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View Full Version : Jumpseat / trans states and such


Metering
11-25-2015, 06:18 AM
Recently a pilot from airline "X" tried to jump-seat on one of our flights. The captain who was working the flight did not accommodate the JS and apparently told him "its my personal policy to not allow jump-seaters".

I'm not the captain in question but I wanted apologize to this specific jump-seater and anyone else that might have been effected by this captains "personal policy".

I want to to make it clear that this is just a ONE person deal and we are addressing it via the proper channels.

Anyone is welcome on my jump-seat regardless of carrier, any time. (CASS and W&B permitting of course, LOL)

And if you do know who this captain is, keep the name to yourself.


SevereClear1
11-25-2015, 06:21 AM
Good on you.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

yimke
11-25-2015, 06:35 AM
I'm not going to jump to conclusions and I am not affliated with either TSA or airline X. However, the captain is in the right. It is the PIC's authority to allow a jumpseater, NOT the gate agent, jumpseat committee, or management. Perhaps there was some other motives for the captain's decision. The JS could have been out of compliance, low on oxygen, broken JS, etc. Regardless, it is the captain's jumpseat and you are a guest, treat it like that! It is possible the captain did not choose the right words to convey the message.


Riverside
11-25-2015, 06:38 AM
It is possible the captain did not choose the right words to convey the message.

Oh she knew what she was saying.

CBreezy
11-25-2015, 06:40 AM
Oh she knew what she was saying.

And has said it before.

HuskerAv8tor
11-25-2015, 06:57 AM
Recently a pilot from airline "X" tried to jump-seat on one of our flights. The captain who was working the flight did not accommodate the JS and apparently told him "its my personal policy to not allow jump-seaters".

I'm not the captain in question but I wanted apologize to this specific jump-seater and anyone else that might have been effected by this captains "personal policy".

I want to to make it clear that this is just a ONE person deal and we are addressing it via the proper channels.

Anyone is welcome on my jump-seat regardless of carrier, any time. (CASS and W&B permitting of course, LOL)

And if you do know who this captain is, keep the name to yourself.
The name is well known at TSA for a variety of other reasons!

Metering
11-25-2015, 07:03 AM
The name is well known at TSA for a variety of other reasons!

I'm aware of that. I have flown with this captain and was far from impressed.

This was not supposed to be a "shaming" post for the captain involved. Just a notice to other pilots that we are aware, are handling it and to know that we are sorry that they were inconvenienced and that this captain does not represent the pilot group as a whole.

Coneydog
11-25-2015, 07:37 AM
It isn't a coincidence that her trips are always in open time.

Riverside
11-25-2015, 07:42 AM
It isn't a coincidence that her trips are always in open time.

Wonder how many people have her in their pbs do not fly list.

The Juice
11-25-2015, 07:45 AM
I'm aware of that. I have flown with this captain and was far from impressed.

This was not supposed to be a "shaming" post for the captain involved. Just a notice to other pilots that we are aware, are handling it and to know that we are sorry that they were inconvenienced and that this captain does not represent the pilot group as a whole.

Her actions put your entire group's jumpseating at risk with other airlines. She should be called out.

So when she denies a Legacy CA for a ride, do you think that CA will care about a forum apology when he misses his last ride home? Do you think this will stay fresh in their head when a TSA pilot tries to jumpseat on their plane? You bet it will

Police your own if need be. CA controls their jumpseat and just as she can control who rides in hers, every other captain can and will control who rides in theirs as well

CBreezy
11-25-2015, 07:54 AM
Her actions put your entire group's jumpseating at risk with other airlines. She should be called out.

So when she denies a Legacy CA for a ride, do you think that CA will care about a forum apology when he misses his last ride home? Do you think this will stay fresh in their head when a TSA pilot tries to jumpseat on their plane? You bet it will

Police your own if need be. CA controls their jumpseat and just as she can control who rides in hers, every other captain can and will control who rides in theirs as well

So, you say police our own. What's your solution if she refuses to pull her head out? Blanket party?

