Confused on IPA’s stance
01-17-2008, 12:11 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: I was acquired, Not Hired
Posts: 1,784
Originally Posted by b2pilot186
Not trying to start a war here...It just gets old listening to all the military "experts" who haven't served a day in their lives. B2P
I agree with you 110%. I'm tired of listening to all the "airline experts" who work at UPS that this is their first and only airline.
Thanks for your choice to serve the country.
FF
01-17-2008, 01:04 PM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by FliFast
B2P,
I agree with you 110%. I'm tired of listening to all the "airline experts" who work at UPS that this is their first and only airline.
Thanks for your choice to serve the country.
FF
I agree with you 110%. I'm tired of listening to all the "airline experts" who work at UPS that this is their first and only airline.
Thanks for your choice to serve the country.
FF
B2P
Last edited by b2pilot186; 01-17-2008 at 01:29 PM.
01-17-2008, 01:41 PM
#23
New ride...
Joined APC: Apr 2005
Posts: 534
Originally Posted by b2pilot186
The fact that this is my first and only airline has kept my commentary in that area fairly limited...that's the difference here. The "first and only" comment I made was to let everyone know that I didn't have much experience in the civilian world...not that I'd never have to go somewhere else because UPS is a very stable company...so relax. I have never held my self out as an "airline expert"...end of story there champ. I don't ***** about what toys you have in your playpen, so don't worry about what I have as a military retiree. That was my point for anyone that missed the obvious. I can do without the backhanded thanks as well.
B2P
B2P
01-17-2008, 01:51 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: 1 ft out the door
Posts: 113
My note on military benefits has been taken out of context. The point is, for many maintaining health insurance prevents retirement and a comfortable life style. A military retirement can relieve this major expensive, to some extent, for those who “chose” to serve.
I have served and continue to serve today not so much for the “windfall” of a modest retirement pension but for the health care benefits. As far as a military retirement being factored into my ability to retire, it will be…I earned it with hard time served…
B2P
A person who has only been at one airline not only has made good decisions, but also has as much to add here as the next.
I have served and continue to serve today not so much for the “windfall” of a modest retirement pension but for the health care benefits. As far as a military retirement being factored into my ability to retire, it will be…I earned it with hard time served…
B2P
A person who has only been at one airline not only has made good decisions, but also has as much to add here as the next.
01-17-2008, 03:45 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,333
"...True. I didn't mean it that way. Obviously, it can happen. My point was that it's ridiculous to just give these guys everything they want and it's ridiculous for them to want the world at the expense of everyone else. But I guess it's part of the ME ME ME generation..."
I totally agree with you.
"...I think that comes out to around $13 per pilot. I thought it was kind of weak actually. I sent in $40 (not a ton but that's what I sent). If everyone did that (like a capt. can't afford that?), it would have been around $120,000. $40,000 is pathetic IMO..."
Now that you put it that way, yeah I guess it was kind of weak. How does a multimillionaire senior captain rationalize not helping a new-hire fighting cancer? A guy who’ll have to feed his family on mutual aid based off of his ~33K this year? I hope some were simply unaware of the poor guy’s situation.
So let me rephrase my earlier statement – it’s the guys/gals who chip in to help fellow brown aviators in need that make me proud – that’s the group I want to be associated with. The others – well, they are either unaware (
) or selfish – and if so, fate will catch up with them – karma does not discriminate!
“…Going into the military is a CHOICE. You do sacrifice a lot but you also chose to go in. Your flying is paid for as well. There are advantages and disadvantages to both (mil. and civ.) but there is no doubt, going into the military is a CHOICE in the US. I do think that their military retirement should be a large amount though…”
On this issue I’ll never agree with you or with your future father-in-law (marriage in sight after all
). Yes it is their choice to serve our country and I for one am grateful they decided to volunteer.
However, you cannot think of that service as just another profession where they do their time, get their benefits and move on to the next gig. Instead it’s a life-altering service where they might have to move to any corner of the earth on a very short notice. It’s a service during which their families can be left alone for months and months at a time, and unfortunately a service where some of them never come back from a deployment. Notice I said service not a job or even career – because it’s much more than a job – and therefore the rest of us must adjust to their working conditions and not the other way around.
Trust me, with the current military buildup in China, the resurgence of pseudo-communism in Russia under the leadership of KGB Putin (albeit under the more attractive name of “Russian nationalism”), the fermenting Islamo-fascism in much of the Middle East, etc. we’ll need the protection of our armed forced even more in the near future.
They will choose to serve just like they do now and they will still need to know that once their military commitment is over with they’ll be welcomed into the civilian side of their profession – welcomed with open arms. They earned it, they deserved it and we should always remember it. Just my worthless ½ ¢ on this issue.
