Disclosing failed checkrides
 

When applying do I need to disclose a failed checkride when it was over 10 years ago? I know PRIA indicates only 5 years back and a carrier is only required to give records from 5 years ago. So the "age-old" question is do I need to disclose and will a carrier find this if they are doing the standard background check?? &%$^^^&&%$^&%&^$!!!!!!!

Legal 2
 

I believe FOIA only asks about actions against?? Which thankfully their are none.

I would be honest. It's a small industry. They could just by chance talk to someone who knows about it.

If they ask, you need to answer truthfully. If it is found out later, you will more than likely get fired.

This is extremely true, but also make sure you know the law/length of time involved. If your not REQUIRED to give them info, you should not. Read and understand how it works first. However if at all you might even slightly be required to disclose it, then make sure you disclose it, because if you get hired, start training, then they find out, they will fire you, and you will now have to explain why you got paid by xxx airline for only 2 weeks.

If they ask for it you probably need to disclose it. Just because PRIA does not go that far back does NOT mean you are legally protected from lying to an employer.

There is NO law that says they cannot ask about your entire pilot career, going back to 1903 if it comes to that.

What kind of checkride was it? If it was for a type rating then you have a pink slip, which can be obtained from the FAA via FOIA request (pink slips are not included in PRIA).

One 121 training bust over five years ago should not really affect you as long as you completed it on the second try.

That!

If its asked, tell the truth! Are we really to the point where that's even a question?

And busted checkrides show up in your records request from the FAA, regardless of time. If its ten years old, it's not gonna be a problem anyway. Just tell the truth! You can never go wrong following this advice.

Just out of curiosity, whats the rule on that? What happens if you don't complete it on the second try? For instance, I know a few guys from my class that busted their oral on their PC, came back for round 2, busted the sim, then did the whole thing over a 3rd time and passed. Now they are all out on the line and have been for years. Are they stuck at this company forever now? That might explain why we have so many 15+ year lifers.

What's really bad is busting the same event more than once...that leads them to suspect that you really struggled as opposed to just having a bad day. Ie failing the same oral twice in a row.

But multiple busts of any sort are not good, especially 121 busts.

I agree, it seems like what he's saying tho is that this would show up as two seperate busts even tho the same event wasn't technically failed (oral and sim both busted individually one time only). Seems like a sticky situation.

Failed checkrides
 

8710's are in your FAAFile forever .If the company gets a complete airmen file ( the same one you can request )there are copies of every 8710 you filled out including 8710's for re examination
Do you want to risk being hauled out of training and getting fired or looking over your shoulder every day wondering if theyvwill be coming for you ?

What if a second try wasn't offered, as in my case? It will forever show as a ATP certificate failure, which was subsequently completed elsewhere, however the EMB type ride failure was never given a second try.

That's the problem...it will appear as though SKW decided that you were not suitable pilot material thanks to that arbitrary policy.

If the pilot shortage materializes, you might still have a shot at a major if you want.

That policy was a case-study in unintended consequences...it was intended to light a fire under a few spikey-haired entitlement generation punks who didn't take the job seriously, which was probably a good cause. But it put a tremendous amount of power in the hands of training instructors, who are only human and far from objective in every case.

It didn't help that you went jet-bro, as I can attest to as well.

Im looking for some clarification on this as I had a situation happen to me several years ago that was a lot like what is being discussed here. I went in for a recurrent pc, busted the oral and was not given the chance to fly. Came back two days later passed the oral. Came back two days after that and busted the sim. Came back the next week and took the full checkride again, passed everything. There was a lot more crap in between that wasn't my fault, but ill spare the excuses and say this is what it looks like on paper. I have NEVER had a 121 issue before that, and NEVER had one since. Its been 5 years. So because of this, are you saying my career progression is stopped? I have 40 years left to fly and I will NEVER be able to get another flying job because a sim instructor wanted to make an example of me on an RPC? Is there a policy that makes this a reality? No amount of time can make it go away? So I might as well have a DUI? Or maybe I would be better off? Im not trying to be smart, I honestly want to know what im dealing with. Thanks!

Wouldn't this information not show up to future employers once it is beyond 5 years ago? It sounds like there was no pink slip handed out and it's just a matter of company training records. Would a major only see this up to 5 years ago? Ricky?

There are some airlines that treat those with two or more failed checkride attempts as a scarlet letter and will never touch you. There are some that will do the same with any part 121 or 135 failures or perceived failures. When they get the required record from the FAA, ALL checkride failures are listed there.

The majority are enlightened and even give those with a distant past DUI a chance. If you get through an interview and then get the "no thanks, you failed a checkride," thank the airline for the free interview prep and selecting themselves out of your future prospects. You'll no longer have to waste time prepping and applying to them.

Having years of successful part 121 flying experience after the checkride failure(s) is a good sign. You grew up, matured, finally learned the system, passed several additional line checks, proficiency checks, sim checks, and so on. Time does heal the wound.

If you lie, and the airline will find out, you can expect another black mark on your record, a termination plus a bad reference, and it'll be a recent stain, refreshing the black marks from the previous events.

If you tell the truth, and don't get any calls, check out an interview prep service to see if perhaps your telling of the truth is too evasive or brutal for an airline to stomach.

And, you never know if the airline might be feeling the pinch and need to hire someone with varied experience. Perhaps their perfect pilots are getting bored in the cockpit, so they need someone in there with stories to tell to keep the others awake. It's all a lottery.

Probably not a career killer, since it was technically two separate events oral and sim). You might claim you were not feeling well or had personal distractions during that timeframe.

Obviously this might make it harder with some airlines.