FDX - Vacation buy-back and R-line question
08-18-2011, 01:20 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Re-reading George Orwell's 'Animal Farm' and getting scared...
Posts: 276
Originally Posted by fecav8r
Mark,
I know very well how the vacation system works in regard to reserve. My ire is due the the fact that the poster called any one who didnt use their entire vacation bank a loser and then went on to join that with having hookers around the world due to the fact you dont have a life. My post was to refute the fact that there are many reasons why people do things here, and just because they dont do what you think they should that they are a loser. I know a lot of folks that have kids in college and that little check for vacation buy back comes in real handy for Spring semester tuition. If you want to use your entire vacation bank, knock yourself out. If you dont, good for you too. I dont think youre a loser either way.
Otis
I know very well how the vacation system works in regard to reserve. My ire is due the the fact that the poster called any one who didnt use their entire vacation bank a loser and then went on to join that with having hookers around the world due to the fact you dont have a life. My post was to refute the fact that there are many reasons why people do things here, and just because they dont do what you think they should that they are a loser. I know a lot of folks that have kids in college and that little check for vacation buy back comes in real handy for Spring semester tuition. If you want to use your entire vacation bank, knock yourself out. If you dont, good for you too. I dont think youre a loser either way.
Otis
08-18-2011, 06:27 PM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 2,889
I've helped a lot of people prepare for jobs at other places, but what strikes me as incredibly different about FedEx is the tremendous amount of flexibility our system has. Not only can you fly a variety of trip types, trip lengths, domestic/international, day/night, commuring & DH/local base launches, overnights/out and backs, but you can also scale the amount of work you do up or down to an extent unmatched at most companies.
Along with that, our ability to max out our pay, or minimize our time away, is IMHO completely different than at most companies. I know a Delta new hire that has been "counseled" for dropping trips, and getting ready of the "sticky booger" trips at SWA can also be difficult. I won't claim to be an expert on the ins and outs of their system, but I know whenever I get in a discussion with pilots at other companies I get a lot of "really? You can do that?..." responses.
So--for your money chasers...I get it. I'm one too. I've got 3 kids to put through college and likely three weddings to pay for. I have expensive hobbies, and big dreams, and I really, really like flying around the world doing what I do. Don't like it? Bid your own line and do what you want.
Time off guys? Why can you drop those trips? What allows us to have this flexibility? Many times, its that dude over to your left or right who will scarf up an extra trip like a dog will grab a table scrap hitting the floor. That guy may not live like you do, but he helps make your lifestyle possible. Calling him a ***** really doesn't hurt him (he doesn't care) and if you take his ability to grab that trip away you may be missing that next softball game for your daughter or camping trip with the family you wanted when you cannot drop or trade out of it.
Another wrinkle is a leaner crew force might mean a slightly slower seat progression, but also more insurance during downturns. I don't think any of us want the 4a2b debacle again in our careers, and if we fatten up to look like a United or Delta manning model, then we need to be prepared for United or Delta type furloughs and downgrades when bad economic cycles hit. I hope we never get so "fat" we have to dip below guarantees again if things go south.
Personally, I love the ability to scale up or down on my work to meet my own agenda. I've had months I have worked ZERO, and I've had months I've gone to work every week. I still have a ton of make up hours left trips I dropped for military or family reasons, and while I probably won't ever make them all up the fact is someone hired the same time I was has had the same chance to grab those hours.
So--next time you are mad somebody sold back some vacation (which is a contractual right, BTW...any of you can do it) and your upgrade has slowed, realize the same system may have kept some of you off the street in 07-09 and may again allow you to hang on to your current seat when guys at other airlines are going from Capt to FO or from a widebody to a narrowbody. There are a lot of guys hired here 92-00 who had the chance to bail for other good jobs at UAL, AA, or DAL, but chose to stay. When I ask many why they stayed instead of going for (at the time) more money at the other places, the answer they always gave was "stability". The fact our company generally does not push people in the wrong direction (again...our recent 4a2b pain aside) adds both financial and emotional value to a career at FedEx. If you want to criticize any part of the system, realize the whole machinery is intertwined and you often cannot have the only the parts that benefit you without having a tradeoffs as well. I think most of us appreciate the system here, even when it doesn't work perfectly for us, understanding that in the big picture we all win if we preserve the ability to work how we want.
DPs? Different subject. The SIG needs our help. Bad trips hurt all of us--Q of life guys or money guys too.
Just my take...of course I may be wrong.
Along with that, our ability to max out our pay, or minimize our time away, is IMHO completely different than at most companies. I know a Delta new hire that has been "counseled" for dropping trips, and getting ready of the "sticky booger" trips at SWA can also be difficult. I won't claim to be an expert on the ins and outs of their system, but I know whenever I get in a discussion with pilots at other companies I get a lot of "really? You can do that?..." responses.
