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Old 02-23-2018, 10:11 AM   #31  
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Default 101 Reasons to Not Work For ACMIs (ABX, ATI,

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Wow, you better grab a whole box of tissues to dry them tears. And donít forget to call your Mom so she can make it all better for you.

Just as back in the ďold daysĒ people are leaving because the majors are hiring only back then people didnít feel the need to trash everything and everyone on the way out.

And as far as us old guys not being smart enough to handle the technology why donít you start by learning to fly so I can get back to my nap.


I have no issues with the captains that I fly with here, but come on man...youíve got to admit that this place is awful and everyone has the attitude of ďthis is how weíve always done itĒ regardless of how antiquated the practice may be. You senior guys ought to listen to us newer guys because we know how the rest of the industry works. I get paid better here than I did in the right seat at a regional and I fly a bigger airplane, but beyond that our work rules are so much worse than any regional pilot could dream of.

Then youíve got Soaper coming in and harassing crews demanding concessions on our already ****ty work rules until finally a couple 151ers stepped up and put him in his place last week. Good thing someone filed a harassment claim with HR and called the feds for taking away time from FAA required training!


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Old 02-23-2018, 02:12 PM   #32  
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I have no issues with the captains that I fly with here, but come on man...you’ve got to admit that this place is awful and everyone has the attitude of “this is how we’ve always done it” regardless of how antiquated the practice may be. You senior guys ought to listen to us newer guys because we know how the rest of the industry works. I get paid better here than I did in the right seat at a regional and I fly a bigger airplane, but beyond that our work rules are so much worse than any regional pilot could dream of.
I do find it funny when its 10am and I'm on hour 13 of some godawful SAS run and conversation in the cockpit is 'we have to protect our work rules'. Frankly, its more of a scheduling and money thing than a 'what does the work day look like' argument anyways, but it is still amusing. There is a lot of soft pay at ABX that comes from scheduling rules- I honestly wouldn't mind seeing things straightened out and streamlined (for both sides), but I don't really see that happening unless Z pulls a rabbit out of his hat.

There is absolutely a 'locked in our old ways' mindset on both sides of ABX. It is kind of an anomalous cornfield airline in the first place, they truly did things their own way and made it work as Airborne Express and now they are trying to shoehorn what they learned into other people's systems (DHL, Amazon... any other operator) and the result is awkward. That said, as far as I can tell they still move express freight more reliably than any other contract operator though it's not clear to me if their on-time margin over other operators is something anyone but ABX cares about.
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Old 02-23-2018, 02:43 PM   #33  
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Default Agreed

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Wow, you better grab a whole box of tissues to dry them tears. And donít forget to call your Mom so she can make it all better for you.

Just as back in the ďold daysĒ people are leaving because the majors are hiring only back then people didnít feel the need to trash everything and everyone on the way out.

And as far as us old guys not being smart enough to handle the technology why donít you start by learning to fly so I can get back to my nap.
A lot of free duel! And didn't anyone at the commuters learn to have the pointy end of the airplane facing the end of the runway when doing a xwind landing?
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Old 02-23-2018, 05:27 PM   #34  
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A lot of free duel!
Pistols at 50 paces at sunrise?
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Old 02-24-2018, 07:25 AM   #35  
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I have no issues with the captains that I fly with here, but come on man...you’ve got to admit that this place is awful and everyone has the attitude of “this is how we’ve always done it” regardless of how antiquated the practice may be. You senior guys ought to listen to us newer guys because we know how the rest of the industry works. I get paid better here than I did in the right seat at a regional and I fly a bigger airplane, but beyond that our work rules are so much worse than any regional pilot could dream of.

Then you’ve got Soaper coming in and harassing crews demanding concessions on our already ****ty work rules until finally a couple 151ers stepped up and put him in his place last week. Good thing someone filed a harassment claim with HR and called the feds for taking away time from FAA required training!


