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Originally Posted by tennesseeflyboy
(Post 836286)
Box, to be more specific, I find it disgusting when I have seen or heard of those amongst us that are enjoying 130 to 150 credit hour bid months, at a time when a majority of the crewforce was getting half or less of that.
Can you explain to me why our MEC was getting a "full paycheck" when those they are representing were not ? To what end are we as a group willing to accept the unacceptable ? I find it more and more difficult to envision any possiblity of unity amongst this group, when there are clearly those that feel "entitled to get theirs" and watch everyone around them "lose theirs". The end result of the 4a2b debacle is a divisiveness that will not go away for years to come .........................hopefully Leadership is on the way but it will be long after I have left this place. |
Originally Posted by FLMD11CAPT
(Post 836459)
This is the same group who touted and extolled the virtues of "shared sacrifice". I guess it is "ok" to "sacrifice" with my money.....but not theirs.:cool::mad:
First, we have been thru this before. Only the MEC Chair, Vice-Chair, and Treasurer are compensated at 96 (or is it 98) hours a month. When we took the 4a2b cut, I immediately contacted the old Treasurer and he assured me that they would voluntarily take a cut. In my opinion, it was paltry. While it was inadequate in my opinion, in all fairness, those guys did it voluntarily. If they took enough of a cut so I felt I got my pound of flesh, who's to say my neighbor would think it was enough. You're never going to satisfy everyone. You could count me among the unsatisfied. In the end, they ended up taking about a 6% cut + or - when they voluntarily got rid of one of their pay provisions. The former Treasurer took the biggest percentage, the Former MEC chair took the smallest. While they all took the same cut, the difference had to do with what the amount was as a percentage of their total pay.....I did the numbers once. It was based on my best guess at their payrate. I pressed the old Treasurer to disclose to the membership what they did since it deviated from the ALPA bylaws on compensation. He said I could come in and he would show me. A message line went out saying they took a 7% cut voluntarily, but not how those numbers were derived. The argument was that since it was a voluntary give back by those receiving the compensation, then it was not necessary. I can't fault the logic, though it was not the answer I wanted. I spoke with this at length with my old block rep and with Fred. If I remember correctly, a resolution was voted on but was not passed by the last MEC to cut the pay of the top three...My understanding was that it did not pass as the MEC did not want to discourage any new candidate for running for the position. One of those new candidates was my block rep and our new treasurer (take that for what it is worth). Some felt there was little likelyhood of the new MEC Chair being one of the ones who was previously compensated. I for one am happy with the leadership we have in place. While I was adamant that the top three of the last group should share the sacrifice they were touting....since it came about under their watch, I don't feel the same about the new guys. Don't begrudge them the pay.... Some of the same guys in and out of the MEC who were upset of the lack of "shared sacrifice" were some of the same guys who actively supported the candidacy of the guys we have now. They wanted them to have the full benefit of the pay provisions. This complaint about the MEC is about a year too late and is suspicious as it comes as we are probably in the middle of Negotiating a new LOA for HKG and preparing for negotiations. Let's not let old issues drive a wedge between our pilot group and our leadership at a critical time. If we are going to do that....then lets start with geezer bashing....that's easy :D (Tongue in cheek for our more seasoned sensitive types) This is my best recollection. Talk to your block rep and they can give you the details. None of this was done in the dark, though there were no hourly updates on Fox News about it either. Though I am not happy about a lot of the decisions of the last set of officers, it is inaccurate to say they didn't share the sacrifice............you just have to make your own decision about the size of their share. It was a concern for me then....it is not now. |
Originally Posted by FLMD11CAPT
(Post 836459)
This is the same group who touted and extolled the virtues of "shared sacrifice". I guess it is "ok" to "sacrifice" with my money.....but not theirs.:cool::mad:
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We are in the middle of negotiating a new LOA for HKG? When are they going to tell the rest of us? I guess unity and mushrooms are grown the same way. Besides, I though we already had the best we are gonna get.
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That was a wild guess on my part...........let's not sow hate and discontent. It used to grate on me when people called this message board 12 angry men........I think it's beginning to live up to it's moniker. Just like I think the CIA is most effective when they aren't testifying to congress in the middle of operations, I would hope that our negotiating committee wouldn't run around spouting things they are working on with the company prematurely...........
