OK for the record the ALPA reps at indoc were good guys and mentioned all the good ALPA has done. I didn't want this to come off bad, I thought I was just stating a fact.

Now since I'm here I'll through in my $.02. I don't know why everyone is so worriied at FedEx about the age 60 rule. 80% of the Capts I have flown with say they are going to retire at 60 regardless of the rule. Unless the rule change makes it so they can't without some major penalty. With that said, people worrying about upgrade really don't have much of an argument. Second, I know we would like to stop this but the reality is; it is going to change. There are just too many heavy hitters trying to make it happen. Now the way I see it, the best way to keep the upgrade flow going, is to make it so that 80% can go ahead and retire without a penalty. This seems to the direction ALPA is heading.

I agree with you ,

but when I hear young guys that have been here only less than 3 years saying it's all about ME ME ME,: excuse me for getting my feathers ruffled.

Now the bottom line is The rule is going to change. ALPA leaders have tried to tell everyone that it is over........some choose not to believe it.
Some think it is all a conspiracy. Move on, it's coming.

Now we have to focus on what can be done to lesson the negative effects.

Oh my God... you did it again! Please keep track of whose resume you are questioning. Here - I'll help you:

http://airlinepilotforums.com/showth...925#post163925

How many retirement notice FCIFs have you read lately? I haven't seen any.

I know of at least 13 guys that turned 60 in the last 60 days. All but one still have a calendar, of some sort.

[QUOTE=Huck;171629]Oh my God... you did it again! Please keep track of whose resume you are questioning.
QUOTE]

So great, this isn't your first crack at it.
But you must admit you are still doing pretty dam good for someone who has been at a company less than 5 years. You could still be a Capt a Gemini or World but your an FO here making almost double. I get it...........
Your making my point. It's all about "me me me............."

I get it You want 6o guys to leave..............I wish I could be around as you near 60.

I wish I predict the future with certainty

[QUOTE=MX727;171566]1. How many pilots were fired and stayed fired 1993-2007 with ALPA/FPA/ALPA?

2. How many pilots were fired and stayed 1972-1993 fired prior to ALPA/FPA/ALPA?

Please enlighten us.

I'm sure you must have those figures.

Come on FoxHunter...you quoted the wrong person...but, I am still curious about the answer.

Thanks for rolling over ALPA and our MEC. Yes, I am ****ed too. FedEx is the highest dues paying airline today in ALPA. A little known fact. So why are we still the "red-headed stepchildren"?

For clarification, do you mean the total amount of dues paid by the FedEx crewforce, or the percent of our income we pay for dues?

Wow,at least you didn't completly parrot the MEC line.
 

I've read every union message and e-mailed my block rep. What negative effects are you talking about? What exactly are we going to do if the legislation is already written? I've heard this "mitigate the damage" crap from enough people blowing smoke up my ass. I haven't heard one example of a concrete action or even the promise of a reach around while I'm being bent over. The MEC doesn't have a plan of action after their political ploy of changing our position on 60. They are just covering their ass with shotgun statements. So, in case my poor communication skills are showing: What negative effects/damage are we going to be able to influence?

Here's what the "mitigation" means....

Anyone over 60 still on the property can bid captain

Nobody over 60 will get a more stringent physical

Nobody over 60 will have their B plan touched...

So--yes...ALPA is working very hard to make sure none of the inputs by Congress or the FAA hurt the over 60 guys.

They will also tell you that they are working to make sure the rest of us can still retire at 60 without penalty, and that our B plans will not be affected either. Based on the energy expended on changing the law and protecting the over 60 crowd, and the lack of any communication on what they will do to help those affected negatively by the change, I am someone skeptical of their ability to carry this fight into the future for the junior guys benefit. I suspect they will simply say "we couldnt' win this fight either--its the IRS--not us..."

quote from another member



"The IRS allows the second "B" fund for those who MUST retire before age 65. Without this exemption the “B” fund would be taxed as income and would add an additional 22+ percent to the cost of the “B” fund to the company. Then you can kiss it good-bye."

I hear you Albie.

Not sure exactly what you meant but I would like to change one thing.

I think they are perfectly able to fight for the junior guys. But they are not willing to expend much energy. It's not worth it. They'll let us fight that battle when we can hold MEC.

ALPA is truly a Captains' club.

Total amount paid to ALPA by any crewforce.

Doesn't matter what most "say".... they ARE staying. Look at the list of those that turned 60..... almost all have stayed.

There are several of the over 60 crowd who have been jumping up and down on their buddies un Managment's desks to try and postpone any bid until after the 60 legislation/ruling takes effect. This is because they have to have Capt. "slots" to bid into (its not automatic like going to the back seat). As large bids happen only every 18-30 months having this next bid prior to the issuance would time many of them out as they near 65.

4700 sacrificed for the good of a few. I hope I get the same representation some day.

Flew with a 59 1/2 Capt recently. While sitting in LAX, him and a buddy were talking about how they can't wait to stay on so they could buy this or that toy.... the buddy was a 10 S/O...

Really really hard not to chime in....

damn

[QUOTE=matty;171531]We were ALWAYS on probation prior to ALPA (1).
fbh

well back to the lanyards. It seems that most want a plain black, with various attachment points. One can buy a plain black lanyard in qtys of 10, which would only be about $20 for the lot. I'm going to get 10 with a ID strap. If anyone wants one, PM me and I'll leave it in your locker -or your buddy's locker for anonymity reasons.;) First come first free.

This is a unique time in the history of ALPA.

Seldom have so few benefited from the sacrifices of so many.

How about "WWMD(what would the majority do?)......who cares"

Probation was not part of the Flight Crew handbook, that document which served as the "rule book" prior to a Collective Bargaining Agreement. Our first CBA, known as "The Agreement", was brought to us courtesy of the Fedex Pilots Association (FPA) and Frank Fato's infamous parking lot deal. It implemented probation at FedEx, so one might argue that probation is FPA's fault.

But . . .

I don't know if probation was a provision of the previous FPA TA (Jan '98) or of the ALPA TA (June '96), so I can't say for certain that FPA was "to blame."


Does it matter?



.

How about--
Friends don't let friends fly past age 60

Still anxiously waiting for you to enlighten us with the answers to your slanderous questions...

I could support that. ;)




.

Tony..
We will have to agree to disagree.
I disagree that the 12,000 pilots of APA are irrelavent simply because they don't belong to ALPA. I'm sure their Chairman for Legislative Affairs(a member of the Blue ribbon panel) would disagree as well. He was shocked how quickly ALPA knuckled under to the PAAD and SWA influence during their deliberations.
Besides that, I really need to focus on something I may have some control over....my ability to hit my new utility club.

Or -- This space available for 2% of my salary!

Pay the man, Shirley.

How about right seat only. I saw that idea somewhere and Huck has been advocating it (as I did in the web poll farce) and it sounds good to me.

FJ

Perhaps I underestimate the influence of APA, or SWAPA, or IPA, or CAPA. I'm a pilot, not a politician.


In any event, I think you've got a great idea. I've been told that golf is relaxing for some people. ;)




.

Especially approaching Age 60 and beyond!:rolleyes: