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View Full Version : Skywest or Horizon?


MtnGrl
09-22-2015, 09:13 PM
Where would you go if given the choice?


BeatNavy
09-22-2015, 09:36 PM
Where would you go if given the choice?

Have you read the horizon threads lately? I think you should go to horizon.

Turbosina
09-22-2015, 09:37 PM
Where do you live? If you live in a SKW base, I'd go with SKW. If you live in a Horizon base, I'd go Horizon.

If you live in SEA or PDX, which are bases for both airlines, well...that's a tougher question. Horizon's product is second to none, and you'll be flying across some of the most beautiful parts of this country. On the downside, Horizon only has the Q400 (if jets matter to you), and it seems that for whatever reason, Skywest is growing while Horizon's future is less secure.

I was faced with the same choice, but living where I do, Horizon isn't an option, as I refuse to commute to a base.

It all really boils down to where you live. Not even the best days on the line can make up for the pain of commuting.


Phteven
09-22-2015, 09:41 PM
Where would you go if given the choice?

If you do five minutes of research, the decision will be clear.

Read my write up about the state of things at Horizon.

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/90732-latest-horizon-air.html

snackysmores
09-22-2015, 10:05 PM
Anyone who is considering going to Horizon right now must be living under a rock.

Phteven
09-22-2015, 10:13 PM
You know what, MtnGrl I don't want to give you too hard of a time because you are at least seeking information. Right now, to my knowledge, we are continuing to staff our classes at Horizon which is absolutely astounding given the current situation. I have to assume they are coming here with ZERO information or they're naive.

snackysmores
09-22-2015, 10:47 PM
You know what, MtnGrl I don't want to give you too hard of a time because you are at least seeking information. Right now, to my knowledge, we are continuing to staff our classes at Horizon which is absolutely astounding given the current situation. I have to assume they are coming here with ZERO information or they're naive.

I thought Oct and Nov classes were cancelled due to no Alaska attrition for the rest of this year.

Phteven
09-23-2015, 09:22 AM
I thought Oct and Nov classes were cancelled due to no Alaska attrition for the rest of this year.

Yeah that's what I heard too. We must have a lot in the pool at Alaska given the rate we have been hiring. Unfortunate timing on this too because I have to assume this would shake the confidence of a lot of people on the fence about whether to go to Horizon, Compass, or Skywest and it would have been nice to see that reflected in the turnout for class.

N927EV
09-23-2015, 11:13 AM
BK or McDonald's for lunch, guys?

snackysmores
09-23-2015, 11:31 AM
BK or McDonald's for lunch, guys?

Not even, Skywest pilots aren't on the verge of being whipsawed or threatened by their company into taking concessions. If the company's proposal in mid October is even remotely similar to the Flight Attendants (which was so bad the union wouldn't even consider it for a vote) our fate is pretty much sealed.

No one should even consider applying at Horizon until after Dec. 31st when our proposal is supposed to be voted on.

And for the potential new hires, if you didn't catch if in the other threads: You are screwed if you come here: If we take concessions and get 30 jets at Horizon, you will never be senior enough to fly them. You will be stuck in the Q400 which will only be operated on the short 30-40 minute flights, doing six legs a day. You will sit on the ground more than you fly, and you will be pushed to legal duty limit Every. Single. Day you fly with the bare minimum amount of rest in one of our ****ty overnight locations on the far edge of town with no food or amenities near by. If the company gets rid of our trip rigs too there goes your pay protection on the Q400.

If we refuse to take concessions and jets are given to Skywest, Horizon will shrink roughly 40% and you will get furloughed, or forever remain at the bottom of the seniority list.

No matter what happens with the contract/jets: You will lose.

Once again, do not come here right now. Horizon used to be a great company until the ****ing bean counters at Alaska took over and are willing to spend $5 to save $1 just to spite our "overpaid" pilot group. How many BILLIONS AND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS does Alaska need to make before enough is enough? They are swimming in an ocean of cash right now they have no idea what to do with all their money...I know! Lets spend $41 million ****ing dollars to put our name on a sports stadium, but **** those Horizon pilots, they need to give up their contract.

If you want to be based in SEA or PDX, go to Skywest or Compass.

pete2800
09-23-2015, 11:43 AM
Where would you go if given the choice?

I'll make you a deal. We should meet up, and I'll kick you in the shins and steal your wallet. That way you can feel like you've worked at Horizon, and you can go on your merry way at SkyWest.

PiperArrow
09-23-2015, 11:48 AM
Not even, Skywest pilots aren't on the verge of being whipsawed or threatened by their company into taking concessions. If the company's proposal in mid October is even remotely similar to the Flight Attendants (which was so bad the union wouldn't even consider it for a vote) our fate is pretty much sealed.

No one should even consider applying at Horizon until after Dec. 31st when our proposal is supposed to be voted on.

And for the potential new hires, if you didn't catch if in the other threads: You are screwed if you come here: If we take concessions and get 30 jets at Horizon, you will never be senior enough to fly them. You will be stuck in the Q400 which will only be operated on the short 30-40 minute flights, doing six legs a day. You will sit on the ground more than you fly, and you will be pushed to legal duty limit Every. Single. Day you fly with the bare minimum amount of rest in one of our ****ty overnight locations on the far edge of town with no food or amenities near by. If the company gets rid of our trip rigs too there goes your pay protection on the Q400.