Besides, MY NEGOTIATING COMMITTEE SPEAKS FOR ME......I trust them to do that, and I trust them to tell me what they've done when they find it appropriate. If they screw up, we replace them....not the system......I like Republics better than Democracies.....then tend to work better. |
Originally Posted by FDXLAG
(Post 836537)
We are in the middle of negotiating a new LOA for HKG? When are they going to tell the rest of us? I guess unity and mushrooms are grown the same way. Besides, I though we already had the best we are gonna get.
I know if I were the company, I would not want to put a bid out for a MD-11 domicile in HKG in an improving shipping environment and not be able to fill it. When freight is down, an unfilled bid probably goes unnoticed. I wouldn't want to be the guy who makes the decision to save the company a nickel and cost them a dollar right now. Enough......I've got a holiday weekend to enjoy thanks to the sacrifices of men and women in Uniform.........without them, we wouldn't be able to have these petty arguments. |
Wow I hate it when discontent and hate is sowed too. Will the pro discontent and hate guys please stand up. Your orignal post had us in the middle of negotiating a new loa. That was news to me. If you say you dont know but you hope we are that is different.
Negotiating a LOA when a contract is approaching its amendable date is a pretty big decision. And pretty stupid if you ask me. What is the purpose of an LOA other than to "amend" the contract. I would hope that there would be some communication before we go down that path. I know, we can do another wilson poll. Some might argue that we are in constant negotiation and the problem comes when the only issues we are negotiating are the issues important to the company. Happy 4th. |
Originally Posted by Laughing_Jakal
(Post 836527)
First, we have been thru this before.
Only the MEC Chair, Vice-Chair, and Treasurer are compensated at 96 (or is it 98) hours a month. When we took the 4a2b cut, I immediately contacted the old Treasurer and he assured me that they would voluntarily take a cut. In my opinion, it was paltry. While it was inadequate in my opinion, in all fairness, those guys did it voluntarily. If they took enough of a cut so I felt I got my pound of flesh, who's to say my neighbor would think it was enough. You're never going to satisfy everyone. You could count me among the unsatisfied. In the end, they ended up taking about a 6% cut + or - when they voluntarily got rid of one of their pay provisions. The former Treasurer took the biggest percentage, the Former MEC chair took the smallest. While they all took the same cut, the difference had to do with what the amount was as a percentage of their total pay.....I did the numbers once. It was based on my best guess at their payrate. I pressed the old Treasurer to disclose to the membership what they did since it deviated from the ALPA bylaws on compensation. He said I could come in and he would show me. A message line went out saying they took a 7% cut voluntarily, but not how those numbers were derived. The argument was that since it was a voluntary give back by those receiving the compensation, then it was not necessary. I can't fault the logic, though it was not the answer I wanted. I spoke with this at length with my old block rep and with Fred. If I remember correctly, a resolution was voted on but was not passed by the last MEC to cut the pay of the top three...My understanding was that it did not pass as the MEC did not want to discourage any new candidate for running for the position. One of those new candidates was my block rep and our new treasurer (take that for what it is worth). Some felt there was little likelyhood of the new MEC Chair being one of the ones who was previously compensated. I for one am happy with the leadership we have in place. While I was adamant that the top three of the last group should share the sacrifice they were touting....since it came about under their watch, I don't feel the same about the new guys. Don't begrudge them the pay.... Some of the same guys in and out of the MEC who were upset of the lack of "shared sacrifice" were some of the same guys who actively supported the candidacy of the guys we have now. They wanted them to have the full benefit of the pay provisions. This complaint about the MEC is about a year too late and is suspicious as it comes as we are probably in the middle of Negotiating a new LOA for HKG and preparing for negotiations. Let's not let old issues drive a wedge between our pilot group and our leadership at a critical time. If we are going to do that....then lets start with geezer bashing....that's easy :D (Tongue in cheek for our more seasoned sensitive types) This is my best recollection. Talk to your block rep and they can give you the details. None of this was done in the dark, though there were no hourly updates on Fox News about it either. Though I am not happy about a lot of the decisions of the last set of officers, it is inaccurate to say they didn't share the sacrifice............you just have to make your own decision about the size of their share. It was a concern for me then....it is not now. |
Originally Posted by FLMD11CAPT
(Post 836594)
Just to clarify, I was referring to the top three in the previous Administration..............in addition I do hold the last MEC accountable for not passing the resoultion to reduce MEC compensation in proportion with the Line guys sacrifices.
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Originally Posted by FDXLAG
(Post 836554)
... Your orignal post had us in the middle of negotiating a new loa. That was news to me. If you say you dont know but you hope we are that is different.
Happy 4th......Long Live the REPUBLIC! |
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