I totally agree with you.
"...I think that comes out to around $13 per pilot. I thought it was kind of weak actually. I sent in $40 (not a ton but that's what I sent). If everyone did that (like a capt. can't afford that?), it would have been around $120,000. $40,000 is pathetic IMO..."
Now that you put it that way, yeah I guess it was kind of weak. How does a multimillionaire senior captain rationalize not helping a new-hire fighting cancer? A guy who’ll have to feed his family on mutual aid based off of his ~33K this year? I hope some were simply unaware of the poor guy’s situation.
So let me rephrase my earlier statement – it’s the guys/gals who chip in to help fellow brown aviators in need that make me proud – that’s the group I want to be associated with. The others – well, they are either unaware (
) or selfish – and if so, fate will catch up with them – karma does not discriminate!“…Going into the military is a CHOICE. You do sacrifice a lot but you also chose to go in. Your flying is paid for as well. There are advantages and disadvantages to both (mil. and civ.) but there is no doubt, going into the military is a CHOICE in the US. I do think that their military retirement should be a large amount though…”
On this issue I’ll never agree with you or with your future father-in-law (marriage in sight after all
). Yes it is their choice to serve our country and I for one am grateful they decided to volunteer. However, you cannot think of that service as just another profession where they do their time, get their benefits and move on to the next gig. Instead it’s a life-altering service where they might have to move to any corner of the earth on a very short notice. It’s a service during which their families can be left alone for months and months at a time, and unfortunately a service where some of them never come back from a deployment. Notice I said service not a job or even career – because it’s much more than a job – and therefore the rest of us must adjust to their working conditions and not the other way around.
Trust me, with the current military buildup in China, the resurgence of pseudo-communism in Russia under the leadership of KGB Putin (albeit under the more attractive name of “Russian nationalism”), the fermenting Islamo-fascism in much of the Middle East, etc. we’ll need the protection of our armed forced even more in the near future.
They will choose to serve just like they do now and they will still need to know that once their military commitment is over with they’ll be welcomed into the civilian side of their profession – welcomed with open arms. They earned it, they deserved it and we should always remember it. Just my worthless ½ ¢ on this issue.
01-17-2008, 03:47 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Posts: 3,333
Originally Posted by b2pilot186
The fact that this is my first and only airline has kept my commentary in that area fairly limited...that's the difference here. The "first and only" comment I made was to let everyone know that I didn't have much experience in the civilian world...not that I'd never have to go somewhere else because UPS is a very stable company...so relax. I have never held my self out as an "airline expert"...end of story there champ. I don't ***** about what toys you have in your playpen, so don't worry about what I have as a military retiree. That was my point for anyone that missed the obvious. I can do without the backhanded thanks as well.
B2P
B2P
01-17-2008, 04:31 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 558
Originally Posted by ⌐ AV8OR WANNABE
"...True. I didn't mean it that way. Obviously, it can happen. My point was that it's ridiculous to just give these guys everything they want and it's ridiculous for them to want the world at the expense of everyone else. But I guess it's part of the ME ME ME generation..."
I totally agree with you.
"...I think that comes out to around $13 per pilot. I thought it was kind of weak actually. I sent in $40 (not a ton but that's what I sent). If everyone did that (like a capt. can't afford that?), it would have been around $120,000. $40,000 is pathetic IMO..."
Now that you put it that way, yeah I guess it was kind of weak. How does a multimillionaire senior captain rationalize not helping a new-hire fighting cancer? A guy who’ll have to feed his family on mutual aid based off of his ~33K this year? I hope some were simply unaware of the poor guy’s situation.
So let me rephrase my earlier statement – it’s the guys/gals who chip in to help fellow brown aviators in need that make me proud – that’s the group I want to be associated with. The others – well, they are either unaware () or selfish – and if so, fate will catch up with them – karma does not discriminate!
“…Going into the military is a CHOICE. You do sacrifice a lot but you also chose to go in. Your flying is paid for as well. There are advantages and disadvantages to both (mil. and civ.) but there is no doubt, going into the military is a CHOICE in the US. I do think that their military retirement should be a large amount though…”
On this issue I’ll never agree with you or with your future father-in-law (marriage in sight after all). Yes it is their choice to serve our country and I for one am grateful they decided to volunteer.
However, you cannot think of that service as just another profession where they do their time, get their benefits and move on to the next gig. Instead it’s a life-altering service where they might have to move to any corner of the earth on a very short notice. It’s a service during which their families can be left alone for months and months at a time, and unfortunately a service where some of them never come back from a deployment. Notice I said service not a job or even career – because it’s much more than a job – and therefore the rest of us must adjust to their working conditions and not the other way around.
