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View Full Version : What's it like to fly the CRJ?


kfahmi
04-08-2014, 03:58 PM
The only experience I have in a Canadair product was getting my SIC type in a CL-30 (Challenger 300 corporate jet.) That was a blast and a half...13,000 lbs of thrust powering a 32,000-lb airplane (MGW 39,000, but we were flying light.) We saw 5,500 fpm climbing through 15,000' and the CA told me that 6,500 fpm is doable.

I was just curious, for the CRJ drivers around here. What's that airplane like to fly? I've only ever ridden in the back of a CRJ-200 twice, and both times the airplane kinda seemed like it didn't really want to climb. I was surprised at the low deck angle on departure, even out of a sea-level airport on a standard day. How different are the -700s and -900s?

Just trying to learn, that's all.


bruhaha
04-08-2014, 05:28 PM
The -700 has the most power to weight ratio of the CRJs. 1:2 empty. 1:3 at max takeoff weight. If you're doing a ferry at 50-54,000k you can go from sea level to 10000 in 2mins.

The -200 is underpowered and the -900 a little better but not by much.

kfahmi
04-08-2014, 05:52 PM
The -700 has the most power to weight ratio of the CRJs. 1:2 empty. 1:3 at max takeoff weight. If you're doing a ferry at 50-54,000k you can go from sea level to 10000 in 2mins.

The -200 is underpowered and the -900 a little better but not by much.

Interesting. Purely out of curiosity, what kind of climb rates do you see on the -200 at MGW? Am I dreaming when I say that the deck angle on climbout seems real shallow compared to other turbofan A/C?


PotatoChip
04-08-2014, 07:42 PM
You're not dreaming. At MTOW (53,000) an initial pitch attitude of 10 - 12 is standard, followed by about 3000'/minute shallowing to 2000'/minute by 10,000ft. Where it really begins to struggle is FL200 and up. On a warm day at FL250, 500'-700'/minute is the norm up to FL310.

kfahmi
04-08-2014, 08:03 PM
You're not dreaming. At MTOW (53,000) an initial pitch attitude of 10 - 12 is standard, followed by about 3000'/minute shallowing to 2000'/minute by 10,000ft. Where it really begins to struggle is FL200 and up. On a warm day at FL250, 500'-700'/minute is the norm up to FL310.

Yikes!

Thanks for the info. I was just curious. Explains why it seems that we barely made it to cruising altitude on our SFO-SLC route before it was time to descend again.

What do they call it again? Climb Restricted Jet?

Firsttimeflyer
04-09-2014, 06:47 PM
I always called the -200 the ground loving slug.

ClarenceOver
04-09-2014, 06:50 PM
I always called the 200 the Climb Restricted Jet.

flyandive
04-09-2014, 07:22 PM
Also keep in mind, we also do reduced thrust takeoffs to reduce engine wear and tear. Yet another reason why that initial climb after takeoff can seem agonizing. Coming out of SFO on a warm day, heavy, and with a little humidity it's not uncommon for us to use a frighting amount of 1L or 1R.

kfahmi
04-09-2014, 07:46 PM
Also keep in mind, we also do reduced thrust takeoffs to reduce engine wear and tear. Yet another reason why that initial climb after takeoff can seem agonizing. Coming out of SFO on a warm day, heavy, and with a little humidity it's not uncommon for us to use a frighting amount of 1L or 1R.

Y'know, that makes sense. On our departure from SFO we were full, and as we rolled down 1L past the 28L/28R intersections, I recall thinking "Somebody better pour on the gas!" Climb rate seemed...anemic, shall we say.

wrxpilot
04-09-2014, 07:58 PM
Compared to a biz jet, the CRJs are very disappointing climb wise. The 700 at least does ok, but a loaded 200 on a hot summer day is pretty anemic once past the teens. But they all handle well and are still fairly fun to fly.

PotatoChip
04-10-2014, 03:32 AM
Also keep in mind, we also do reduced thrust takeoffs to reduce engine wear and tear. Yet another reason why that initial climb after takeoff can seem agonizing. Coming out of SFO on a warm day, heavy, and with a little humidity it's not uncommon for us to use a frighting amount of 1L or 1R.

