serious problem that nobody seems to be thinking about yet. It's going to get bad next year.

Packrat
02-21-2014, 04:48 AM
I've been saying for a while that this is a serious problem that nobody seems to be thinking about yet. It's going to get bad next year.

I guess no one at ALGT ever heard the phrase "Prior planning prevents poor performance." But then, I guess you are making so much money it doesn't matter what you spend it on...excepting for labor, of course.

You'd be surprised what Allegiant is paying for.

SilkBra
02-21-2014, 05:36 AM
111 for Jan. 105 for Feb. 103 for Mar.

My personal fav is I am at 32.3 hours (in 7 days) thanks to a 4+2 day with 1 day off then another 3 day.

But, hey...these rules are all about mitigating pilot fatigue.

BTW - it's not just Allegiant, I'm at the Tranny.

Wouldn't you only be able to work an average of 76 hours per month the rest of the year? Do they plan to take you off line for training or something?

Xbone
02-21-2014, 05:50 AM
Much of this self-inflicted staffing crisis has a lot to do with ego, and utter disdain that MG has for pilots. The accountants that run this airline cant stand to see a pilot have more than 5 days off a month. We're whining little B^*[email protected] in their eyes.

They are given free rein to make our lives miserable. This pervasive culture of hate the pilot comes right from the top. For at least the last two years, when we use to have coffee corners, and base visits, pilots complained about PTO being useless, un-commutable schedules, etc. We warned of a constant under staffing.

Because we wanted it, meant management would do everything not to give it. Ego and utter disregard for our request. Let them eat cake.

Uncle Wurmy
02-21-2014, 06:10 AM
If your flying 100 hours a month it's highly likely you will exceed 100 in a rolling 28 days at some point. Several airlines are either not tracking this or doing it incorrectly leaving the pilot with a FAR violation. This is a hard thing to track so the ALPA or some other app is almost mandatory.

Despite Allegiant's management telling their pilots that it's just a bunch of pilot rumors that the new scheduling software can't track legality or pay correctly, after hearing story after story I have my doubts that it's just rumors.

Vegaspilot
02-21-2014, 06:32 AM
And if all that's not bad enough they put all finance guys in charge of the team making sure our scheduling software works right. I'm sure it's gonna get better <sarcasm>

eagleatr
02-21-2014, 07:35 PM
There's a finance person in charge of scheduling now. What could go wrong???

AZbound
02-23-2014, 02:17 PM
http://www.reviewjournal.com/business/las-vegas-s-home-grown-airline-sees-growing-pains-age-15

Vegaspilot
02-23-2014, 04:55 PM
Selling rental cars??? Seriously? Geez

CLMP
02-25-2014, 07:12 AM
This place is already run by used car salesmen. It's a perfect fit.

AZbound
02-25-2014, 11:28 AM
http://consumermediallc.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/usedcarsalesman.jpg

j3cub
02-25-2014, 12:48 PM
I'm a senior line holder. I was awarded less than 90 hours. I WANTED 95+. I bid for the long morning trips. I got some. I also got some very short turns and PM trips... Another senior line holder got 60 hours. Make no sense since the average said 94 hours.

I emailed the finance guy in charge of Merlot. His response:

"Thank you for reaching out with this concern. Based off the flying schedule, this was the optimal award based on all other legality and seniority requirements. There should be Open Time opportunities this month to pick up some additional flying."

Funny thing, only one open FO trip in SFB that I see!

AZbound
02-25-2014, 01:44 PM
And that figures bc I know for a fact there are people in IWA that bid for max days off (flying the least amount of hours possible) and were awarded over-100 hour lines. Saying that that was the 'optimal award' is giving Merlot too much credit.

INXS
02-25-2014, 03:47 PM
So flight hours are off the chart, 100+hrs, pilots are leaving for other airlines...any word on the airline's ability to upgrade pilots? Sub service is alive and well in LAS. People are starting to wonder:confused:

I guess it's hope for the best & plan for the worst.

tailendcharlie
02-25-2014, 05:00 PM
It's management's dream scenario - tweak Hal-9000 to create maximum misery plus 5 days for CS to pencil- whip even more bs onto pilots's schedules. Hide it all behind a black-ops veil of secrecy and simply toss any complaints/protests into the "It's working! That's just Merlot being Merlot" pile.

tailendcharlie
02-25-2014, 05:06 PM
Rumor, pretty good source though. Couple guys got together, built lines for IWA the old way, by hand. Just to see what they could come up with. Fully 117 and work-rule compliant. Turned out way better than HAL.

Uncle Wurmy
02-25-2014, 05:33 PM
I heard that all PTO for March was denied for all pilots in a blanket email, and contract pilots are again moving airplanes around under the name of Sunrise Asset Management.

Packrat
02-25-2014, 05:42 PM
....contract pilots are again moving airplanes around under the name of Sunrise Asset Management.