Poser765
11-25-2015, 09:21 AM
I'm not going to jump to conclusions and I am not affliated with either TSA or airline X. However, the captain is in the right. It is the PIC's authority to allow a jumpseater, NOT the gate agent, jumpseat committee, or management. Perhaps there was some other motives for the captain's decision. The JS could have been out of compliance, low on oxygen, broken JS, etc. Regardless, it is the captain's jumpseat and you are a guest, treat it like that! It is possible the captain did not choose the right words to convey the message.Sure the captain IS the final word on the jumpseat, but denying jumpseaters because it's "personal policy" is low class and a crappy thing to do whether you have the authority to do it or not.

Also, really, if the O2 is low, or the jumpseat is inop, it takes a real special kind of socially screwed up and awkward person to not be to convey that properly. In the highly complex realms of interpersonal communication it's not hard to say "I'm sorry, we are low on oxygen, we can't take a jumpseater." If they can't even do that then I seriously doubt their ability to effectively communicate sufficiently to foster a positive CRM environment.

Coneydog
11-25-2015, 09:51 AM
Sure the captain IS the final word on the jumpseat, but denying jumpseaters because it's "personal policy" is low class and a crappy thing to do whether you have the authority to do it or not.

Also, really, if the O2 is low, or the jumpseat is inop, it takes a real special kind of socially screwed up and awkward person to not be to convey that properly. In the highly complex realms of interpersonal communication it's not hard to say "I'm sorry, we are low on oxygen, we can't take a jumpseater." If they can't even do that then I seriously doubt their ability to effectively communicate sufficiently to foster a positive CRM environment.

You just hit the nail on the head. Unfortunately said captain is 'socially screwed up and awkward'...and fosters an extremely poor CRM envirnnment. Anyone who has flown with this captain can attest to that. I'm kinda surprised she hasn't been fired.

Metering
11-25-2015, 09:54 AM
You just hit the nail on the head. Unfortunately said captain is 'socially screwed up and awkward'...and fosters an extremely poor CRM envirnnment. Anyone who has flown with this captain can attest to that. I'm kinda surprised she hasn't been fired.

I always felt that anytime you provide input that would correct a situation or even ask a question to understand the captains thinking, the captain took it as a challenge to their authority and would get defensive and "uppity". Kind of like a "you arent better than me!" sort of attitude.

ThreeStripe
11-25-2015, 12:15 PM
So, you say police our own. What's your solution if she refuses to pull her head out? Blanket party?

Everybody needs to write her up until the chief does something. A lot of your guys are going to miss rides home otherwise. With planes going out full all the time, the jumpseat is a lifeboat for commuters. If she is as bad as you guys say, your company would be better off without her anyway.

knobcrk
11-25-2015, 05:08 PM
Recently a pilot from airline "X" tried to jump-seat on one of our flights. The captain who was working the flight did not accommodate the JS and apparently told him "its my personal policy to not allow jump-seaters".

I'm not the captain in question but I wanted apologize to this specific jump-seater and anyone else that might have been effected by this captains "personal policy".

I want to to make it clear that this is just a ONE person deal and we are addressing it via the proper channels.

Anyone is welcome on my jump-seat regardless of carrier, any time. (CASS and W&B permitting of course, LOL)

And if you do know who this captain is, keep the name to yourself.

Dude why are you apologizing? Did you do it? By posting it on here, about a thousand people know about it now that don't need to know. Are you assuming there's someone dumb enough now to deny you a jumpseat? If there's someone that does that then they are no better than her.

knobcrk
11-25-2015, 05:09 PM
Everybody needs to write her up until the chief does something. A lot of your guys are going to miss rides home otherwise. With planes going out full all the time, the jumpseat is a lifeboat for commuters. If she is as bad as you guys say, your company would be better off without her anyway.

