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Old 06-19-2019, 03:12 PM   #1  
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Default Atlas/Southern JCBA

In reading the court document ruling in favor of the management, I got a general sense that after 45 days allowing the union to respond, a 9-month (not to exceed) TA negotiation period begins/ends. In other words a new TA will be presented early 2020. I’m not a legal scholar, did anyone else walk away with this as what one can expect? Thanks.
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Old 06-19-2019, 03:37 PM   #2  
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In reading the court document ruling in favor of the management, I got a general sense that after 45 days allowing the union to respond, a 9-month (not to exceed) TA negotiation period begins/ends. In other words a new TA will be presented early 2020. I’m not a legal scholar, did anyone else walk away with this as what one can expect? Thanks.
You have a few bits of information wrong. One its wasn't a court ruling. The court ruling was that they had no jurisdiction on the law suit Atlas Air filed against the union and sent the decision to arbitration. That arbitrator is the one that came to the decision you are referencing. He however added language to the CBA that was not present and the union attorneys are saying he exceeded his jurisdiction. So a law suit in undoubtedly on the way. This would most likely put a stop to this imaginary 45 day clock. That being said, that 45 day clock means absolutely zero. This arbitrator has nothing to do with the Atlas union. He can only tell the Southern Union what to do. Southern can not dictate to the Atlas Union what the combined Seniority list is going to look like. So you'll still have to wait until the Atlas arbitrator rules. That will be later this summer or in the fall. Then the unions will have to get together come up with a seniority list then submit it, then the 9 month clock will start. At that point the unresolved articled go to an Arbitrator. That doesn't mean they will be resolved at that time, it only means those articles go to him/her. They could take 6 months, could take a year, who knows. At that point you'll probably get the JCBA. So earliest next summer, most likely end of next year. Unless AAWW management decides to get with the times and actually just forget that whole mess and actually negotiate a contract, nothing is close. There are tons of posts on this very specific matter already, idk why you started a new thread.
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Old 06-19-2019, 04:37 PM   #3  
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Ultimately both management and the union have enough legal tools to keep negotiations stymied indefinitely. The goal is to use those tools to force the other side to settle. Often its the management using the purposefully glacial speed of the National Mediation Board to make unions settle versus wait years for a raise. However in this case the union can equally drag things out for years in litigation in the hopes that long before all of the legal tools are exhausted the company will be forced to settle.

After all, business plans must move forward. Those Amazon 737s will be here long before the amalgamation process outlined in the ruling last week would be played out. Not to mention DHL wants 777s and who knows what other customers are out there begging Atlas to take their money.

For an example consider Southwest's latest contract. The union knew they wanted Max jets and without new contract language they simply weren't coming. All the union had to do was wait it out and lo and behold right before the first Max showed up the company settled. Without that leverage the union would of had to settle for far less (granted they were already sitting pretty) or risk having to wait an eternity for another opportunity for leverage.
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Old 06-20-2019, 04:22 AM   #4  
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You have a few bits of information wrong. One its wasn't a court ruling. The court ruling was that they had no jurisdiction on the law suit Atlas Air filed against the union and sent the decision to arbitration. That arbitrator is the one that came to the decision you are referencing. He however added language to the CBA that was not present and the union attorneys are saying he exceeded his jurisdiction. So a law suit in undoubtedly on the way. This would most likely put a stop to this imaginary 45 day clock. That being said, that 45 day clock means absolutely zero. This arbitrator has nothing to do with the Atlas union. He can only tell the Southern Union what to do. Southern can not dictate to the Atlas Union what the combined Seniority list is going to look like. So you'll still have to wait until the Atlas arbitrator rules. That will be later this summer or in the fall. Then the unions will have to get together come up with a seniority list then submit it, then the 9 month clock will start. At that point the unresolved articled go to an Arbitrator. That doesn't mean they will be resolved at that time, it only means those articles go to him/her. They could take 6 months, could take a year, who knows. At that point you'll probably get the JCBA. So earliest next summer, most likely end of next year. Unless AAWW management decides to get with the times and actually just forget that whole mess and actually negotiate a contract, nothing is close. There are tons of posts on this very specific matter already, idk why you started a new thread.
Thank you for this very concise explanation.
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Old 06-20-2019, 05:23 AM   #5  
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Thank you for this very concise explanation.
I actually don't know if that's sarcasm or not 😅. It's pretty scatter shot and I hope someone was able to understand all of it. It's entirely to complex a subject to put into one post anymore. Maybe an entire article on the matter to truly just summarize it. But I thought/think this is just a troll thread. The guy had two posts. So my intention was just a small post then I started rattling on. Looking back probably incoherently.
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Old 06-20-2019, 05:45 AM   #6  
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No seriously, it explained it to me.
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Old 06-20-2019, 07:13 AM   #7  
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No seriously, it explained it to me.
Agreed....
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Old 06-20-2019, 08:15 AM   #8  
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Originally Posted by akfrtdwg 57 View Post
I actually don't know if that's sarcasm or not 😅. It's pretty scatter shot and I hope someone was able to understand all of it. It's entirely to complex a subject to put into one post anymore. Maybe an entire article on the matter to truly just summarize it. But I thought/think this is just a troll thread. The guy had two posts. So my intention was just a small post then I started rattling on. Looking back probably incoherently.
No, I was serious, thanks
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Old 06-20-2019, 08:51 AM   #9  
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I actually don't know if that's sarcasm or not 😅. It's pretty scatter shot and I hope someone was able to understand all of it. It's entirely to complex a subject to put into one post anymore. Maybe an entire article on the matter to truly just summarize it. But I thought/think this is just a troll thread. The guy had two posts. So my intention was just a small post then I started rattling on. Looking back probably incoherently.
Looked like it was pecked out on a phone (with errors) but otherwise simple enough to follow, imho.
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Old 06-20-2019, 08:59 AM   #10  
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Looked like it was pecked out on a phone (with errors) but otherwise simple enough to follow, imho.
It was on the phone, limited screen. Was riding back to town from the Russian. Fish are in btw to anybody interested!
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