747/777 minimum safe speed at MTOW below ten.
05-10-2020, 09:51 PM
#1
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747/777 minimum safe speed at MTOW below ten.
Good evening guys and gals.
First I don’t fly either airplane, I’m a bus guy and I was having a friendly discussion on a FB group about the max speed allowed below ten, now someone brought up the scenario were a 747 and 777 at MTOW has to fly faster than 250kts after clean up below ten. I have never heard ATC approve a clearance like that before and I know that FAR 91.117 states no aircraft will fly faster than 250 below ten “unless authorized by the administrator” so my question is, are some US cargo company authorized by the administrator for this? Or is there another FAR that allow you guys to fly faster below ten when heavy? Or do you guys never takeoff at MTOW?
Again, I am clueless about both aircrafts and their operations and I appreciate the clarification.
Hope everyone is well
First I don’t fly either airplane, I’m a bus guy and I was having a friendly discussion on a FB group about the max speed allowed below ten, now someone brought up the scenario were a 747 and 777 at MTOW has to fly faster than 250kts after clean up below ten. I have never heard ATC approve a clearance like that before and I know that FAR 91.117 states no aircraft will fly faster than 250 below ten “unless authorized by the administrator” so my question is, are some US cargo company authorized by the administrator for this? Or is there another FAR that allow you guys to fly faster below ten when heavy? Or do you guys never takeoff at MTOW?
Again, I am clueless about both aircrafts and their operations and I appreciate the clarification.
Hope everyone is well
05-10-2020, 09:56 PM
#2
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Posts: 240
Originally Posted by jgdeleon09
Good evening guys and gals.
First I don’t fly either airplane, I’m a bus guy and I was having a friendly discussion on a FB group about the max speed allowed below ten, now someone brought up the scenario were a 747 and 777 at MTOW has to fly faster than 250kts after clean up below ten. I have never heard ATC approve a clearance like that before and I know that FAR 91.117 states no aircraft will fly faster than 250 below ten “unless authorized by the administrator” so my question is, are some US cargo company authorized by the administrator for this? Or is there another FAR that allow you guys to fly faster below ten when heavy? Or do you guys never takeoff at MTOW?
Again, I am clueless about both aircrafts and their operations and I appreciate the clarification.
Hope everyone is well
First I don’t fly either airplane, I’m a bus guy and I was having a friendly discussion on a FB group about the max speed allowed below ten, now someone brought up the scenario were a 747 and 777 at MTOW has to fly faster than 250kts after clean up below ten. I have never heard ATC approve a clearance like that before and I know that FAR 91.117 states no aircraft will fly faster than 250 below ten “unless authorized by the administrator” so my question is, are some US cargo company authorized by the administrator for this? Or is there another FAR that allow you guys to fly faster below ten when heavy? Or do you guys never takeoff at MTOW?
Again, I am clueless about both aircrafts and their operations and I appreciate the clarification.
Hope everyone is well
The last part of that far reads “(d) If the minimum safe airspeed for any particular operation is greater than the maximum speed prescribed in this section, the aircraft may be operated at that minimum speed”.
This is the case for Military aircraft such as fighters as well
At least to the best of my knowledge.
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05-10-2020, 10:02 PM
#3
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Originally Posted by RemiDenton
The last part of that far reads “(d) If the minimum safe airspeed for any particular operation is greater than the maximum speed prescribed in this section, the aircraft may be operated at that minimum speed”.
This is the case for Military aircraft such as fighters as well
At least to the best of my knowledge.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
This is the case for Military aircraft such as fighters as well
At least to the best of my knowledge.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
05-10-2020, 10:03 PM
#4
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Joined APC: Jul 2012
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 62
Yes, it’s allowed per the FAR, did that at Atlas often. And when in doubt, just ask ATC for relief.... they know you’re a heavy and usually approve.
05-10-2020, 10:07 PM
#5
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I’ve always just stated “request min speed 260 KIAS” and typically get a “cleared as requested”. The controllers probably won’t have an issue as it’s usually only happening on climbout and a short event.
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05-10-2020, 10:18 PM
#6
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Thank you guys for answering my questions!
05-10-2020, 10:18 PM
#7
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Originally Posted by jgdeleon09
I guess I need to read the whole paragraph before asking questions lol so that answers that, so my next question is, because most cargo flies at night I have never really heard a clearance like that before, is that pretty normal?
Last edited by Adlerdriver; 05-10-2020 at 10:37 PM.
05-10-2020, 10:29 PM
#8
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Position: Whale FO
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Originally Posted by Tandem46
Yes, it’s allowed per the FAR, did that at Atlas often. And when in doubt, just ask ATC for relief.... they know you’re a heavy and usually approve.
05-11-2020, 12:35 AM
#9
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Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 28
Originally Posted by dera
ATC can not approve it, only administrator can.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/91.117
See paragraph d.
05-11-2020, 12:39 AM
#10
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Joined APC: Jun 2017
Position: 777 Left window seat
Posts: 638
Also, some countries do not require 250 KIAS below 10,000’ or their ATC can waive the requirement. Your FOM/GOM should have an explanation.
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