Nobody is going to do anything about her. She has years of complaints on her, she's still here.

knobcrk
11-25-2015, 05:14 PM
I'm not going to jump to conclusions and I am not affliated with either TSA or airline X. However, the captain is in the right. It is the PIC's authority to allow a jumpseater, NOT the gate agent, jumpseat committee, or management. Perhaps there was some other motives for the captain's decision. The JS could have been out of compliance, low on oxygen, broken JS, etc. Regardless, it is the captain's jumpseat and you are a guest, treat it like that! It is possible the captain did not choose the right words to convey the message.

it's basically a courtesy for fellow pilots. Unless you are one of those fat guys where the tie barely makes it over the curvature of your belly and need that space in tiny regional cockpits then you really have no reason to deny someone. She didn't say it was O2 or WB.

Waitingformins
11-25-2015, 05:48 PM
I'm not going to jump to conclusions and I am not affliated with either TSA or airline X. However, the captain is in the right. It is the PIC's authority to allow a jumpseater, NOT the gate agent, jumpseat committee, or management. Perhaps there was some other motives for the captain's decision. The JS could have been out of compliance, low on oxygen, broken JS, etc. Regardless, it is the captain's jumpseat and you are a guest, treat it like that! It is possible the captain did not choose the right words to convey the message.

What an ignorant comment.
The captain has the right, defentally not "in the right".

Coneydog
11-25-2015, 06:31 PM
Nobody is going to do anything about her. She has years of complaints on her, she's still here.

That's because she's like 3 minorities. Very hard to get rid of. She'll probably be at United before too long (I'm half kidding)

FlyingKat
11-25-2015, 09:45 PM
uh oh.......

3NjTE2vpMA8

Poser765
11-25-2015, 10:21 PM
So can anyone explain this captains reasoning behind this personal policy.

Gert B Frobe
11-25-2015, 10:58 PM
She denied the jumpseat to a commuting C5 pilot because she said "they" are stealing TSA aircraft and flying in IAD.

FlyingKat
11-25-2015, 11:09 PM
She denied the jumpseat to a commuting C5 pilot because she said "they" are stealing TSA aircraft and flying in IAD.

Jnu7gauDyyA

CaptainCarl
11-25-2015, 11:34 PM
Oh she knew what she was saying.

And has said it before.

Nobody is going to do anything about her. She has years of complaints on her, she's still here.

That's because she's like 3 minorities. Very hard to get rid of. She'll probably be at United before too long (I'm half kidding)

She denied the jumpseat to a commuting C5 pilot because she said "they" are stealing TSA aircraft and flying in IAD.

https://media.giphy.com/media/l41lIs1szzgDRTfva/giphy.gif

Riverside
11-26-2015, 02:50 AM
She denied the jumpseat to a commuting C5 pilot because she said "they" are stealing TSA aircraft and flying in IAD.

Didn't hear that one. I hope that wasn't the case.

tvlawyer
11-26-2015, 06:32 AM
So, based on the decisions of some unknown MBA in the glass tower, she takes it upon herself to "punish" a hard working pilot who's just trying to get home to his family? That is freakin' vile.

riel39
11-26-2015, 07:31 AM
Angela Bennet

Nice.
I assume she's not a commuter. Where is this person based?

JungleBunnyLove
11-26-2015, 07:43 AM
Angela Bennet

I kinda figured it was her, and I'm not one bit surprised. Not a snowballs chance in hell of getting her ass tossed out of her. Best case scenario is we're able to have her pulled off line for a bit. Matter of fact, this just happened to another female captain in IAD who managed to generate a number of "I'm concerned" reports. Unfortunately, both of these Captains fall into a protective class and will most likely only continue to climb the steps of success, regardless of their failure to have the most basic comprehension of what it takes to do their job in a safe and efficient manner. After 3 years at TSA I'm finally moving on but before I go I may just stop into Chips office and give him my impression of both these individuals. I doubt it will do a whole lot of good, but if enough people bring it to managements attention, I'd think they'd be obligated from a liability stand point to take some type of action. Time will tell.:)

Riverside
11-26-2015, 10:23 AM
Nice.
I assume she's not a commuter. Where is this person based?

