CaptainCarl

My question is: Do I need a college degree?

My next question is: What are my chances of getting a job at "dream job" without one?

And finally: Are there any advantages that might outweigh not having a degree? (such as age:experience ratio)

B757200ER

Honestly? Having a college degree today is like having a high-school diploma 20 years ago---its expected. Very, very few pilots get hired at majors without one. Something like 2 out of every 100. Don't give up, but try and get a 2-yr at minimum. I would say its extremely important.

CaptainCarl

An associates I can probably manage but doing online courses for four years will kill me.

I did University of Phoenix for 6 weeks and realized that I was the marketing department for them. Example: "Why are online classes better than going to a traditional classroom?" Grrr... I was not happy. Other factors contributed to the end of my time with them as well.

dannolars

What would you consider a dream job? Would being a CFI count for you, a regional flyer, or are you talking about a legacy airline/cargo type job? If you want to be a CFI or something like that I would say you are ok without, but like B757 said, it is pretty much expected in the big ones (I don't know about the regionals).

CaptainCarl

Well, I did the CFI thing, that was some good fun and great experience. I'm currently with Trans States (regional) out of STL and just hoping I'll survive the winter.

My dream job is something with "heavy" attached to the end of it

I have heard stories of guys getting on with SWA, FedEx and UPS without a degree, but as 757 said, they are becoming few and far between.

I just can't justify wasting my time with something I will never use. I'm 20 years old and am ready for my ATP, just need a waiver for that age requirement which I know I probably won't get.

I am seriously considering converting and getting my ATP in Europe (age requirement there is 21 as opposed to FAA's 23). Thoughts?

StillLearning

Captain,

Many senior regional captains, without college, earn nearly $100K.

If you want to fly something that ends in "heavy" before you retire, there are some 4th and 5th tier cargo operators that fly the heavies.

If you want a degree, you may consider looking at some online aviation programs such as:

Global Aviation Degree Program

you may be able to earn credits for your private, instrument, multi and commercial

rickair7777

I used to hire people, aviation and non-aviation. The reality is that the "Diploma Mill" online degrees from places like UofP are almost worthless in the real world.

It's not solely the content and academic standards, it's also the nature of who they market to, who their target audience is: People who are usually not stand-outs...they didn't go to college when they had the chance, and now want a shortcut to the same result.

This is not to say that distance learning is bad. I feel that there is a great deal to be gained from a traditional educational setting...learning to interact, share ideas, and work together with other students. However, many legitimate, traditional universities (even some "brand bame" schools) offer distance-learning programs which are pretty high quality. Also, their degrees are not usually identified as DL...ie nobody can tell that you didn't do traditional attendance by looking at the diploma. Be aware though, that a quick glance at your employment and residence history could tell a savvy interviewer whether you physically attended, so don't fib.

I would venture that a guess that a 2-year DL degree from a real school might be better than a 4-year degree from a known diploma mill. I personally know that SWA will hire folks with a 2-year degree.

rickair7777

You won't get an FAA waiver.

Where are you going to work in Europe? Unless you are an EU citizen, your chances of walking off the boat, getting a work permit, and getting an airline job are essentially nil. Do your homework before you spend the money on that.

CaptainCarl

Never say never. I am aware that my chances are a snowball's chance in hell but that doesn't mean I can't try. What makes a 23-year old so special anyways? I worked my butt off to get where I am today, so why should I be limited by the number of years I've been alive? Anyways, even if they say "no," I haven't lost anything.

As for Europe Dual citizenship solves that problem.

The problem is: I have a job. I hold a line. But the chances of getting to the left seat in the States are, as you said, nil. We'll see though. I'm gonna play it by ear.

Btw, thanks for the feedback guys, I appreciate it

rickair7777

That dual citizenship might come in handy.

As for the waiver, you have to understand how government works...they ONLY do things to either benefit themselves or their organization, or to prevent harm to their career or organization...they almost NEVER do anything just because "it's the right thing to do".

Is there any upside FOR THEM in granting you a waiver? No, none whatsoever.

Is there any downside? Sure...

- If they give one to you, then every other young regional FO will want one too...how will they explain that when the investigative report breaks on CNN?

- If an incident should happen before you turn 23, there will a congressional investigation following the CNN investigative report...that CAN'T be good for a civil servant's pension

But go ahead and apply, you never know.