Trust me, with the current military buildup in China, the resurgence of pseudo-communism in Russia under the leadership of KGB Putin (albeit under the more attractive name of “Russian nationalism”), the fermenting Islamo-fascism in much of the Middle East, etc. we’ll need the protection of our armed forced even more in the near future.
They will choose to serve just like they do now and they will still need to know that once their military commitment is over with they’ll be welcomed into the civilian side of their profession – welcomed with open arms. They earned it, they deserved it and we should always remember it. Just my worthless ½ ¢ on this issue.
I totally agree with you.
"...I think that comes out to around $13 per pilot. I thought it was kind of weak actually. I sent in $40 (not a ton but that's what I sent). If everyone did that (like a capt. can't afford that?), it would have been around $120,000. $40,000 is pathetic IMO..."
Now that you put it that way, yeah I guess it was kind of weak. How does a multimillionaire senior captain rationalize not helping a new-hire fighting cancer? A guy who’ll have to feed his family on mutual aid based off of his ~33K this year? I hope some were simply unaware of the poor guy’s situation.
So let me rephrase my earlier statement – it’s the guys/gals who chip in to help fellow brown aviators in need that make me proud – that’s the group I want to be associated with. The others – well, they are either unaware (
) or selfish – and if so, fate will catch up with them – karma does not discriminate!“…Going into the military is a CHOICE. You do sacrifice a lot but you also chose to go in. Your flying is paid for as well. There are advantages and disadvantages to both (mil. and civ.) but there is no doubt, going into the military is a CHOICE in the US. I do think that their military retirement should be a large amount though…”
On this issue I’ll never agree with you or with your future father-in-law (marriage in sight after all
). Yes it is their choice to serve our country and I for one am grateful they decided to volunteer. However, you cannot think of that service as just another profession where they do their time, get their benefits and move on to the next gig. Instead it’s a life-altering service where they might have to move to any corner of the earth on a very short notice. It’s a service during which their families can be left alone for months and months at a time, and unfortunately a service where some of them never come back from a deployment. Notice I said service not a job or even career – because it’s much more than a job – and therefore the rest of us must adjust to their working conditions and not the other way around.
Trust me, with the current military buildup in China, the resurgence of pseudo-communism in Russia under the leadership of KGB Putin (albeit under the more attractive name of “Russian nationalism”), the fermenting Islamo-fascism in much of the Middle East, etc. we’ll need the protection of our armed forced even more in the near future.
They will choose to serve just like they do now and they will still need to know that once their military commitment is over with they’ll be welcomed into the civilian side of their profession – welcomed with open arms. They earned it, they deserved it and we should always remember it. Just my worthless ½ ¢ on this issue.
Well said Av8or!
01-17-2008, 06:42 PM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: I was acquired, Not Hired
Posts: 1,784
Originally Posted by FliFast
B2P,
I agree with you 110%. I'm tired of listening to all the "airline experts" who work at UPS that this is their first and only airline.
Thanks for your choice to serve the country.
FF
I agree with you 110%. I'm tired of listening to all the "airline experts" who work at UPS that this is their first and only airline.
Thanks for your choice to serve the country.
FF
The only comment I made to you specifically was thanking you for your choice to serve. I'm not sure how that's backhanded.
The other one was directed to others, that I've flown with. I (we) didn't realize it pertained to you until you made your comments.
Best of luck,
FF
btw, "toys in the playpen"...as a newhire, I don't even get a leather jacket. I think the only backhandedness is......
Last edited by FliFast; 01-17-2008 at 06:48 PM.
01-17-2008, 07:46 PM
#29
Freightmama!
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 757/767 FO
Posts: 2,880
Originally Posted by b2pilot186
Believe me, they recouped every penny and more. I don't regret my choice to serve 24 years, but I'll be damned if someone expects me to continue paying for it today. FP, it seems some people think that military flight traing, retirement pay and heathcare is some kind of windfall for those that have it...I'll just remind them that they made their own CHOICE not to pursue it themselves. Not trying to start a war here...It just gets old listening to all the military "experts" who haven't served a day in their lives. They should worry about what they have and stop thinking about what everyone else has...I guarantee they'll never be happy until they do.
B2P
B2P
I don't want you to continue paying for anything. I appreciate your service. I looked into the service after high school but I didn't like the long committment. I don't think it's a windfall but the main reason I didn't join was because an AA pilot (ex-AF) was saying how I could have so much more seniority at an airline if I go the civilian route. Looks like he was right.
Anyways, thanks for your service.
01-17-2008, 07:50 PM
#30
Freightmama!
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 757/767 FO
Posts: 2,880
Originally Posted by Vman
A person who has only been at one airline not only has made good decisions, but also has as much to add here as the next.
Not trying to do a civ. vs. mil. here, just stating the facts.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