Sub service is alive and well in LAS. People are starting to wonder:confused:

I guess it's hope for the best & plan for the worst.

I understand you don't even have enough pilots to ferry your airplanes if they break down or to heavy maintenance.

tailendcharlie
02-25-2014, 06:09 PM
I understand you don't even have enough pilots to ferry your airplanes if they break down or to heavy maintenance.

Depends; sometimes they do sometimes not.

But wihout a massive hiring/upgrade program - now - they are going to have a hard time getting caught up let alone having the excess they need for training float or growth. 117 and increased attrition are really gonna start to bite 'em beore long....

CLMP
02-25-2014, 06:57 PM
As long as the stock keeps climbing and stays there, nothing drastic will be done. Nothing else matters to them.

GuppyPuppy
02-26-2014, 05:55 PM
44:01BLOCK in 7 days. JBLU. day off. All 1-day trips with a 50-70 minute commute each way by car. First showtime is early afternoon getting progressively earlier with a 6am show on last day.

Thanks a lot, you idiots at the FAA.

Tired? Fatigued? Stressed? How could I be? There FAA has mitigated my fatigue!

Thanks, Babbitt. Spineless drunk.

BTW.....not at ALGT. JB
GP

chrtrplt
02-26-2014, 06:14 PM
What's the latest with the lawsuit against the company to maintain the status quo? Read an article that quoted Levy saying if the lawsuit goes the pilot's way that the airline would have to shut down for about 3-6 months while they get another bidding system certified and operational.

eagleatr
02-26-2014, 07:16 PM
The company got the lawsuit moved to Vegas. Should be heard soon. They already had a back up plan in case Merlot didn't work (which is a debatable point as to whether or not it's currently working), so it's BS about having to shut down the operation.

Merlot is already not tracking flight and duty time correctly as it is.

ClarenceOver
02-26-2014, 07:18 PM
Is Allegiant getting desperate like the regionals are? As in they are the only major airline that needs bodies in the seat so to speak? Or am i wrong? Tell me if im wrong.

Swedish Blender
02-26-2014, 07:27 PM
When do you guys start getting the Bus and where are they going?

CLMP
02-26-2014, 07:27 PM
What's the latest with the lawsuit against the company to maintain the status quo? Read an article that quoted Levy saying if the lawsuit goes the pilot's way that the airline would have to shut down for about 3-6 months while they get another bidding system certified and operational.

Scare tactics, nothing more. It also demonstrates that he doesn't know what the lawsuit is about. Nobody is asking to shut down Merlot. We want to get rid of the PBS function of Merlot. The union called Merlot and verified that Merlot 117 compliance and PBS can be separated. The bottom line is that PBS was a huge concession by the pilots and a financial windfall for the company. They don't want to give that up, but they may have to.

Uncle Wurmy
02-26-2014, 07:29 PM
When do you guys start getting the Bus and where are they going?

AAY got the Bus a year ago. Bases are IWA, SFB and PIE.

Releasemaster
02-26-2014, 07:37 PM
On Friday Maury is inviting employees to stand in a parking lot with himself, Mitch Alle and Oscar Goodman to celebrate 15 years of flying. Maybe Maury will give away used rental cars as door prizes.

Uncle Wurmy
02-27-2014, 03:42 PM
Merlot is already not tracking flight and duty time correctly as it is.

Oh you know that's just a rumor, just like the training department shutdown. :rolleyes:

full of luv
02-28-2014, 07:04 AM
44:01BLOCK in 7 days. JBLU. day off. All 1-day trips with a 50-70 minute commute each way by car. First showtime is early afternoon getting progressively earlier with a 6am show on last day.

Thanks a lot, you idiots at the FAA.

Tired? Fatigued? Stressed? How could I be? There FAA has mitigated my fatigue!

Thanks, Babbitt. Spineless drunk.

BTW.....not at ALGT. JB
GP

How is that crappy sked the FAA's fault? Really, 7 one day trips for a pilot that commutes by car that far? Sounds like you need to get on your union's sked committee and work to get that kind of pain outlawed. Don't wait for the FAA to do your contract work.

Herman
02-28-2014, 07:53 AM
How is that crappy sked the FAA's fault? Really, 7 one day trips for a pilot that commutes by car that far? Sounds like you need to get on your union's sked committee and work to get that kind of pain outlawed. Don't wait for the FAA to do your contract work.

Must be snowing in hell today...I actually agree w/ you.

tailendcharlie
02-28-2014, 01:52 PM
What's the latest with the lawsuit against the company to maintain the status quo? Read an article that quoted Levy saying if the lawsuit goes the pilot's way that the airline would have to shut down for about 3-6 months while they get another bidding system certified and operational.

A One Billion Dollar company with no contingencies, backups, or alternate plan for something as mundane and commonplace as pilot scheduling? Really. And you're gonna shut 'er down and leave hundreds of million on the table while you get your act together? Think the shareholders might have a question or two about this?

