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Kalitta Air (K4) Information

Old 03-26-2019, 07:51 AM
  #1331  
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Originally Posted by goinaround View Post
I dunno....we can only just barely see the tail lights of major pay. Despite what the old school K4 guys have grown accustomed to ......if our pay fails to keep up with inflation/competition....this place will empty out of those hired within the past few years. Even jumping from the left seat to the bottom of FedEx's list pays back pretty quick. Different times, different pilots, different expectations I guess. You speak of the "reality" for the company....I counter you with reality for the pilots.
Well said,

Max jet there are a lot of us waiting to see how these negotiations go. I would love to call K4 home they have been an awesome company so far. But with 30 years left money speaks very loud. If the negotiations come up short the resume gets polished up. Onward and upward.
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Old 03-26-2019, 08:34 AM
  #1332  
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Originally Posted by jet pipe ovht View Post
Well said,

Max jet there are a lot of us waiting to see how these negotiations go. I would love to call K4 home they have been an awesome company so far. But with 30 years left money speaks very loud. If the negotiations come up short the resume gets polished up. Onward and upward.
32 years left here so I'm in the same boat. I would consider staying if upgrade happened relatively quickly (3-4 years) and pay was close(er?) to mainline. Everyone has different situations, but being that I can still non-rev on one of the big 3 and have no kids, Kalitta is very appealing to me. If some improvements to retirement and some QOL work rules are on the table at least in the next contract they might keep me. Ask me again in 24 months!
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Old 03-26-2019, 10:10 AM
  #1333  
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Originally Posted by jet pipe ovht View Post
Well said,

Max jet there are a lot of us waiting to see how these negotiations go. I would love to call K4 home they have been an awesome company so far. But with 30 years left money speaks very loud. If the negotiations come up short the resume gets polished up. Onward and upward.
And I'm optimistic. The Kalitta Air that we know today was re-acquired by Connie on the cusp of a massive depression in the industry which made it possible/easy to employ pilots who were in need of "any port in a storm". There was no reason to pay a competitive wage....or treat pilots well. The landscape today....and into the future (save for a catastrophe) is the exact opposite. I don't expect ...or need to be the highest compensated pilot on the block. I very much enjoy working for K4....and that means a lot to me. I enjoy working here because I'm well taken care of, work with great people, am paid fairly, and I feel valued. I'd like to think that this company has seen positive changes all the way across the board as a result of the 2016 TA. I agree with Maxjet....of course we are not going to double our salaries again with the next contract. BUT....I believe that I'm in line with 99% of the pilot group when I expect to see cost of living increases commensurate with our current contract and a retirement plan that at the very least matches those of even the scummiest LCC carriers today. I have too much at stake to put up with any less. And I'd sure like to stay here....but I don't have to.
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Old 03-26-2019, 10:22 AM
  #1334  
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Originally Posted by goinaround View Post
And I'm optimistic. The Kalitta Air that we know today was re-acquired by Connie on the cusp of a massive depression in the industry which made it possible/easy to employ pilots who were in need of "any port in a storm". There was no reason to pay a competitive wage....or treat pilots well. The landscape today....and into the future (save for a catastrophe) is the exact opposite. I don't expect ...or need to be the highest compensated pilot on the block. I very much enjoy working for K4....and that means a lot to me. I enjoy working here because I'm well taken care of, work with great people, am paid fairly, and I feel valued. I'd like to think that this company has seen positive changes all the way across the board as a result of the 2016 TA. I agree with Maxjet....of course we are not going to double our salaries again with the next contract. BUT....I believe that I'm in line with 99% of the pilot group when I expect to see cost of living increases commensurate with our current contract and a retirement plan that at the very least matches those of even the scummiest LCC carriers today. I have too much at stake to put up with any less. And I'd sure like to stay here....but I don't have to.
These thoughts mirror my own. I would see a contract with those items as a major victory by the negotiating committee. Pilots may think that the industry will raise all ships in the harbor. It will not. 2 things prevent this. One, K4 is private, you will never see the books. Two, there will be an industry downturn in the future. Why do you think the company hired 150 ASA pilots? They have proven their loyalty to their last company and they don’t fit the demographic that the majors look for.

They know some will leave. It is way more economical to train replacements in-house than it is to give out pay raises. My point? Ask the Union for all of your wishes but accept what your Union tells you is realistic. If you cannot accept that leave. I don’t mean that in a don’t let the door.... It means, if you are unhappy for any reason and it makes financial and emotional sense to leave there will probably never be a better time in your career to do so. Good luck, I am out in 11 months.
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Old 03-26-2019, 10:22 AM
  #1335  
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Guys, please let the negotiating committee do their jobs. If you post on an open forum what you’re willing to accept it ties their hands.