If we refuse to take concessions and jets are given to Skywest, Horizon will shrink roughly 40% and you will get furloughed, or forever remain at the bottom of the seniority list.

No matter what happens with the contract/jets: You will lose.

Once again, do not come here right now. Horizon used to be a great company until the ****ing bean counters at Alaska took over and are willing to spend $5 to save $1 just to spite our "overpaid" pilot group. How many BILLIONS AND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS does Alaska need to make before enough is enough? They are swimming in an ocean of cash right now they have no idea what to do with all their money...I know! Lets spend $41 million ****ing dollars to put our name on a sports stadium, but **** those Horizon pilots, they need to give up their contract.

If you want to be based in SEA or PDX, go to Skywest or Compass.
Never be senior enough to fly the jets? So if I work here for the next thirty years I'll NEVER have enough seniority to fly the jet? Damn!

And yes... Regional flying is lots of short trips to outlying locations... Maybe she should skip regionals all together and apply to be a captain at mainline?

Phteven
09-23-2015, 12:31 PM
Never be senior enough to fly the jets? So if I work here for the next thirty years I'll NEVER have enough seniority to fly the jet? Damn!

And yes... Regional flying is lots of short trips to outlying locations... Maybe she should skip regionals all together and apply to be a captain at mainline?

Fair point. We're all pretty upset about what's going on at Horizon but it is important to remember that what is really happening here is Horizon is going from a slightly less ****ty regional to a normal ****ty regional. I still wholeheartedly agree to not come here until negotiations are done and you know what you are getting yourself into. Skywest seems to be one of the more nimble airlines in the new pilot hiring environment, but that's just how it goes. The new best airline to work for changes from time to time.

To parse out what snackysmores was saying there, yes, this is bad news for new hires regardless of the outcome. If you come here you will obviously eventually be able to fly the E175 as an FO, but by the time that's an option you will be so close to upgrade in the Q400 that you probably won't. You (hopefully) won't hold it as a captain because there are so many senior CA's here who will probably retire here. The revolving door will be Q400 CA and below, not E175 CA. Maybe FO's in 2020 or later might hold the E175 right away but that's irrelevant.

The company can't "get rid of our trip rigs" because it is in our contract. They just cursed the Q400 with short round-trips, they'll have to pull trip rigs out of our collective icy dead hands.

Just like everywhere, some overnights are better than others.

No one is getting furloughed if we don't get the jets because this place would be completely ****ed if we don't get them. Think 50% or more of the pilot group will leave if we don't get them? I do. Could 320 pilots with 121 time get hired at other carriers by next summer? Absolutely.

snackysmores
09-23-2015, 12:49 PM
Never be senior enough to fly the jets? So if I work here for the next thirty years I'll NEVER have enough seniority to fly the jet? Damn!

And yes... Regional flying is lots of short trips to outlying locations... Maybe she should skip regionals all together and apply to be a captain at mainline?

You will be senior to upgrade to CA in the jet in about 10-15 years. If you actually want to be at a regional for 30 years, go for it.

Yes, regional flying is lot's of short trips. Thanks, almost forgot. Tell me, if you could pick between the two, would you choose to fly six legs a day for 30 minutes each flight with a 40 minute turn on the ground, or two legs a day at 2.5 hours each?

Skipping the regionals altogether sure would be nice, but since no one can, you might as well choose to work one with decent flying, QOL, benefits etc. and Horizon is in a position to lose on all fronts.

Although if I was her I would apply to the majors as soon as I got off IOE at the regionals, her career is bound to be one giant short cut anyway ;)

Phteven
09-23-2015, 01:03 PM
You will be senior to upgrade to CA in the jet in about 10-15 years. If you actually want to be at a regional for 30 years, go for it.

Yes, regional flying is lot's of short trips. Thanks, almost forgot. Tell me, if you could pick between the two, would you choose to fly six legs a day for 30 minutes each flight with a 40 minute turn on the ground, or two legs a day at 2.5 hours each?

Exactly. One should HOPE as a new hire that they will never fly the jet as a CA here!

Horizon is going to have to do something to entice new-hires to come here when it becomes abundantly clear that you can go next door and fly easier trips in a more comfortable airplane and make more money right out of class.

MtnGrl
09-26-2015, 06:13 PM
Thanks everyone for your replies, the discussion has been helpful and very illuminating.

FaceBiter
09-26-2015, 06:18 PM
Total BS that they're pulling on you Horizion guys. I know it doesn't mean much but hope you guys keep on keeping on.

BeatNavy
09-26-2015, 06:53 PM
Total BS that they're pulling on you Horizion guys. I know it doesn't mean much but hope you guys keep on keeping on.

Holy smokes look who is back!!! Missed ya buddy. The was a long time in APC jail. The Mesa thread needs some trolling. Someone needs to stoke that dumpster fire. The flames almost went out without you.

FaceBiter
09-26-2015, 07:10 PM
Holy smokes look who is back!!! Missed ya buddy. The was a long time in APC jail. The Mesa thread needs some trolling. Someone needs to stoke that dumpster fire. The flames almost went out without you.

I hold the deed to you suckaz so bad that daddy and mommy won't let me even play with a-y'all anymore since your peeps cry so loud.