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trip 11-21-2018 09:55 AM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2712061)
Do you know why that automation was even present to begin with (however improperly implemented)? Because pilots stall airplanes.

No pilots, no need for that system. Chicken and the egg kinda thing.

I thought it was because of the larger engines that have to sit farther forward and higher increased the instability of the design?
My UAV bud tells me the horror stories of how the software engineer types do updates to code overnight but then neglect to let the operators know because it's over there head. Seems we've reached that point as well.

Bigapplepilot 11-21-2018 10:22 AM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2711852)
The automation forbids flying the airplane into the ground in the same way you can't stall an Airbus.

Set an altitude below the EGPWS floor for that area and it stops. No matter what you do. "I can't let you do that, Dave".

And don't say shut the engines down. Without abnormal indications the computer won't let you do that, either.

Jeez you guys are so last century thinkers.

Think about how a drone works. You turn it on, without ever operating one. It knows where it is. You tell it to go to xyz, it takes off, flies, and returns and lands all on its own.

That is where we are headed. The technology exists. It works. The only thing stopping it is regulations.

How did that work out for the radio operator, navigator, or flight engineer?

Not to mention, if you think about it, your argument for having TWO pilots is because one might fly it into the ground.

IMO, that is a reason to have ZERO pilots. In the same line of thinking, since the vast majority of accidents these days are pilot error, that is also a reason to have ZERO pilots - it will improve safety.

And every soccer game is lost because a goalie missed a save. So we should get rid of goalies cause it’s goalie error. See the problem with the logic?

OldWeasel 11-21-2018 11:16 AM


Originally Posted by Bigapplepilot (Post 2712110)
And every soccer game is lost because a goalie missed a save. So we should get rid of goalies cause it’s goalie error. See the problem with the logic?



You don’t get it. We aren’t seeing it. He has the only correct answers whether we like it, or can prove otherwise.


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OldWeasel 11-21-2018 11:18 AM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2712059)
You aren't getting it. And I don't want to discuss why on a public forum.

Learning from others mistakes (and your own) is very beneficial in our job.

Yes, it is disturbing. And it's coming.



Feel free to PM me


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Name User 11-21-2018 11:50 AM


Originally Posted by trip (Post 2712099)
I thought it was because of the larger engines that have to sit farther forward and higher increased the instability of the design?
My UAV bud tells me the horror stories of how the software engineer types do updates to code overnight but then neglect to let the operators know because it's over there head. Seems we've reached that point as well.

Read this

https://www.seattletimes.com/busines...ion-air-crash/

It's basically a stick pusher

Name User 11-21-2018 11:51 AM


Originally Posted by Bigapplepilot (Post 2712110)
And every soccer game is lost because a goalie missed a save. So we should get rid of goalies cause it’s goalie error. See the problem with the logic?

That doesn't make any sense. In my example you would remove the players so no goal can be scored.

OldWeasel 11-21-2018 12:11 PM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2712153)
Read this

https://www.seattletimes.com/busines...ion-air-crash/

It's basically a stick pusher



I don’t know which is more frightening. The design flaw or the fact the manufacturer believes it’s not important to tell the pilot what might happen in an extreme situation.

I can think of at least two instances of “this will change everything” tech. Both ate humble pie.


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Bigapplepilot 11-21-2018 12:49 PM


Originally Posted by Name User (Post 2712156)
That doesn't make any sense. In my example you would remove the players so no goal can be scored.

I guess if Virtual Reality sets in then yes many people won’t need to step on an airplane which would eliminate players.

Keep in mind that an airline pilot is doing more than just managing the energy of an airplane. Everything from management decisions at the gate to get an airplane out on time, to handling a medical, interfacing with a ATC, a buildup necessitating aweather diversion that doesn’t appear on radar, being the company representative. Many of these issues aren’t technological and can’t be solved technologically.

Other issues...

Lowering the landing gear in case of a hydraulic fire, onboard fire(noticing fumes before the gauges do), preflight, deice, etc

And...we don’t have the infrastructure. Just try taxing a drone at JFK on a Friday at 5pm.

Bigapplepilot 11-21-2018 12:51 PM


Originally Posted by OldWeasel (Post 2712136)
You don’t get it. We aren’t seeing it. He has the only correct answers whether we like it, or can prove otherwise.


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Exactly. That’s why I probably shouldn’t argue.

tomgoodman 11-21-2018 01:09 PM

Technical capability will be overruled by a near-term cost/benefit veto. (Near-term meaning: how soon the individuals who make the purchase decisions will realize a net personal gain from doing this). The price of redundancy sufficient to satisfy the lawyers is vastly greater than the anticipated return within their career horizons.


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