I'll give you a hint. C5 is receiving erj145 and will be based in IAD.

iFlyRC
11-26-2015, 10:51 AM
I'll remember that name, and add her to my "no Jumpseat list". So far she is the only one on it.

HeffeCafe
11-26-2015, 11:29 AM
I was the jumpseating pilot from commutair, she literally said it's "a personal policy to not allow jumpseaters". Every TSA person I've talked to since says she awful to fly with. BTW, and our new aircraft aren't coming from TSA or xjt.

Planedrive
11-26-2015, 12:47 PM
Where are the C5 planes coming from?

FlyingKat
11-26-2015, 01:24 PM
Where are the C5 planes coming from?

Ex Expressjet LRs from the desert....

HeffeCafe
11-26-2015, 01:50 PM
What he ^^^ said.

PatrickBateman
11-26-2015, 03:47 PM
Man what has TSA become? Part of me misses the old times....but I feel so out of touch now.

Riverside
11-26-2015, 03:48 PM
Man what has TSA become? Part of me misses the old times....but I feel so out of touch now.

So you're hurt because of one black sheep in the company?

Coneydog
11-26-2015, 04:04 PM
Man what has TSA become? Part of me misses the old times....but I feel so out of touch now.

We're talking about one person...literally one captain from the IAD list that no one can stand. 1 out of 50 ain't bad.

PatrickBateman
11-26-2015, 04:36 PM
So you're hurt because of one black sheep in the company?

We're talking about one person...literally one captain from the IAD list that no one can stand. 1 out of 50 ain't bad.

Back in my day this would have been handled without someone having a "reputation"

....but that's none of my business...

Coneydog
11-26-2015, 04:56 PM
Back in my day this would have been handled without someone having a "reputation"

....but that's none of my business...

Lol...please enlighten us.

HeffeCafe
11-26-2015, 05:03 PM
I'll be jumpseating again tomorrow on TSA, and believe me, if that AB is the captain she will getting the earful from me that she didn't get last week. If it's not her, the crew will get the big thanks as usual. Like I've told numerous other TSA crewmembers in the last week, you all are welcome on CommutAir anytime, but spread the word, no one here will be letting AB on at all, period. Not to mention all of my United mainline friends who have her on the list as well. Karma is a b****!

PatrickBateman
11-26-2015, 07:55 PM
Lol...please enlighten us.

They wouldn't be allowed into fort kickass! Sheesh! How do you not know this?

I'll be jumpseating again tomorrow on TSA, and believe me, if that ########## is the captain she will getting the earful from me that she didn't get last week. If it's not her, the crew will get the big thanks as usual. Like I've told numerous other TSA crewmembers in the last week, you all are welcome on CommutAir anytime, but spread the word, no one here will be letting Angie Bennet on at all, period. Not to mention all of my United mainline friends who have her on the list as well. Karma is a b****!

Aint supposed to throw names out there bruh! You know that!

Rmk1991
11-26-2015, 08:11 PM
As far as I know, it was a mesa pilot AND a fellow TSA pilot that was trying to the jumpseat with this captain in question. Both got denied due to whatever the heck personal preference means. I hope other pilots at other companies realize that this type of behavior is not the norm here at TSA. I've personally seen pilots at TSA do whatever they can in their power to get jumpseaters on to go home/to work. We're all in this mess together. That type of behavior shouldn't be allowed. I don't know whether it was a mesa guy or a C5 guy but I do know forsure there was a TSA pilot that was denied so it's not like she was doing it to single out another company.

HeffeCafe
11-27-2015, 03:05 AM
They wouldn't be allowed into fort kickass! Sheesh! How do you not know this?



Aint supposed to throw names out there bruh! You know that!

Her name has been spread far and wide.

HeffeCafe
11-27-2015, 03:13 AM
I'll be jumpseating again tomorrow on TSA, and believe me, if that AB is the captain she will getting the earful from me that she didn't get last week. If it's not her, the crew will get the big thanks as usual. Like I've told numerous other TSA crewmembers in the last week, you all are welcome on CommutAir anytime, but spread the word, no one here will be letting AB on at all, period. Not to mention all of my United mainline friends who have her on the list as well. Karma is a b****!

