Fr8doggie

Does anybody have a good answer about how the extra pay is determined on the 8-16 hour flights? I tried to figure it out using the contract but failed miserably.

The Walrus

If you call crew pay, they will email you an excel spreadsheet that computes the pay, but you still will not understand it. All I know is it shows up, kind of like when you leave a tooth under your pillow.

NoHaz

I believe between 8-10 is not accounted for so anything flown over 8 gets added to your pay next 15th. Over 10 is accounted for so if you fly less than scheduled on an over 10 flight then you lose diff. next 15th. Can i get a backup on that??

niteFly84

Gouge from Alpa:

Trip Pay over 8 and over 10

Recently, we have received questions from crew members asking about how the block over 8 and block over 10 rules affect pay. Specifically, what is the difference between the two, and how do they actually pay out? Rather than just explaining it, lets look at an actual pairing to figure it out.

Trip Recap
Trip 3003 MEM 77 02FEB11 (AUG)
Shows in 0 days 0:00 hours
Block 2433 Pay 48:39

R D Flight ------ Scheduled ------- -------- Actual --------
R Flight H Date Org-Dst Eq Dprt Arrv Blok Turn Duty Dprt Arrv Blok Turn Duty
— —————— — ——————— ——————— —— ———— ———— ———— ———— ———— ———— ———— ———— ———— ————
0023 02Feb11 MEM-ICN 77 1000 0038 1438 4837 1608
AF0267 X 05Feb11 ICN-CDG 0115 1325 1210 7815 1440
5271 08Feb11 CDG-MEM 77 1940 0535 955 1125

---- T O T A L S C H E D U L E D --- ------ T O T A L A C T U A L -------
Away Blok DH Dty Min Trip Totl Pay Away Blok DH Dty Min Trip Totl Pay
===== ==== ==== === === ==== ==== ==== ===== ==== ==== === === ==== ==== ====
16505 2433 4839
In the example above, we have a trip that pays 48:39 based on TAFB with an operational leg between 8 and 10 hours as well as an operational leg over 10 hours. As you may recall, a trip must be coded as a TAFB trip in order for the over 8 and over 10 rules to take effect. There is also a deadhead leg scheduled for over 12 hours in the pairing. How do you know if this trip is based on TAFB? All trips that pay based on TAFB will have a “T” listed by the number of hours in the Credit Hour block of the bidpack in the bidpack.

Once you have determined a trip pays based on TAFB, you can calculate the amount of trip guarantee using a two-step process. First, figure out the amount of credit hours based on the 3.75 to 1 trip rig ratio. Second, add to this credit the amount of time over 10 hours in any single operational duty period. In trip 3003 above, the TAFB is 165:05. Using our 3.75 to 1 trip rig ratio, this equates to 44:01 pay. You’ll notice, however, that this trip actually pays 48:39. So, where does the extra 4:38 come from? It comes from flight 23, with a block over 10 hours. On a single duty period, every minute over 10 block hours gets added back to the TAFB value for trip guarantee. 14:38 minus 10:00 = 4:38 added to trip guarantee.

What about the 12:10 block AF flight? Why doesn’t the 2:10 overage on the AF 267 flight get added to trip guarantee? The reason is because it is a deadhead leg and not an operational leg. Only operational duty periods blocking over 10 hours get added back into the trip guarantee.

So what about the over 8 hour duty periods? Basically, any block time over 8 hours (up to 10) will get added back to the trip rig AFTER the flight is flown. It is NOT added to trip guarantee. As a reminder, if a trip has multiple legs in the same duty period that adds up to over 8 hours (i.e. a multi-leg RFO duty period) this time will be added. It doesn’t have to be a single flight.

Going back to trip 3003, assuming each duty period is flown exactly as scheduled, what will be the final pay amount? This trip will pay 44:01 for the TAFB, and then 6:38 for the over 8 hours on FX 23 and 1:55 for the time over 8 on FX 5271. The total pay will therefore be 52:34 after the trip is flown (44:01 + 6:38 + 1:55) for an additional 3:55 over trip guarantee.

What about if you fly over or under the scheduled? Assuming again that you land back in MEM at 0535Z (keeping the TAFB the same), the answer lies in the amount of time over 8 hours for the two operational legs. For instance, if you underfly FX 23 by 1 hour, but fly FX 5271 exactly the same, it will pay 44:01 for TAFB, plus 5:38 (instead of 6:38) for overage on FX 23, and 1:55 for the overage on FX 5271. This total is then 51:34, exactly 1 hour less than if every flight was flown as scheduled.

As a final reminder, this overage time ONLY gets added on TAFB trips. We have trips in the bidpack that pay based on other methods, and this overage time doesn’t get added to those trips. Check the trip carefully to see if this overage time will affect you.

As always, if you have comments or questions regarding the lines or the pairings, please forward them to us at [email protected].

Fr8doggie

Hah, like a tooth that takes 10-15 hours to extract! The strange thing I noticed is that when I flew a trip as makeup they went back and took the additional hours out of my bank after the trip was done!

Fr8doggie

Thanks nitefly, I'll check it out.

machz990

Under-flying an over 10 block hour leg (as in the FX23 example above) and having your pay adjusted down was supposedly grieved a long time ago but I've heard nothing about a resolution. Almost as if it was forgotten. The time above 10 block hours is in your trip guarantee and can't be adjusted down if you fly less than scheduled. The time between 8 and 10 block hours is earned when you fly it on TAFB trips. The issue is having pay earned between 8-10 block hours being docked when you fly less than scheduled on an over 10 block hour leg.