1moreshotatthis

Hello,

I was wondering if any of you fellow pilots could answer a few logbook questions and offer your advice?

1) OK, this is embarrassing... My Master logbook is really out of date. Like several of my friends in the same situation, we are currently digitizing our logbooks into logbook software. Back in 2001, when I thought that I was at my "forever until Age 60 job", I entered my last entry into my master logbook and just kept entering flights into the pocket logbooks. It's all there, mostly, but it is far from elegant. I have everything in these logs, including approaches, except types of approaches and instrument time (My airline tracked this, but when we shut down in 2008 I was unable to get those records). So what I have been doing ever since has been to log 10% of total time as instrument. Since a great amount of my 9500 hours has been flown at night, I thought that that was an underestimation (I.E., when I am up at altitude at night or on top of overcast during the day, I'm not using visual reference to maintain proper attitude. I am using instruments)..

If I was going to cheat on my logbook, I would have cheated 20 years ago. But I also intend to update the Master log as well. So, should I just make it work out to come out to 10 percent over the course of 16 years, with random types of approaches thrown in? Obviously, most were ILS. Note: For my last two jobs, these little logbooks were enough to get hired but now, I really want to clean them up and print out nice ones in binders through my new logbook software. Advice? Insults? Tough love? Flame? Etc...

2) I have logged a landing for every flight I have been on and have been a required crew member on. If we took off, we landed and I logged it. However, a friend of mine only logs half of the landings to reflect that the other crew member made the landing. So here's the question: If logged takeoffs and flights are supposed to equal logged landings, how can you NOT log a takeoff or landing on a FLIGHT? Obviously, you were on a flight that took off and either you landed or crashed. I have always heard that whether you landed or not, you log landings but not necessarily YOUR landing. You are a required crew member, or CFI overseeing touch and go's, so shouldn't you be logging each one? I mean, how can you log a flight, but not log a landing?

3) Shouldn't total time equal Dual + SIC + PIC? Back in training, I was told that training flights could be logged both DUAL and PIC which won't total up correctly, but a POI said otherwise that DUAL + SIC + PIC must add up. So which is it?

Thanks in advance,

Logbook Shamed

EMAW

1. You can estimate, but be as close and accurate as you can get.
2. In a crew environment, or as an instructor, you should only be logging the takeoffs/landings you performed. Yes it's a good learning tool to watch someone else, but your logbook proves your proficiency, currency, etc.
3. Depends on how you are defining PIC. I logged PIC as an instructor because ultimately I was signing for the aircraft and had final say on the particulars of the flight. However, depending on how the App asks, I usually separate it out. I.e., if they ask for PIC and DUAL given separately. As far as now goes, if I'm not designated PIC on the paperwork or release, I log SIC even though I'm fully qualified on the aircraft as PIC.

Ultimately it's up to you to be accurate and forth-coming with your experience. If there is a definite discrepancy, they'll find it and you'll have to explain yourself. Good luck.

1moreshotatthis

Thanks for your advice.

So 10 percent of total time is a reasonable estimate for actual instrument time?

Thanks

mike sierra

Most people I know just do estimates and use 20-40%

1moreshotatthis

OK,

So 20 percent of total time is a reasonable amount of actual instrument time?

And it looks like I have to cross out a bunch of landings, guessing which one was mine. What a mess

Thanks for everyone's input

Twin Wasp

That's really only half of it. 61.51(g) says you can log instrument time "when the person operates the aircraft solely by reference to instruments under actual or simulated instrument flight conditions." So on top with more than 3 or 5 miles visibility isn't instrument flight conditions.

1moreshotatthis

Hey Twin,

Very good point. Another thing to consider. I appreciate all your replies.

ckelley

I am in a similar situation. I have a decade flying 121 jets, and need to estimate night and actual. Or does pilot credentials/ Airline apps. even have an entry for that?