Airline Pilot Central Forums - Should I expect a call from the top tier?

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- - Should I expect a call from the top tier? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/career-questions/126415-should-i-expect-call-top-tier.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 2952968)

My gut feel is that four busts is consistently beyond redemption for most or all of the big six. My gut feel is that two can usually be overcome under the right circumstances. Three is somewhere in the middle (gut feel).

Very aggressive pursuit of your goals shifts the odds towards your favor, but there are some folks out there who never get calls, even with clean records (that might change soon). I think that the standout points on your resume are at least as important as the blackmarks. Your average boring white male pilot can easily get lost in the traffic. If you have unusual positives which get their attention then they might be able to overlook/over-ride some black marks.

I do believe that the colgan accident made everyone (even regionals) sensitive to the potential PR impact of one's training history. The recent atlas crash is just going to re-inforce that unfortunately... if you were looking for a bad-pilot poster-child to replace CA Renslow, central casting couldn't have come up with a better candidate than Aska. And when the current crop of regional noobs (which includes some barrel-scrappings) upgrades en-masse we might even see a repeat of colgan. A couple years ago I was frankly alarmed, but I think at least some regionals have wised up and tightened up on hiring/training.

No, I've been involved in hiring at previous levels. I work with a lot of senior folks in the reserves, they and I have tried to help a lot of transitioning junior officers over the years get into the majors. A couple of my buddies are or were involved in legacy hiring. And all of us have landed legacy or second-tier major jobs ourselves.

Also have a lot of civilian friends who have progressed (and a few who haven't), so I have some perspective there too (I have helped some civilians get hired too).

Rick, thank you for your response, and I sincerely do appreciate your civility. My gut feel is very different from yours. We’ll just have to agree to disagree on this issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wannabee (Post 2953002)

Do you include stage checks as part of that number, or just check ride for a rating, type, etc?

That depends on whether you reported them on your app. The computer will just score the boxes you check.

But general consensus is that when they ask about checkride/training failures they mean rides for cert/rating/type or 135/121 operating privileges, not intermediate stage checks or sim session repeats.

But you have to read the question very carefully, they seem to be getting more inclusive and broad these days. If in doubt, fess up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glenn Would (Post 2953012)

Rick, thank you for your response, and I sincerely do appreciate your civility. My gut feel is very different from yours. We’ll just have to agree to disagree on this issue.

I'm certainly not claiming to be right or definitive, just my observations.

Also, if the big six actually get short of qualified applicants, they'll probably choose experienced pilots with ancient-history blackmarks over squeeky-clean but unproven CFI'sfor example. I would hope anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickair7777 (Post 2952612)

But 3+ is where picky airlines (ie big six) start getting very gun-shy. It's possible but likely an uphill battle. I'm not sure if even AA WO's will accept three busts.

3+ throws your app out automatically. They do hire people with 3+ busts but only as special cases approved by management.
The last one I know of had a bunch of initial failures, but a spotless 135/121 record.
It's rare though.

Ooh my turn.

Not looking for top tier airlines, just hope that I will be able to get out of the regionals where I have 5k and LCA.

As a juvenile I was dumb and partially unlucky and received a minor in possession of alcohol citation.... twice.

Law in that state required a drivers license suspension. So I have 2 suspensions, both >10 years ago, both under 18 years old.

Also have two primary checkride failures... and a poor high school and first college GPA. Second college (graduated from) is great.

Any hope for me? Or think I’m dust in the wind? I’d forever be happy just to make it to a LCC or major. Unfortunate that it took longer than most for me to figure out life and had to dig myself out of a big hole to get here.