Xbone
02-28-2014, 02:25 PM
What's the latest with the lawsuit against the company to maintain the status quo? Read an article that quoted Levy saying if the lawsuit goes the pilot's way that the airline would have to shut down for about 3-6 months while they get another bidding system certified and operational.

He is a lawyer, trained to lie without exposure.

labbats
02-28-2014, 04:59 PM
Allegiant - Investor Relations - Press Release (http://ir.allegiantair.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=197578&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1905001&highlight=)

Run the company like it's bankrupt to the point the FAA starts violating you, ignore all requests by employees to get standard wages and then repurchase stock. Truly classless.

MD80driver2day
02-28-2014, 07:09 PM
Can someone who was in this week's recurrent explain what Jude said about the bidding process. I heard he gave some super secret inside information on how to bid and why it takes the system 5 days to complete the process.

chrtrplt
02-28-2014, 07:29 PM
I would welcome this information because i clearly don't know how to bid.

MD80driver2day
02-28-2014, 08:16 PM
I would welcome this information because i clearly don't know how to bid.

I know how not to bid.... This is clear.

Fly2nowhere
03-01-2014, 11:47 AM
I don't believe that there is a right way to bid. The company is going to just do what it wants regardless. I have a 90 hour line for March. Instead of getting extra days off, the company filled my schedule with reserve days. From talking with others, it seems impossible for anyone to get more then 11 days off. Good luck to all the pilots who commute!

tailendcharlie
03-01-2014, 12:43 PM
Without about 50 upgrades & 50 new-hires it doesn't matter how you bid. Nowhere near enough bodies to fill seats for decent skeds. 'Till the end of 2014-beginning of 2015 when the 365-day lookback catches up to them and they realize we can only fly 80-hour lines.

labbats
03-01-2014, 01:10 PM
Without about 50 upgrades & 50 new-hires it doesn't matter how you bid. Nowhere near enough bodies to fill seats for decent skeds. 'Till the end of 2014-beginning of 2015 when the 365-day lookback catches up to them and they realize we can only fly 80-hour lines.

I've heard about upgrades for months and have yet to see any movement or announcements since early fall... and those were delayed.

No new captains in what a year? Year and a half?

Over a 6 year upgrade and counting now.

CLMP
03-03-2014, 09:20 AM
Can someone who was in this week's recurrent explain what Jude said about the bidding process. I heard he gave some super secret inside information on how to bid and why it takes the system 5 days to complete the process.

The gist of the spiel was to make sure that if you want specific days off, you need to list them within the first 11 choices on your requests. Don't put it in chronological order. He said the worst thing you can do is to bid every day off, as you will be deemed "apathetic" by the solver. The solver does all this in about 6 seconds, but it takes 5 days of tricking the computer into believing we are staffed properly. BTW, it was specifically asked if this 5 day lag was eventually going away. The answer was "no".

I'm glad we could make such huge monetary and QOL sacrifices so the Allegiant 1% can get another artificial stock bump.

Xbone
03-03-2014, 09:33 AM
I'm glad we could make such huge monetary and QOL sacrifices so the Allegiant 1% can get another artificial stock bump.



Its called “Trickle up”. The business model of G4.

MD80driver2day
03-03-2014, 12:19 PM
The gist of the spiel was to make sure that if you want specific days off, you need to list them within the first 11 choices on your requests. Don't put it in chronological order. He said the worst thing you can do is to bid every day off, as you will be deemed "apathetic" by the solver. The solver does all this in about 6 seconds, but it takes 5 days of tricking the computer into believing we are staffed properly. BTW, it was specifically asked if this 5 day lag was eventually going away. The answer was "no".

I'm glad we could make such huge monetary and QOL sacrifices so the Allegiant 1% can get another artificial stock bump.

Why the first 11 choices?

CLMP
03-03-2014, 12:56 PM
Because that's what the super secret proprietary Merlot software uses to give you the 11 days off you'll be getting until you retire (or quit ). Actually, I don't really know. :)

Releasemaster
03-13-2014, 04:19 PM
Now the company is soliciting pilots awarded PTO in April to sell it back to the company. In exchange the pilot gets the privilege* of being subject to any number of assignments...

*Sarcasm

BigTime
03-15-2014, 12:56 AM
You guys all need to start calling in fatigued if you're overworked. Don't call in sick if you aren't ill; if you're too tired, call in fatigued! This shouldn't even be a question in your mind.

If you're overworked and too tired, call fatigued before your flight. Fill out the fatigue report which will be sent to the FAA. This is the only way the FAA will know that what management is doing is causing safety issues.

Management isn't going to change the schedules voluntarily to make this a safer airline. They don't care if you're overworked unless you call in fatigued.

If the company tries to retaliate against you, your next calls should be to the union and then to the FAA.



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