I'll be polite, but I will have words.

minimwage4
11-27-2015, 05:11 AM
I think I've heard that Tsa got sued years ago by a minority and they lost the case. Word is they're not willing to touch minorities short of something obviously messed up.

sweetholyjesus
11-27-2015, 05:22 AM
I think I've heard that Tsa got sued years ago by a minority and they lost the case. Word is they're not willing to touch minorities short of something obviously messed up.
I guess they've never been sued by the (majority?) :rolleyes:

It's one bad captain. The anti-female/anti-minority bit gets old fast.

Riverside
11-27-2015, 05:52 AM
Originally Posted by Riverside View Post
So you're hurt because of one black sheep in the company?

Couldn't help myself.

SpeedyVagabond
11-27-2015, 06:00 AM
I'll be jumpseating again tomorrow on TSA, and believe me, if that AB is the captain she will getting the earful from me that she didn't get last week. If it's not her, the crew will get the big thanks as usual. Like I've told numerous other TSA crewmembers in the last week, you all are welcome on CommutAir anytime, but spread the word, no one here will be letting AB on at all, period. Not to mention all of my United mainline friends who have her on the list as well. Karma is a b****!

You have no class. The jumpseat isn't a right, it's a privilege. And it's absolutely the Captain's decision on whether of not you get to sit in it. I'm a commuter as well and have been denied by a pilot twice at a well respected major simply because he doesn't take jumpseaters. It sucks but you move along to the next flight. Why don't you give us your name.

HuskerAv8tor
11-27-2015, 06:06 AM
You have no class. The jumpseat isn't a right, it's a privilege. And it's absolutely the Captain's decision on whether of not you get to sit in it. I'm a commuter as well and have been denied by a pilot twice at a well respected major simply because he doesn't take jumpseaters. It sucks but you move along to the next flight. Why don't you give us your name.
I think the prevailing thoughts of pilots is that this is a terrible "personal policy" to have. What possible reason could a captain have, preventing a fellow pilot from getting home to their family? I think the public 'discussion' is warranted.

PatrickBateman
11-27-2015, 06:11 AM
I think I've heard that Tsa got sued years ago by a minority and they lost the case. Word is they're not willing to touch minorities short of something obviously messed up.

Geez! Ya should have told me this when I was there....I could have gotten away with more shenanigans!

:D

SpeedyVagabond
11-27-2015, 06:38 AM
I think the prevailing thoughts of pilots is that this is a terrible "personal policy" to have. What possible reason could a captain have, preventing a fellow pilot from getting home to their family? I think the public 'discussion' is warranted.

I didn't write that a public discussion isn't warranted. I added to the discussion by pointing out that, like it or not, it's the Captain's jump seat. And furthermore, to use real names on this or any other forum without first providing yours is a classless thing to do. A moral and physical coward.

Day4mx
11-27-2015, 06:39 AM
You have no class. The jumpseat isn't a right, it's a privilege. And it's absolutely the Captain's decision on whether of not you get to sit in it. I'm a commuter as well and have been denied by a pilot twice at a well respected major simply because he doesn't take jumpseaters. It sucks but you move along to the next flight. Why don't you give us your name.

This isn't about class. This is about a captain systematically dening jumpseaters based on no merit. I've seen captains deny jumpseaters for legit reasons and have it ruin their day. I've been denied one time in my life after the captain did literally everything he could weight and balance wise to get me in. He was absolutely heart broken he couldn't get me on. Commuting makes this job infinitely harder. Commuting makes family life infinitely harder. She should have her name out there. And every pilot should make it a point to make her life as difficult as possible.