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Dang I didn’t know you guys are the Mesiah here to save us from our ignorant cornfield ways. We don’t know how the industry works? Well its obvious you had no idea what ACMI flying is all about, or did you just not do your research before coming here. All the whining about no food and warm water you’ll never become a freight dog just some little pampered poodle.
And then to say a couple 151rs put Soaper in his place by walking out on him instead of standing up and being the adult in the room and taking it to him. But no coming on here to air your grievances that takes a pair.
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Old 02-24-2018, 09:25 AM   #36  
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Pistols at 50 paces at sunrise?
Might be easier than riding thru some of those landings!
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Old 02-24-2018, 07:05 PM   #37  
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Dang I didnít know you guys are the Mesiah here to save us from our ignorant cornfield ways. We donít know how the industry works? Well its obvious you had no idea what ACMI flying is all about, or did you just not do your research before coming here. All the whining about no food and warm water youíll never become a freight dog just some little pampered poodle.
And then to say a couple 151rs put Soaper in his place by walking out on him instead of standing up and being the adult in the room and taking it to him. But no coming on here to air your grievances that takes a pair.


One of those 151ers argued with him for an hour (and yes, the other walked out at some point in there). Apparently it ended when he told Soaper that we will never take concessions, he doesnít intimidate us, and we do not want to talk to him in class ever again. Sounds like he held his ground pretty well.

I never said we were the messiah. I just said you would do well to value our opinions since we have all recently come from various parts of the industry. Many of the senior guys have endured this nonsense so long that it doesnít register how lousy our work rules are. I donít fault you for that. Iím just saying that we should have clear goals on what we want for our QOL if we ever get a contract to vote on.

Iím really not sure why youíre irritated with us in this thread. Most of the senior guys Iíve talked with about these things agree that this is a sketchy cornfield operation that is frankly kind of embarrassing, but for some reason youíre taking it personally that we are calling a spade a spade. Itís not personal at all...


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Old 02-24-2018, 09:58 PM   #38  
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One of those 151ers argued with him for an hour (and yes, the other walked out at some point in there). Apparently it ended when he told Soaper that we will never take concessions, he doesnít intimidate us, and we do not want to talk to him in class ever again. Sounds like he held his ground pretty well.

I never said we were the messiah. I just said you would do well to value our opinions since we have all recently come from various parts of the industry. Many of the senior guys have endured this nonsense so long that it doesnít register how lousy our work rules are. I donít fault you for that. Iím just saying that we should have clear goals on what we want for our QOL if we ever get a contract to vote on.

Iím really not sure why youíre irritated with us in this thread. Most of the senior guys Iíve talked with about these things agree that this is a sketchy cornfield operation that is frankly kind of embarrassing, but for some reason youíre taking it personally that we are calling a spade a spade. Itís not personal at all...


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People will value your opinion only as much as you value theirs.
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Old 02-25-2018, 12:39 AM   #39  
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Originally Posted by boiler View Post
I have no issues with the captains that I fly with here, but come on man...youíve got to admit that this place is awful and everyone has the attitude of ďthis is how weíve always done itĒ regardless of how antiquated the practice may be. You senior guys ought to listen to us newer guys because we know how the rest of the industry works. I get paid better here than I did in the right seat at a regional and I fly a bigger airplane, but beyond that our work rules are so much worse than any regional pilot could dream of.

Then youíve got Soaper coming in and harassing crews demanding concessions on our already ****ty work rules until finally a couple 151ers stepped up and put him in his place last week. Good thing someone filed a harassment claim with HR and called the feds for taking away time from FAA required training!


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Harassment claim? Can you elaborate?
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Old 02-25-2018, 03:28 AM   #40  
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Harassment claim? Can you elaborate?


He has been coming to recurrent training classes and interrupting them to tell us how terrible we are, how Amazon and DHL want nothing to do with us, how heís proud he ďstoleĒ the 737s from us when he was at Southern, tell us how illegal he thinks our strike was, berate us when we disagree with him, and demand concessions from us. Since this is is done during our required training which creates a huge distraction and lots of anger, someone went to HR to complain that this is harassment and creates a hostile work environment.


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