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Career Advice

Old 03-08-2016, 06:23 AM
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Hello all, long time viewer first time poster. Just looking for possible career advice. Just crossed 1600 hours a mark that i thought i would have never reached and I feel pretty proud of it. Coming from a family that was always struggling somehow i managed . Sent in my airline app and have been getting calls from every regional to set up an interview. Trying to get over the "skeletons in the closet" and move on. I got my private license six years ago. Its been a long journey to this point, many different flying jobs, financial issues during training causing me to stop flying. At that point I decided to invest the remaining money I had and start my own business that helped me pay my way through college and attain all my ratings. Anyway fast forward to the point. 4 failed check rides that to this day still bug me. Yes I can say I have learned and benefited from them. They caused me take a different approach towards things and helped me change my attitude to a more humble and understanding view which i feel helped me during my Instructing Days. First one up to bat was my Private. Came in prepared confident passed the oral in record time, went out for the flight portion everything was going good. The plane I was flying had a very bad DG, very bad precession and i was aware of it. I thought I would stay one step ahead of that and use Vor radials to accompany all of my checkpoints on the cross country portion. I get to my first check point everything is good, as soon as I pass over my point, I dialed in the new radial, marked my time and the examiner asks me if I wish to continue. Of course i asked if something was wrong and the examiner stated, you did not meet the standards for pilotage and deadreckoing. Decided to continue and retest the next day. Next was the instrument, oral and flight went solid i couldn't be happier. Next came my commercial I was feeling great i was able to get over my private ride and was focusing on success for this check ride. Oral went by pretty quick no problems. Flight portion comes everything was going good I felt comfortable. Last maneuver of the flight examiner has me do a power off 180 to my home airport. I felt confident I have done this maneuver many times without issue. I picked my point and overshot it. Examiner stated, looks like we will have to try that again on a different day. Maybe if I went around I could have had a chance. At this point I'm beating myself up about not going around. Retested and put a .5 on the plane. At this point in time I'm thinking to myself, 2 busts I still have a chance at the Majors. Decided to get my multi add on and passed that in 2 days. Next came the CFI ride after many months of preparation, aircraft issues multiple mock check rides I was ready to go. Went to my local FSDO that I knew had a reputation but I didn't think twice about it. I went in there knowing i was prepared and was going to give it my best shot. I head stories from applicants that failed previously but I didn't let it get to me. I met the inspector and we are about to start the oral and then someone knocks on the door. The person introduced themselves and stated this would be an observed check ride. I thought to myself great. Anyway they failed me 6 hours in. I went back in passed the oral and next came the Flight. I had two examiners on board. I never flew with two passengers while I was training for the CFI ride. Not thinking twice we started the flight everything was going well. Power on stall to private standards which was a full break. This plane had a tendency to drop the left wing and i knew that. First attempt stalled recovered and teaching the entire time. Examiner said he needs to see a full break. Did the stall again, wing drop to the left, recovered and explained why it happened and how to properly recover. Examiner stated thats unsat unfortunately. Now at this point i was devastated. 4 busts and i thought to myself my career just ended i will never have a chance. Being as persistent as I am I never gave up. I went to a different FSDO retook the entire ride and passed with flying colors. I can honestly say it was the best experience Ive had. I beat myself up for not going there in the first place, because I know to myself i would have had a better shot. Sorry for the rant guys, Ive never been able to talk about it and maybe this will help me move on. I have accepted the reality that I will not able to make it to a major, maybe one day make it to a LCC. Thanks for reading my rant.
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Old 03-08-2016, 07:51 AM
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Hey Tex,

Glad that you are able to post about all of this and accept it. You've already beat yourself up enough, so I won't add on. You know what you did wrong, and you've learned from it. That's fantastic.

I'd like you to read what you just posted from the perspective of a hiring board. You are placing a lot of the blame on everything but you. I'm not saying there aren't other factors, just read it from that view. With some more time and reflection, you may see how you can learn even more and how you can speak about these events without blaming everyone/everything else.

The good news? You can ABSOLUTELY still get hired at a major. Will you be a "Tier 1" Delta candidate? No. Will it be a simple walk in the door? No. But, no not give up!!

From here on out keep going, do amazing and check every box you can. Don't fail any 121 rides or training. Volunteer at your airline, volunteer at something on your off days and find a leadership role in it. Bust your a$$ to be a sim instructor at an airline, do your best to become a line check airman, show initiative in every job you get from now on. Network like crazy. Strive for QUALITY letters of recs from your chief pilots and superiors, not just fellow line pilots.

You can do it. And let me tell you, working for an LCC is NOT bad! Haha. It's still a $150,000+/year job!

Keep your head up, look at the airline apps, and check all the boxes.
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:01 AM
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I won't try to sugar coat it and say you won't have an uphill battle - but I wouldn't completely write off an eventual spot at a major.

I'm sure you've put the 4 busts on your regional applications and they're still calling. If you could get on with one of them and establish a pattern of successful training evolutions, I think you might have a shot at something better in the future. You may be wise to stay a little longer and put some "distance" between your busts and any future application.

Maybe there are some other opinions on this. I think failures that are early in your career, that you willingly disclose, take responsibility for and have learned from can be accepted. As you move forward, a solid pattern of success that indicates you've learned from your mistakes and are continuously improving speaks for itself. Not busting any more checks would be a good thing too.
Good luck.

edit: I'll second what Chip said above. You need to work on your explanations for the busts. No one is going to care about a bad DG, a dropping wing or if the sun was in your eyes. It's rare that a situation encountered on a check ride makes it impossible to pass. You need to determine what YOU could have changed to earn a passing mark and take responsibility for those choices/actions that resulted in the bust.

Last edited by Adlerdriver; 03-08-2016 at 08:11 AM.
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:10 AM
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Don't limit yourself to the majors either. Asia is exploding in growth. The arrogance of the majors will wane as the retirements pile up. If you are very flexible, I think this is an unprecedented time to get into commercial aviation. Get into a regional, build your turbine time, get a job in the training dept. if you can too, even if it's a ground instructor position. Live in base.
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Old 03-08-2016, 01:40 PM
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Thanks for all the feedback, i really do appreciate all the comments. As far as the private and commercial ride goes both of the single items I failed to meet as far as standards go caused the the check ride to be unsat and was given the option of continuation or not. But everyone is right i need to explain it all a bit better and explain what I could have done myself to prevent it from happening which is what I am still trying to put together as i get ready for my interviews. Most likely i will get in contact with a consultation firm to seek advice to help get me ready for the interview.
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