Jetjok

As usual, you're wrong again. Actually I just got back from playing racquetball a little while ago. It was the second time today, which is usual for me. After rb, a group of us went to the 99, a local bar/grill, for dinner and a few beers, or in my case, diet cokes. As for pouring coffee "all night", well, anyone who knows me, knows that I didn't do that as a new hire, and have maintained that service since. I'm happy to do my job though, and if someone would like coffee, I'm more than happy to pass the jug. I'm quite sure that you can sleep soundly, because I can't imagine anyone "needing you", except maybe your parole officer. Just kidding!

Jetjok

Anyone who wants to work a little longer than you do. As well, anyone who wants their last 5 years to be their "high 5", unlike some of us who never had that luxury. Why do you feel that you have the right to pass judgment on others motives or situations?

Busboy

You're kidding right? Tell me you're not saying that it is beneath you to pour a friggin' cup of coffee? I personally only asked the S/O, so I wouldn't have to fumble around with the jug between my legs or over pour it over the console.

I'm not sure which complex you would be suffering from...But, its definitely a symptom.

TonyC

I was thinkin' the same thing, Busboy.

Before I was hired, a buddy of mine explained how he had to wrap the water bottles in paper napkins before he placed those and the Sanicoms up front before the Captain and First Officer arrived at the airplane. I laughed and swore I'd never stoop to such silliness.

A few months later, I was not only wrapping the water bottles, I was folding little pockets with napkins which I then clipped to the yokes and filled with Sanicoms and peppermint candy.

It turns out, it wasn't beneath me after all. It was a service I provided with pride, because it just made things go better when we were all getting along. I didn't drink coffee then (it interfered with my naps between the 1,000' and 500' calls ), but it never bothered me to pour for anyone else, or even to mix in the requested quantities of sweetener and creamer.


Interesting attitude . . . and I was beginning to like Jetjok.




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MD11Fr8Dog

I always offered nmb's some of my special Irish creamer!

TonyC

Ba-dum-bum -- CHING

Thank you, ladies and gentlemen, he'll be here all week. Try the veal, and don't forget to tip your waitress.






OK, seriously . . . the question I asked in Post #727 wasn't intended to be rhetorical. I want some real feedback.

What if all the Over-60 guys were junior? Would that make a difference in how you feel about letting them bid the right seat (or left seat)? What if we let them go back to the end of the seniority list when they turn 60, and then bid what they can hold? The only people that would be affected are the ones that haven't been hired yet. That way it wouldn't slow you down, right? Would that make it easier to swallow?





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Tuck

TonyC - yes absolutely it would make it easier to swallow. Especially for those that say they "just love to fly". If that's all they're worried about then the back of the seniority list, or the idea of right seat only would be great for all sides.

Huck

How about this: you can fly past 60 if there's less than a million in your B fund....

Jetjok

Actually, I wasn't kidding at all, at least about serving coffee as a new hire. Thankfully there wasn't all that much of the stuff drunk in the New York domicile, as most of the trips were very short, with 3 or 4 ups and downs a night. I'm sure it was an attitude that I had back then. Not a very defense-able position I know, but it's sort of like my dick size, small, but it's mine. Things are quite different now, however, as I'm happy to accommodate (serve) the front-enders. What would be nice is if once in a while, when one of them comes into the cockpit for the first time, they ask "can I get you anything?" That never seems to happen though and I attribute it to the fact that they were probably beaten as a child. The Boeing, at FedEx, is a learning environment, and as such, I guess that guys coming onto this jet are still learning what it takes to be a well rounded crewmember. Each and every time I leave the cockpit, just as I did when flying as captain on the MD-11 and as first officer on the Airbus, I ask if anyone wants anything from the "back." It's a good thing to do, if for no other reason than to show everyone else that you're thinking of them.

Jetjok

Tony, Tuck, and Huck (sounds like a law firm, similar to Dewey, Cheatem, and Howe),

The problems I see with this idea are many. First off, seniority is seniority, pure and simple. If the rule changes, than guys deserve to operate the seat that they are senior enough to hold. One of the reasons that guys go to the back seat, once they turn 60, is that they retain their seniority number and bid flying, vacation, training, etc, in that seniority order. To force them to the bottom of the list is ludicrous, as there is no provision, nor has there ever been one for this type of action. Personally, I'm sure that there are a number of guys in their 50's and 60's who couldn't keep up the pace of a new hire guy, what with crazy reserve hours, flying the trips that everyone else turns down, either by not bidding them or by having an eye problem (I can't see flying THAT trip, so I guess I'll be sick.), etc. For that matter, I'm sure we have a number of guys in their 40's who couldn't keep up.

However, the thing that bothers me the most about this type of thinking is that it just goes to show that what you guys are really saying is that it's ok for over 60 guys to fly, just as long as they're junior to you. A very parochial attitude. Understandable, but parochial none the less.

For guys wanting to fight this change, I say, go for it. Fight as hard as you can, but please don't use: loss of our A or B fund; a change in the mandatory retirement age, thusly forcing guys to work till 65; or any other negotiated benefit or work rule we now operate under, because these things are negotiated, tit for tat. As well, please don't threaten us with changing retirement benefits for those already off the property, as guess what, one day that will be you too. Talk about shortsightedness.

As well, after the fight is fought, if you lose, than accept the situation and let it go. If the rule doesn't pass, that's what I plan to do. This is a very emotional issue, for both sides. Junior guys see their quality of life and livelihood being put in jeopardy, while older guys see the ability to work a few years longer (for whatever reason) suddenly become a reality. The one thing none of us can afford to jeopardize is our cohesiveness with regards to management. Because if we do, this Age 65 thing will be small potatoes.