So--for your money chasers...I get it. I'm one too. I've got 3 kids to put through college and likely three weddings to pay for. I have expensive hobbies, and big dreams, and I really, really like flying around the world doing what I do. Don't like it? Bid your own line and do what you want.
Time off guys? Why can you drop those trips? What allows us to have this flexibility? Many times, its that dude over to your left or right who will scarf up an extra trip like a dog will grab a table scrap hitting the floor. That guy may not live like you do, but he helps make your lifestyle possible. Calling him a ***** really doesn't hurt him (he doesn't care) and if you take his ability to grab that trip away you may be missing that next softball game for your daughter or camping trip with the family you wanted when you cannot drop or trade out of it.
Another wrinkle is a leaner crew force might mean a slightly slower seat progression, but also more insurance during downturns. I don't think any of us want the 4a2b debacle again in our careers, and if we fatten up to look like a United or Delta manning model, then we need to be prepared for United or Delta type furloughs and downgrades when bad economic cycles hit. I hope we never get so "fat" we have to dip below guarantees again if things go south.
Personally, I love the ability to scale up or down on my work to meet my own agenda. I've had months I have worked ZERO, and I've had months I've gone to work every week. I still have a ton of make up hours left trips I dropped for military or family reasons, and while I probably won't ever make them all up the fact is someone hired the same time I was has had the same chance to grab those hours.
So--next time you are mad somebody sold back some vacation (which is a contractual right, BTW...any of you can do it) and your upgrade has slowed, realize the same system may have kept some of you off the street in 07-09 and may again allow you to hang on to your current seat when guys at other airlines are going from Capt to FO or from a widebody to a narrowbody. There are a lot of guys hired here 92-00 who had the chance to bail for other good jobs at UAL, AA, or DAL, but chose to stay. When I ask many why they stayed instead of going for (at the time) more money at the other places, the answer they always gave was "stability". The fact our company generally does not push people in the wrong direction (again...our recent 4a2b pain aside) adds both financial and emotional value to a career at FedEx. If you want to criticize any part of the system, realize the whole machinery is intertwined and you often cannot have the only the parts that benefit you without having a tradeoffs as well. I think most of us appreciate the system here, even when it doesn't work perfectly for us, understanding that in the big picture we all win if we preserve the ability to work how we want.
DPs? Different subject. The SIG needs our help. Bad trips hurt all of us--Q of life guys or money guys too.
Just my take...of course I may be wrong.
08-18-2011, 08:52 PM
#23
Gets Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: Nordskog Industries Field Technician
Posts: 688
Originally Posted by Albief15
I've helped a lot of people prepare for jobs at other places, but what strikes me as incredibly different about FedEx is the tremendous amount of flexibility our system has. Not only can you fly a variety of trip types, trip lengths, domestic/international, day/night, commuring & DH/local base launches, overnights/out and backs, but you can also scale the amount of work you do up or down to an extent unmatched at most companies.
Along with that, our ability to max out our pay, or minimize our time away, is IMHO completely different than at most companies. I know a Delta new hire that has been "counseled" for dropping trips, and getting ready of the "sticky booger" trips at SWA can also be difficult. I won't claim to be an expert on the ins and outs of their system, but I know whenever I get in a discussion with pilots at other companies I get a lot of "really? You can do that?..." responses.
So--for your money chasers...I get it. I'm one too. I've got 3 kids to put through college and likely three weddings to pay for. I have expensive hobbies, and big dreams, and I really, really like flying around the world doing what I do. Don't like it? Bid your own line and do what you want.
Time off guys? Why can you drop those trips? What allows us to have this flexibility? Many times, its that dude over to your left or right who will scarf up an extra trip like a dog will grab a table scrap hitting the floor. That guy may not live like you do, but he helps make your lifestyle possible. Calling him a ***** really doesn't hurt him (he doesn't care) and if you take his ability to grab that trip away you may be missing that next softball game for your daughter or camping trip with the family you wanted when you cannot drop or trade out of it.
Another wrinkle is a leaner crew force might mean a slightly slower seat progression, but also more insurance during downturns. I don't think any of us want the 4a2b debacle again in our careers, and if we fatten up to look like a United or Delta manning model, then we need to be prepared for United or Delta type furloughs and downgrades when bad economic cycles hit. I hope we never get so "fat" we have to dip below guarantees again if things go south.
Personally, I love the ability to scale up or down on my work to meet my own agenda. I've had months I have worked ZERO, and I've had months I've gone to work every week. I still have a ton of make up hours left trips I dropped for military or family reasons, and while I probably won't ever make them all up the fact is someone hired the same time I was has had the same chance to grab those hours.