Packrat
11-27-2015, 06:41 AM
I didn't write that a public discussion isn't warranted. I added to the discussion by pointing out that, like it or not, it's the Captain's jump seat. And furthermore, to use real names on this or any other forum without first providing yours is a classless thing to do. A moral and physical coward.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^+1^^^^^^^^^^^^

SpeedyVagabond
11-27-2015, 06:44 AM
You guys evidently don't read everything someone writes. As I said before, I've been denied twice by the same mainline guy. Once it really wrecked my day requiring many many hours at the airport followed by a transcon red-eye two leg commute to get to work. All because that guy didn't want a jump seater. But in the end, I sucked it up, and used back up plans to get to work. I didn't come on a public forum and out the guy's name which is a far more heinous thing to do in my opinion. Now I'm through commenting on this topic and as always you're all welcome to my jump seat.

DOGIII
11-27-2015, 06:54 AM
I didn't come on a public forum and out the guy's name which is a far more heinous thing to do in my opinion.


How is that "far more heinous"? If this person decides they don't want to take Jumpseaters, fine, but why should they be able to Jumpseat unrestricted? By having the name out there, this pilot can continue their ill-advised practice while allowing others to reciprocate.

JohnDoe
11-27-2015, 07:01 AM
You can obviously tell who are commuters and those who don't in this post

DOGIII
11-27-2015, 07:05 AM
You can obviously tell who are commuters and those who don't in this post


Lol. I hear what you are saying, but it is possible to both live in base AND be extremely sympathetic to the cause. It goes beyond just the commuting aspect, it is a matter of camaraderie.

Flip69
11-27-2015, 07:05 AM
This thread is actually a useful one (for a change) as it allows me update the watchlist if she ever trys to jumpseat

iFlyRC
11-27-2015, 07:14 AM
It's her right to deny all jumpseaters, and it is her responsibility to deal with the consequences of her exercising her rights. She'll never get on my jump seat. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should! I have a huge problem with people who do not apply logic, or lack the ability to defend their position in the face of logic.

sweetholyjesus
11-27-2015, 07:26 AM
I'm curious, do you guys actually read the name on the jumpseat form and compare it to a list you keep in your pocket? Serious question

DOGIII
11-27-2015, 07:28 AM
I'm curious, do you guys actually read the name on the jumpseat form and compare it to a list you keep in your pocket? Serious question


Seems like an easy task, seeing as there is only one person on the list so far.

FlyingKat
11-27-2015, 08:33 AM
I'm curious, do you guys actually read the name on the jumpseat form and compare it to a list you keep in your pocket? Serious question


There is an ALPA master scab list and some guys carry it around and deny anyone on that list. Not used much anymore because most of the scabs on it have retired........

http://download.cabledrum.net/wikileaks_archive/file/airline-pilot-scab-list-2004.pdf

F2m185
11-27-2015, 09:03 AM
You guys evidently don't read everything someone writes. As I said before, I've been denied twice by the same mainline guy. Once it really wrecked my day requiring many many hours at the airport followed by a transcon red-eye two leg commute to get to work. All because that guy didn't want a jump seater. But in the end, I sucked it up, and used back up plans to get to work. I didn't come on a public forum and out the guy's name which is a far more heinous thing to do in my opinion. Now I'm through commenting on this topic and as always you're all welcome to my jump seat.

no obviously you dont have all that great of reading skills yourself. he said the captain in question denied the js to someone for "stealing their flying in IAD", among other things. thats not personal preference, policy or otherwise thats being a dick plain and simple. but here you go with the its a privilege not a right and everyone is a spoiled entitled millennial idiocy.... unreal.

v1valarob
11-30-2015, 01:43 AM
I made the mistake once of picking up open time with *** as the captain. The first leg not one word was spoken other than those required by the SOPs. Didn't care to know if I was rested, or if I had a long commute, or if I was low time or anything. The rest of the trip was alright but she certainly has a bad reputation of having a **** poor personality.

If you hear a really annoying lady waterskier on the radio, it's her.

TBucket
11-30-2015, 08:35 PM
I had her as my FO once. She was awful to fly with then, and I can't imagine how bad she is in the left seat.



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