If you want something, or are willing to settle for something, tell them
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Old 03-26-2019, 01:10 PM
  #1336  
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Originally Posted by goinaround View Post
And I'd sure like to stay here....but I don't have to.
This... I think it perfectly encapsulates what most young guys here think (at least within the FO mafia). The problem with analogies to past ‘downturns’ is that the base assumptions are different. The means of production cannot and have not produced ATP pilots at the same rate as they did a decade ago. From what I’ve heard from acquaintances ‘in the know,’ the shortage hasn’t even begun (swing by any Big 5 page and look at mandatory retirements to check my math).

I think ASA is kind of an anomaly and isn’t a long term patch. For instance, I flew with a couple of 60+ guys on IOE. Fantastic dudes, great experience, but not the demographic you can use to build future plans.

Now K4 is an awesome place to work, great people, great jets, and the home basing is a serious tangible benefit (won’t say how much it’s worth, I’ll leave that to the negotiating committee, sorry Connie ). Most guys love to work here but do want to be paid enough to convince CINCHOUSE (wife/husband/non-binary life partner) that K4 is the kind of place you can plant roots.

It’s actually an awesome place for both parties to start negotiations. We ain’t a bottom feeder where they have to start with a group that is fed up and wants to go as a default (75-80% attrition at ATSG? Good Lord, less people were trying to get off the Titanic).

So if Connie comes to the table with: ‘We want you to stay...but.’ And we come to the table with: ‘We want to stay...but.’ I’ll bet we can come to a middle ground where everyone can claim a win and no one loses their ‘buts.’
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Old 03-26-2019, 01:29 PM
  #1337  
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I too have a good 25 years left if my medical lasts that long. My worst nightmare is being in my 50's and out of a job. This entire industry is a gamble, roll the dice.
With that said, no other flying job even remotely appeals to me, I love it here.
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Old 03-26-2019, 02:26 PM
  #1338  
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As a new hire FO with 10 years left I have to put serious consideration into the funding of my 401k for the remainder of my flying career. Having said that, I enjoy K4 and would need to see a good enough difference at another carrier to make up for QOL. For example, going brown I’d probably wind up at ANC as a new hire... with the respective commute. Barf.
Yet I have also have seen in the past how recessions hit cargo carriers. I don’t relish the idea of being furloughed at 58-60.
Publically I will play it close as to what will keep me. But yeah, I will discuss it with ALPA reps.
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Old 03-26-2019, 07:06 PM
  #1339  
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Originally Posted by Blackhawk View Post
As a new hire FO with 10 years left I have to put serious consideration into the funding of my 401k for the remainder of my flying career. Having said that, I enjoy K4 and would need to see a good enough difference at another carrier to make up for QOL. For example, going brown I’d probably wind up at ANC as a new hire... with the respective commute. Barf.
There are NO CERTAINTIES when it comes to Brown, very picky and hard to figure out. Just because you are typed and current in the 74 doesn’t mean you will get 74 ANC. People always say “I don’t want to go to X because I may be based in X or be placed in X equipment”. Knocking on the door doesn’t mean you will be let in. I have a friend trying to get in at Brown who is typed and current in the 74, wants to live in ANC, excellent experience, college degree and not a peep.

But one thing IS for certain, if you don’t knock, you never know if you will be let in, assuming you want to be let into the house, some may simply not be interested, which is completely understandable. Not every job is for everyone as not every job is desired by everyone.
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Old 03-26-2019, 08:13 PM
  #1340  
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Originally Posted by howardhughes8 View Post
There are NO CERTAINTIES when it comes to Brown, very picky and hard to figure out. Just because you are typed and current in the 74 doesn’t mean you will get 74 ANC. People always say “I don’t want to go to X because I may be based in X or be placed in X equipment”. Knocking on the door doesn’t mean you will be let in. I have a friend trying to get in at Brown who is typed and current in the 74, wants to live in ANC, excellent experience, college degree and not a peep.

But one thing IS for certain, if you don’t knock, you never know if you will be let in, assuming you want to be let into the house, some may simply not be interested, which is completely understandable. Not every job is for everyone as not every job is desired by everyone.
Trust me. I know that. I was just using that as an example. Nothing I wrote suggested that I was a shoe in for Brown so I’m not sure where you got that. Being part of the “lost generation” I am quite familiar with the hiring game.
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