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Old 12-28-2018, 12:04 PM   #31  
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Just occurred to me that it was probably ATIís current VP of ops that was selling that quick upgrade nonsense 20 years ago in interviews. Thatís right about the time he moved from super junior FO to management at ABX.
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Old 12-28-2018, 03:06 PM   #32  
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Originally Posted by midnightshuttle View Post
During Recent line check the CA claimed were hiring 1-2 classes a month through 2019.

Just FYI to newbs looking to bypass the regionals and fly 767ís
Hiring flight instructors into 767 right seat?
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Old 12-28-2018, 07:36 PM   #33  
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Hiring flight instructors into 767 right seat?
It's been done before. It will be done again.
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Old 12-29-2018, 03:29 AM   #34  
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Originally Posted by Cujo665 View Post
This really is changing....
Not really...
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Old 12-29-2018, 05:47 AM   #35  
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Look at all these managers or management suck ups advertising the lowest paying jobs in the industry. They should be saying hey don't make it easy on the company until brought up to the rest of the industry.

10% behind in pay from omni and k4
10% behind in DC retirement from the industry

Yet blow hards saying come here work for 20% less than everyone else in the industry. Do you realize how much of your career will be wasted when you add up losing 20% of over 100k + for 4-5 years? Not to mention seniority at a real airline?

Ati, abx, omni, atlas are not going to be the next UPS. They have already shown it's going to take almost a decade to develop any kind of farmed out flying.

Do yourself and fellow pilots a favor and go somewhere with pay rates, retirement and rules in place, Spirit, Jet blue, and even Frontier all will upgrade you in the same time frame and you can have some dignity know your carrier is competitive with pilot pay.

Or you can continue selling your sole to try and get airplanes at ATI.

Here comes the tribe to say how wrong I am and telling me to leave instead of taking a stand and fighting for what others already have for doing the same work!
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Old 12-29-2018, 10:10 AM   #36  
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Originally Posted by EndOfTimes View Post
Assuming you will be in the left seat in 3 years time at any ACMI carrier is an enormous assumption. There are 20+ year FOs at ABX that were given that same BS, although ABX was not an ACMI carrier at that time. They were an integrated carrier soon to be dropped into the ACMI toilet by the DHL debacle. If Amazon puts a disproportionate share of their eggs in that ATI basket it would it would be a 180 degree turn from their contractor business model. If you choose to go to ATI you might want to have a viable exit strategy.
Amazon doesnít contract directly with any of the carriers inside the ATSG Holding company. The contract is between Amazon and ATSG. Then the decision to assign airplanes is done internally within ATSG. No pilot group works directly for Amazon.
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Old 12-29-2018, 11:13 AM   #37  
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Originally Posted by ACMItrash View Post
Look at all these managers or management suck ups advertising the lowest paying jobs in the industry. They should be saying hey don't make it easy on the company until brought up to the rest of the industry.

10% behind in pay from omni and k4
10% behind in DC retirement from the industry

Yet blow hards saying come here work for 20% less than everyone else in the industry. Do you realize how much of your career will be wasted when you add up losing 20% of over 100k + for 4-5 years? Not to mention seniority at a real airline?

Ati, abx, omni, atlas are not going to be the next UPS. They have already shown it's going to take almost a decade to develop any kind of farmed out flying.

Do yourself and fellow pilots a favor and go somewhere with pay rates, retirement and rules in place, Spirit, Jet blue, and even Frontier all will upgrade you in the same time frame and you can have some dignity know your carrier is competitive with pilot pay.

Or you can continue selling your sole to try and get airplanes at ATI.

Here comes the tribe to say how wrong I am and telling me to leave instead of taking a stand and fighting for what others already have for doing the same work!
Who said go to ABX...it is a dumpster fire run by incompetent management. I think we all agree on that without making up bu!!$hit.
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Old 12-29-2018, 12:54 PM   #38  
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Originally Posted by ACMItrash View Post
Look at all these managers or management suck ups advertising the lowest paying jobs in the industry. They should be saying hey don't make it easy on the company until brought up to the rest of the industry.

10% behind in pay from omni and k4
10% behind in DC retirement from the industry

Yet blow hards saying come here work for 20% less than everyone else in the industry. Do you realize how much of your career will be wasted when you add up losing 20% of over 100k + for 4-5 years? Not to mention seniority at a real airline?

Ati, abx, omni, atlas are not going to be the next UPS. They have already shown it's going to take almost a decade to develop any kind of farmed out flying.

Do yourself and fellow pilots a favor and go somewhere with pay rates, retirement and rules in place, Spirit, Jet blue, and even Frontier all will upgrade you in the same time frame and you can have some dignity know your carrier is competitive with pilot pay.

Or you can continue selling your sole to try and get airplanes at ATI.

Here comes the tribe to say how wrong I am and telling me to leave instead of taking a stand and fighting for what others already have for doing the same work!
Kalitta, Omni and a few others have certainly become viable careers in their own right.

It’s interesting that you complain about lagging 10%-20% behind the industry while listing Frontier as competitive pilot pay. Go on their threads, they’re complaining about the last TA being, yep you guesssed it 10%-20% less than Spirit and much less than Jetblue.

Look, there are lots of folks who don’t think a schedule of 4 on 3 off, fighting for a jumpseat to and from a crashpad is an improvement from positive space and guaranteed hotels. You have Kalitta senior CA’s making over $300k and several over $500k. Senior Omni CA’s are doing over $300k as well.

There are advantages and disadvantages to both career paths. If you don’t like where you’re at, leave. I’ll add one thing... ask some of your coworkers who came from regionals where they truly got crap pay and were abused daily how they like working at your company.... see, it’s all relative, and the grass is always greener. For me, I made more as a first year FO at Omni than I ever made as a regional CA. No crashpads, no commuting headaches, lots of time off in big enough chunks to actually take the family on vacations several times a year. Best kept secret in aviation in my opinion.

The other carriers will catch up in CBA aspects as the pilot shortage worsens and they can’t staff. They’ll either pay appropriately or close from all the cancelled flights.

Last edited by Cujo665; 12-29-2018 at 01:13 PM.
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Old 12-29-2018, 04:24 PM   #39  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACMItrash View Post
Look at all these managers or management suck ups...

...blow hards saying come here....
As a new member of APC, you may be unaware that while you are free to criticize wages, working conditions, QOL, etc, you may not call other people names just because they disagree with you. Thanks.
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Old 12-29-2018, 06:29 PM   #40  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACMItrash View Post
Look at all these managers or management suck ups advertising the lowest paying jobs in the industry.

...

Ati, abx, omni, atlas are not going to be the next UPS.

...

Or you can continue selling your sole to try and get airplanes at ATI.
No one is saying ABX is the next UPS. Get a grip.

You do a good job illustrating what the trash talkers sound like on this board.

Insults (usually obviously bogus).
Spelling errors (soul not sole).
Idiocy (usually).

For folks looking to get to UPS / Fedex etc, a place like ATI or Omni or K4 is not a terrible step, especially if they are lucky and get an upgrade in a timely way. They get paid CA rates, build CA time, get type etc. Not everyone can go straight to UPS.

Pilots have different opinions, that doesn't make them management. ABX guys absolutely ripped the ATI guys for valuing home basing during last contract negotiations, but the ATI guys like home basing so kept it in. Or compare the number of legs and short turns a southwest pilot sometimes flies on the west coast - southwest has 9,000 pilots but might not be for everyone.

If you want to go to a plank union airline - check out ABX - they will and do throw crap / **** in their beds / **** on the customer / file harassment complaints / talk like management is the second coming of hitler.
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