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Flight control check- ATI

Old 02-12-2018, 12:12 AM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by Ludicrous Speed View Post
If you knew anything about labor history, long and recent past, you would know that voting Republican is clearly worse for unions than voting Democrat. Are Dems hands clean? No. Nevertheless, being pro union and voting Republican is a contradiction.

Stop letting Fox, Breitbart and clickbait on Facebook spoon feed you your news and read a book or newspaper and formulate your own thoughts and opinions.
You definitely have a point about Democrats and their support for the unions.

BUT

I vote for the benefit of my family. Not unions.


Last few years all the Democrats care about is taking care of illegal aliens and the so called DREAMERS.

What about the dreams of my kids and grandkids? Guess they don't matter to Democrats or Deep State Repubs either. All the politicians in D.C. can go to hell.

By the way which so called news can you depend on nowadays? Not the Washington Post or NYT. They are the propaganda arm of the democrats just like ABC,CBS, NBC and CNN etc. etc.

Repubs have Fox and a few others; but Dims have most of the rest. Journalism has been dead for a long time. It is 99% propaganda now by both sides.
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:15 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Ludicrous Speed View Post
If you knew anything about labor history, long and recent past, you would know that voting Republican is clearly worse for unions than voting Democrat. Are Dems hands clean? No. Nevertheless, being pro union and voting Republican is a contradiction.

Stop letting Fox, Breitbart and clickbait on Facebook spoon feed you your news and read a book or newspaper and formulate your own thoughts and opinions.
God damn socialists everywhere
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:54 AM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by captjns View Post
Here you go folks. From Boeing’s FCOM. While this passage is from the B737 NG, I can confirm after reviewing the FCOMs of all Boeing’s Ive flown have the same language concerning the flight controls check.

Flight controls .................................................. ...........Check C

[Option - Flight Control Surface Position Indicator] Push the MFD SYS switch to display the flight control surface position indications on the lower display unit, if desired. Make slow and deliberate inputs, one direction at a time. Move the control wheel and the control column to full travel in both directions and verify: • freedom of movement • that the controls return to center

[Option - Flight Control Surface Position Indicator] • correct flight control movement if the flight control surface position indications are displayed on the lower display unit. Hold the nose wheel steering wheel during the rudder check to prevent nose wheel movement. Move the rudder pedals to full travel in both directions and verify: • freedom of movement • that the rudder pedals return to center

[Option - Flight Control Surface Position Indicator] • correct flight control movement if the flight control surface position indications are displayed on the lower display unit.
Read my post, I never said you shouldn’t do a control check.
Ask the person to move their seat back.
And I have never EVER needed full yoke back deflection to get out of a botched stall recovery in any airplane.
You’re trying to avoid a secondary stall remember?
A split S requires full elevator up and so does an intentional spin entry but I havent been lucky enough to have flown any jets where this was regularly done, have you?

When you go to standards and the union or whomever you need to build a better case is all I’m saying.
Hence my recommendation to make it a Medical issue which it legitimately is.
It’s not fat people shaming if you’re putting me at risk as you could keel over dead.
Then as you state your case mention that he’s so fat you gotta ask him to move his seat for a control check.
But that shouldn’t be the main argument.
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Old 02-12-2018, 04:35 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Ludicrous Speed View Post
“Your” profession? Yeah right. There maybe more that leans right than left in OUR profession and whatever, moderation on either side is fine. However, the reality is that your extremist right wing whacko lunatic fringe notions are an exception in OUR profession.....thankfully.
Ha, he said "our", you said "your".

Which one of you is being more inclusive?
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Old 02-12-2018, 07:14 AM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by TiredSoul View Post
And I have never EVER needed full yoke back deflection to get out of a botched stall recovery in any airplane.
Your experience isn't in question, nor is it germane. The flight controls must be able to be moved in all axes to the limit in all phases of flight. This isn't a big ask. I agree, btw, that calling some particular guy out outside of proper channels is lame, but setting the way in which the question was brought up aside, it's a legitimate concern, and should be treated as such. What do you propose as a limit? Are you an engineer?

To my mind a fat person preventing the movement of the yoke or pedals is no different from any other physical barrier to the manipulation of the controls. I expect and require to have full control of the machine, per the AFM. Again, not a big ask.
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Old 02-12-2018, 07:59 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by TiredSoul View Post
Read my post, I never said you shouldn’t do a control check.
Ask the person to move their seat back.
And I have never EVER needed full yoke back deflection to get out of a botched stall recovery in any airplane.
You’re trying to avoid a secondary stall remember?
A split S requires full elevator up and so does an intentional spin entry but I havent been lucky enough to have flown any jets where this was regularly done, have you?
It's got nothing to do with "regularly done". Ever had a full nose down runaway trim?
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Old 02-12-2018, 11:51 AM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by niteflyr View Post
It's got nothing to do with "regularly done". Ever had a full nose down runaway trim?
Ok I’ll bite, checklist maybe? Memory items? Circuit breaker? Override switch? Does the checklist say you need full back movement of the yoke? What if Your stick buddy is 5’2 and 100lbs and they can’t bench press a wet paper bag or open a bag of pretzels without tearing a muscle?

You’ll be more likely to ever have to use full aileron ( wake upset) then full elevator. The Scarebus doesn’t even allow you to do that in flight under Normal Law.
Again, the ground flightcontrol check per FOM, FCOM, Flight Manual or any other manufacturer publication is to check the correct unimpeded operation of the flight controls including cables and pulleys, hydraulic operating system or fly by wire systems.
For a myriad of reasons:
The screwdriver left behind by MX, incorrectly rigged controls after repairs/heavy MX, controls locks installed, slush/ice, hydraulic component failure, Flight Control Computer issues yadayadayada.
Maybe your fat buddy needs to go fly Airbus.

Found an interesting little read from our Aussie friends:
https://www.casa.gov.au/licences-and-certification/aviation-medicine/obesity

Some other light reading:
https://flightphysical.com/sleep-apnea-screening-deferred https://www.faa.gov/data_research/research/med_humanfacs/oamtechreports/2010s/media/201010.pdf

Last edited by TiredSoul; 02-12-2018 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:35 PM
  #58  
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I can't believe we've been debating this for 6+ pages but still haven't seen highlights from the TA.
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Old 02-12-2018, 12:43 PM
  #59  
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I’m still digging into this.
So far I haven’t found anything relevant in FSIMS
http://fsims.faa.gov/PICDetail.aspx?docId=8900.1,Vol.6,Ch2,Sec9_SAS
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Old 02-13-2018, 12:50 AM
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Originally Posted by CallmeJB View Post
I can't believe we've been debating this for 6+ pages but still haven't seen highlights from the TA.
It’s easier to attack fat people than talk about anything with substance
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