CRJammin

Just curious........ the few UPS types I've asked didn't know.

N570UP

Something to do with them buying their certificate from IPX?? (Int'l Package Xpress??)...can't remember if that's the correct name of that company..but 5X was those guy's ICAO code back then.

anybody else has anything different?

Need4Speed

That's correct - UPS was one of the two parent companies of International Parcel Express (IPX). Essentially, this small airline (2 DC-8's) was formed for the purpose of obtaining certain Asian route authority, then flying these routes. When the bid to obtain these rights failed, it was thought that UPS would shut the airline down. Instead, UPS used this airline certificate (along with the 5X code) to form their airline.

brownie

That stands for ups makes 5 times more money that other airlines and treat thier labor 5 times as bad as others and we have 5 times more managers to run this airline and they are 5 times less qualified .

Soyathink

The other parent company was DHL. UPS got the code. UPS leased 2 8's to IPX to get rights into Narita. Fed Ex *****ed to the government since IPX was half owned by DHL. UPS bought out DHL but it was too late and didn't get the rights. UPS used the code and cert and formed the airline. I wonder where UPS Airlines would be if Fed Ex didn't complain about it or the rights were awarded to IPX? Would there still be the contract pilots from Orion Evergreen, and Ryan flying browntails?

CRJammin

ah, makes sense now. Thanks everyone for answering.-

Freightpuppy

SWEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

767pilot

4X was taken

vroll1800

With the recent Amazon Prime Air developments, and the speculation (spoken and unspoken) swirling around, I think it might be interesting to revisit the formative history of UPS Airlines.

As seen by above post, UPS started its own airline this way. It is my understanding that the IPX crews went along with the aircraft and thus the top of the seniority list, at least in their seat position, if not absolute number. Also not mentioned was that IPX was unionized, with a IBT contract that was essentially a carbon copy of Airborne Express (ABX) 1987 CBA.

Since UPS was starting a significant size airline from the get go, Captains were hired off the street. (This was ~ 1987, mainly 1988 timeframe). Backing up a bit, there were other contractors flying UPS freight out KSDF hub since the early 1980's (most notably Orion Air). Even though pilots for those contractors may have been flying SDF hub turns for several years (and rated on the type of aircraft UPS would operate), they still had to go through the interview process along with many other "off the street" candidates.

Pilots (some if not most) who are flying for Amazon contractors may be thinking (hoping? wishing?) that Amazon buys their airline, pilots are Amazon employees, and they get to experience a "turn an urchin into a prince" event that the IPX pilots experienced in the 80's, NOT.

By all indications, Amazon embraces the DHL model of spreading the flying around several contractors, playing the whipsaw game. Recall that UPS utilized a multiple contractor model throughout much of the 80's. UPS may very well come to the conclusion via enlightened thinking that they'd be better off operating their own airline. My recollection of that era seems to indicate that some FAA impetus may have provided at least a smidgen of motivation to "go in house".

Amazon doesn't have DHL's excuse of being a foreign entity. Then again, Amazon is just doing what the legacy airlines have done for many years with the regional airline contractor business model. With the current administration being relatively "hands off" on regulation, I don't see DOT/FAA leaning on Amazon to go the in house airline route any time soon. Where Amazon goes with their Prime Air thing is open to speculation. I'll close by saying that I hope all ACMI pilots flying for Amazon take the formation of UPS Airlines to heart, sticking together with a unified front, and negotiate a strong scope/successor clause.

WhenPigsFLy

I think the whipsaw comment is going to be the future for Amazon carriers. They need to keep the costs low for free or almost free shipping. $99 unlimited shipping is the ULCC of shipping.