I don't know of a modern commercial jet that doesn't use reduced thrust take offs.

kfahmi
04-10-2014, 07:44 AM
But they all handle well and are still fairly fun to fly.

They're airplanes. By definition they are all fun to fly ;)

Jersdawg
04-19-2014, 08:47 PM
The -700 is a great performer down low. It starts to labor a bit in the flight levels, but it'll keep a high speed climb going nicely.

Jersdawg
04-19-2014, 08:49 PM
It's also got some stiff legs on landing, it's inconsistent upon landing. Handles a crosswind just fine though.

bonesbrigade
04-23-2014, 05:32 AM
My personal technique is at 10,000ft engage vertical speed, roll the wheel to +1,000fpm and just hold that... it'll take you up to nearly the barber pole initially, but then as you get into the high teens and low 20s the speed has decreased to our 290KIAS profile speed. By going about it this way it seems like I'm able to maintain the energy much better. If you keep 290KIAS all the way up, it seems like by the early 20s you are already at 500fpm, and to hold that rate beyond about 23k or so you are going to sacrifice speed to maintain that minimum climb rate. The other technique allows you to hold 1,000fpm at 290KIAS and above for much longer.
Also I don't have to constantly fiddle with the VS wheel the entire time.
Speed mode doesn't work too well once you pass above the high teens, especially in turb.

web500sjc
04-23-2014, 07:36 AM
I don't know of a modern commercial jet that doesn't use reduced thrust take offs.

Go to SNA, won't get any Flex thrust, just max thrust.

Speedbird2263
05-10-2014, 08:28 AM
My personal technique is at 10,000ft engage vertical speed, roll the wheel to +1,000fpm and just hold that... it'll take you up to nearly the barber pole initially, but then as you get into the high teens and low 20s the speed has decreased to our 290KIAS profile speed. By going about it this way it seems like I'm able to maintain the energy much better. If you keep 290KIAS all the way up, it seems like by the early 20s you are already at 500fpm, and to hold that rate beyond about 23k or so you are going to sacrifice speed to maintain that minimum climb rate. The other technique allows you to hold 1,000fpm at 290KIAS and above for much longer.
Also I don't have to constantly fiddle with the VS wheel the entire time.
Speed mode doesn't work too well once you pass above the high teens, especially in turb.

My personal technique that works well in all three variants is to use pitch mode once settled into profile speed past 10,000'MSL. I adjust pitch down a half degree 2 -3 times on the CR2&7, 2-4times on the CR9 and that usually works well all the way up to cruise altitude and also keeps profile Mach through transition. On days with positive ISA deviation and high gross weight I would have to transition from pitch back to VS mode with 500fpm selected and simply accept the deviation(within reason of course) from profile speed. In terms of hand flying, the 200 in the terminal area compares to driving a nimble sports car, very light and responsive. CR2 Low energy go-around leaves much to be desired and is more akin to a soft-field take off in a C172, however the 7&9 will power right out of a Low energy go around in comparison. The CR7&9 are heavier on the controls but still handle nicely, albeit with more deft use of pitch trim. In the transition to flare the CR2 is vastly different from the CR7&9 due to approach angle(no slats on the CR2) and a nice touchdown on the CR7&9 IMO can be consistently had if you pay close attention to the rad alt through 20 feet and consistently transition eyesight to far end of the RWY and hold pitch for desired rate below 10. Most folks that continue to significantly pitch up below 10 will get a firm landing due to rotating the mains on to the RWY(CG is quite aways ahead of the mains). The CR2 is much easier in that respect because it has trailing link landing gear which helps to further ease firm landings, although the Ground Lift Dumping system(read spoilers) will never really allow a true greaser on the CR2.

-2263

Hilltopper89
05-12-2014, 12:58 PM
Compared to a biz jet, the CRJs are very disappointing climb wise. The 700 at least does ok, but a loaded 200 on a hot summer day is pretty anemic once past the teens. But they all handle well and are still fairly fun to fly.

And compared to an F-16. I recall 50,000 fpm.

Yazzoo
05-17-2014, 10:26 PM
The CRJ-200 rolls at 720 degrees/second


...just throwing that out there :D

Moonwolf
05-18-2014, 07:25 AM
It's also got some stiff legs on landing, it's inconsistent upon landing. Handles a crosswind just fine though.

My landing are always smooth.:D