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New FAR Part 121.436 Conundrum

Old 07-23-2013, 10:51 AM
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Default New FAR Part 121.436 Conundrum

Here’s one for the books which our lawyers in DC did not contemplate.

FAR 121.436 is effective Aug., 1st, 2013. If serving as PIC has 1,000 as SIC in combination of 121 operations PIC under 91.1053(a)(2)(i), or PIC under 135.243(a)(1). These requirements do not apply if serving as PIC under 121 as of July 31st, 2013.

Here’s the conundrum. Let’s take a pilot who has some 10,000 PIC time in Large Transport Category Aircraft. Let’s assume this pilot quits one 121 Air Carrier for another 121 Airline and start his training on the 1st of July, 2103. This pilot will still be in training as of the 1st of August, 2013. It’s obvious that he is not serving as a PIC under 121 operations as of July 31st, 2013.

The question is what happens if the pilot has less than 1,000 SIC and no Part 91(k) or 135.243 time? Does he have to accumulate 1,000 hours SIC time? I know this seems ridiculous, but there seems to be a bit of confusions about this. Has anyone come across any publications or letters from their FSDO providing relief for no less than 1,000 SIC Captains?

It appears the new FAR Part 121.436 does not take into either transitioning captains or those switching airlines.
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:13 AM
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Default New FAR Part 121.436 Conundrum

Maybe I'm a little confused as to your question, but did this pilot not already accumulate the required 1000 hours during the logging of his 10,000 hours in large transport category aircraft?
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:17 AM
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Default New FAR Part 121.436 Conundrum

....and if not, the fact that he/ she had served as PIC under 121 prior to the 31st of July would grandfather this pilot in. As I read it, you do not need to be serving as PIC ON July 31st, just prior to that date.
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by MaxRate View Post
Maybe I'm a little confused as to your question, but did this pilot not already accumulate the required 1000 hours during the logging of his 10,000 hours in large transport category aircraft?

No... About 250 SIC time.

and if not, the fact that he/ she had served as PIC under 121 prior to the 31st of July would grandfather this pilot in. As I read it, you do not need to be serving as PIC ON July 31st, just prior to that date.
That's the conundrum... the last line sentence of the new FAR 121.436 Reguation states "These requirements do not apply if serving as PIC under 121 as of July 31st, 2013" That said the chap in training on August 1st, 2013 with his new airline is not serving as captain under Part 121 as of July 31st, 2013.

Like I said, it's truly rediculous to say the law makers who drafted this reg did not take this into consideration.
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Old 07-23-2013, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by captjns View Post
No... About 250 SIC time.



That's the conundrum... the last line sentence of the new FAR 121.436 Reguation states "These requirements do not apply if serving as PIC under 121 as of July 31st, 2013" That said the chap in training on August 1st, 2013 with his new airline is not serving as captain under Part 121 as of July 31st, 2013.

Like I said, it's truly rediculous to say the law makers who drafted this reg did not take this into consideration.
I read as of as meaning on or prior. I don't see the issue.
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Old 07-23-2013, 09:42 PM
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Originally Posted by scambo1 View Post
I read as of as meaning on or prior. I don't see the issue.
Unfortunately it does not say on or prior. It clearly states "ON". I am hoping to hear from my FSDO on this matter.
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Old 07-24-2013, 03:58 AM
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Captjns brings up a very good question. Recommend that someone request a formal interpretation through their local FSDO. The FSDO does not issue interpretations. This would need to be elevated by the FSDO to FAA Legal in DC.

Last edited by PerfInit; 07-24-2013 at 03:59 AM. Reason: Fixed OP screen name
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Old 07-24-2013, 04:44 AM
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Default New FAR Part 121.436 Conundrum

By that strict of a definition, any 121 Captain who has the day off on the 31st is out of luck.
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Old 07-24-2013, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by PerfInit View Post
Captjns brings up a very good question. Recommend that someone request a formal interpretation through their local FSDO. The FSDO does not issue interpretations. This would need to be elevated by the FSDO to FAA Legal in DC.
Queries have been requested.
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Old 09-26-2014, 11:12 AM
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Just bumping this up, but the FAA has ruled that the pilot in question is NOT qualified to serve as PIC after July 31.

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...rpretation.pdf
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