So--next time you are mad somebody sold back some vacation (which is a contractual right, BTW...any of you can do it) and your upgrade has slowed, realize the same system may have kept some of you off the street in 07-09 and may again allow you to hang on to your current seat when guys at other airlines are going from Capt to FO or from a widebody to a narrowbody. There are a lot of guys hired here 92-00 who had the chance to bail for other good jobs at UAL, AA, or DAL, but chose to stay. When I ask many why they stayed instead of going for (at the time) more money at the other places, the answer they always gave was "stability". The fact our company generally does not push people in the wrong direction (again...our recent 4a2b pain aside) adds both financial and emotional value to a career at FedEx. If you want to criticize any part of the system, realize the whole machinery is intertwined and you often cannot have the only the parts that benefit you without having a tradeoffs as well. I think most of us appreciate the system here, even when it doesn't work perfectly for us, understanding that in the big picture we all win if we preserve the ability to work how we want.
DPs? Different subject. The SIG needs our help. Bad trips hurt all of us--Q of life guys or money guys too.
Just my take...of course I may be wrong.
Along with that, our ability to max out our pay, or minimize our time away, is IMHO completely different than at most companies. I know a Delta new hire that has been "counseled" for dropping trips, and getting ready of the "sticky booger" trips at SWA can also be difficult. I won't claim to be an expert on the ins and outs of their system, but I know whenever I get in a discussion with pilots at other companies I get a lot of "really? You can do that?..." responses.
So--for your money chasers...I get it. I'm one too. I've got 3 kids to put through college and likely three weddings to pay for. I have expensive hobbies, and big dreams, and I really, really like flying around the world doing what I do. Don't like it? Bid your own line and do what you want.
Time off guys? Why can you drop those trips? What allows us to have this flexibility? Many times, its that dude over to your left or right who will scarf up an extra trip like a dog will grab a table scrap hitting the floor. That guy may not live like you do, but he helps make your lifestyle possible. Calling him a ***** really doesn't hurt him (he doesn't care) and if you take his ability to grab that trip away you may be missing that next softball game for your daughter or camping trip with the family you wanted when you cannot drop or trade out of it.
Another wrinkle is a leaner crew force might mean a slightly slower seat progression, but also more insurance during downturns. I don't think any of us want the 4a2b debacle again in our careers, and if we fatten up to look like a United or Delta manning model, then we need to be prepared for United or Delta type furloughs and downgrades when bad economic cycles hit. I hope we never get so "fat" we have to dip below guarantees again if things go south.
Personally, I love the ability to scale up or down on my work to meet my own agenda. I've had months I have worked ZERO, and I've had months I've gone to work every week. I still have a ton of make up hours left trips I dropped for military or family reasons, and while I probably won't ever make them all up the fact is someone hired the same time I was has had the same chance to grab those hours.
So--next time you are mad somebody sold back some vacation (which is a contractual right, BTW...any of you can do it) and your upgrade has slowed, realize the same system may have kept some of you off the street in 07-09 and may again allow you to hang on to your current seat when guys at other airlines are going from Capt to FO or from a widebody to a narrowbody. There are a lot of guys hired here 92-00 who had the chance to bail for other good jobs at UAL, AA, or DAL, but chose to stay. When I ask many why they stayed instead of going for (at the time) more money at the other places, the answer they always gave was "stability". The fact our company generally does not push people in the wrong direction (again...our recent 4a2b pain aside) adds both financial and emotional value to a career at FedEx. If you want to criticize any part of the system, realize the whole machinery is intertwined and you often cannot have the only the parts that benefit you without having a tradeoffs as well. I think most of us appreciate the system here, even when it doesn't work perfectly for us, understanding that in the big picture we all win if we preserve the ability to work how we want.
DPs? Different subject. The SIG needs our help. Bad trips hurt all of us--Q of life guys or money guys too.
Just my take...of course I may be wrong.
Cheers, good post.
08-18-2011, 09:24 PM
#24
Nice lookin' tree, there!
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: MD-11, old man
Posts: 2,196
Sorry, thread creep
Question; I'm about 32 hours in the hole for next year, are there any negative ramifications? I could always do a make up vacation trip but is it worth doing? I usually get it down to about zero. Thank you in advance.
fbh
fbh
08-18-2011, 09:52 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Posts: 285
Originally Posted by frozenboxhauler
Question; I'm about 32 hours in the hole for next year, are there any negative ramifications? I could always do a make up vacation trip but is it worth doing? I usually get it down to about zero. Thank you in advance.
fbh
fbh
08-19-2011, 02:22 AM
#26
...Whatever It Is!
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,680
Originally Posted by gderek
I'd think the only negative would be if you didn't have any hours leftover for a future vacation period, but you should be able to avoid that. My understanding is you can just continue to go in the hole every year. As for a MUV trip, maybe if it was a nice trip that you wanted to fly and didn't want to use your make up bank.
I will have 2+00 hrs left in my VAC bank after my Vac next month. I have 7 days of Vac in Nov. I can reduce my footprint mown to 1 or go in the hole. The only time I've done MUV was a few yrs ago when I was -3CHs in my VAC bank with another week to go. I did 6CH of MUV to get back to a positive balance then went in the hole with my last week of Vac.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
