Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

Welcome to Airline Pilot Forums - Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ. Join our community today and start interacting with existing members. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free.


User Tag List

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-14-2014, 08:41 AM   #1  
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
 
CloudSailor's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,667
Default International CASS for cockpit jumpseats?

I know that this thread might better belong in the Majors forum, but, since I only ever look at this forum, I thought I'd post it here.

I was a little confused by ALPA's latest email update regarding the international use of CASS, maybe someone who better understands it can clarify.

The email says that international use of CASS is finally, “go for launch!”. ??? I thought we had been using CASS internationally all these years, just without access to the flight deck jumpseat except for on one's own carrier. So, did that change now? The email also mentions United and Alaska as the first two airlines to update their manuals. But, it never really says whether or not we can now ride in the cockpit, off-line, on international flights.

I appreciate any info on this, and hope that we will also be allowing off-line guys international jumpseat reciprocity as they have done for us for years (my captain and I were recently quite embarrassed having to turn down a jumpseat request in Tel Aviv, from a guy who really needed it, and who happens to take FDX'ers home and to work all the time - internationally).

I will also email our Jumpseat Committee Chairman, even though the answers on here might be more interesting.
CloudSailor is offline  
Old 09-14-2014, 06:56 PM   #2  
Gets Weekends Off
 
HKFlyr's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2012
Posts: 255
Default

FDX jumpseat guy is the reason this happened....despite FE chiming in...all the work on this was done by RO.

He can explain the details, as we have a ways to go and not everyone is on board yet. Definitely worth an email to him.

It has been allowed for 2 years, but the ops specs needed to be updated and aggreements set up.

Kudos to Rich on this, as it wouldn't have happened without his hard work.
HKFlyr is offline  
Old 09-14-2014, 08:55 PM   #3  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Sniper's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 998
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSailor View Post
I thought we had been using CASS internationally all these years, just without access to the flight deck jumpseat except for on one's own carrier. So, did that change now?
CASS is (currently) only for use for domestic, off-line, flight deck jumpseat access. If you sit in anything not considered 'the flight deck', you are not accessing the aircraft using CASS. It's just that most gate agents, ops agents, or whomever is charged with supporting the PIC don't know the difference, so they call all jumpseat access requests "CASS". It's not - though, with the unique set-up of some cargo aircraft, this line is blurred further. If you're accessing your own company's aircraft - that is "on-linę", and not CASS. Otherwise, a Fed Ex pilot would never be able to jumpseat internationally on a Fed Ex aircraft, since you can't use CASS for that.

Most pilots don't know the difference, and think "no CASS = no jumpseat". A lot of wrongfully denied jumpseats these days because the PIC abdicates control of their aircraft to someone else.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSailor View Post
The email also mentions United and Alaska as the first two airlines to update their manuals. But, it never really says whether or not we can now ride in the cockpit, off-line, on international flights.
International CASS is in a testing phase. For now, it still isn't approved for the average 'Joe Pilot'. We've been hearing about international CASS being right around the corner for the past 10 years. Still waiting .... CASS is approved by the FAA. The FAA doesn't control security outside the US, and, outside the US, the concept of off-line cockpit access is not normal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloudSailor View Post
I appreciate any info on this, and hope that we will also be allowing off-line guys international jumpseat reciprocity as they have done for us for years (my captain and I were recently quite embarrassed having to turn down a jumpseat request in Tel Aviv, from a guy who really needed it, and who happens to take FDX'ers home and to work all the time - internationally).
Fed Ex is unique in that, in some aspects, they are an industry leader in Jumpseats (more work on the protection of PIC authority has happened at FedEx since 9/11 than any other carrier.) in other ways, Fed Ex is an anchor on the industry - Fed Ex doesn't reciprocate access internationally (nor does UPS).

RO may have had a lot to do with international CASS finally getting close to fruition, but FedEx still doesn't reciprocate with everyone else - that has NOTHING to do with CASS, and everything to do with FedEx.
Sniper is offline  
Old 09-15-2014, 07:37 AM   #4  
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
 
CloudSailor's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,667
Default

Sniper, thanks for clarifying the terms. You are correct about FDX unfortunately choosing to not participate at this point.
CloudSailor is offline  
Old 09-15-2014, 01:04 PM   #5  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Raptor's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Aug 2012
Posts: 711
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sniper View Post
Fed Ex is unique in that, in some aspects, they are an industry leader in Jumpseats (more work on the protection of PIC authority has happened at FedEx since 9/11 than any other carrier.) in other ways, Fed Ex is an anchor on the industry - Fed Ex doesn't reciprocate access internationally (nor does UPS).
Isn't there an issue for potential international jumpseats for OAL pilots on cargo aircraft in that there is no "cabin" security coordinator (i.e. flight attendant)? I've heard that it's not all a FedEx issue?
Raptor is offline  
Old 09-15-2014, 02:20 PM   #6  
Gets Weekends Off
 
John Carr's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,506
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raptor View Post
Isn't there an issue for potential international jumpseats for OAL pilots on cargo aircraft in that there is no "cabin" security coordinator (i.e. flight attendant)? I've heard that it's not all a FedEx issue?
There are, or AT LEAST WERE certain TSA directives that an operator can choose to comply with that allows an offline JS'er on int'l flights. Previously, FedEx and UPS didn't comply with said directives.

The ACMI carriers did comply with said directives, which allowed them to carry offline people int'l.
John Carr is offline  
Old 09-18-2014, 04:44 PM   #7  
On Reserve
 
Nsky's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 17
Default Amateur questions?

So FedEx feeder pilots (MAC, Empire, etc.) do not access FDX international jumpseats even "with the unique set-up of some cargo aircraft"? Same as anyone Off-line?

Can anyone please give examples of international access / use of CASS, other than ACMI carriers? (majors? foreign?)
Nsky is offline  
Old 09-18-2014, 06:13 PM   #8  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: Window Seat
Posts: 1,418
Default

It's a question of common sense vs. a lack of it.
aviatorhi is offline  
Old 09-19-2014, 03:16 AM   #9  
Gets Weekends Off
 
MaydayMark's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: MD-11 Captain
Posts: 4,293
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aviatorhi View Post
It's a question of common sense vs. a lack of it.
We're in BIG trouble them ...
MaydayMark is offline  
Old 09-19-2014, 07:34 AM   #10  
On Reserve
 
Nsky's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 17
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aviatorhi View Post
It's a question of common sense vs. a lack of it.
If that is a reply to my post titled "Amateur questions?" I owe everyone some clarification.

The last time I had anything to do with an airline was >15yrs ago, now flying Part 91. Admittedly, I lack knowledge & I approach this topic from a totally different angle than big cargo ladies & gents on this forum. This topic may become very relevant for me, so I came hoping folks with experience can shed some light.

I developed some interest in FDX feeders recently--type of flying, schedule, basing, etc.
Separately, son just moved to northern Europe.
So, I was wondering if the floater schedule at a feeder (1 wk off / month: when non-peak, if staffed, if it's not a lie...) would enable regular trips, using CASS internationally. That's what triggered my amateur questions. Thanks!
Nsky is offline  
 
 
 

 
Post Reply
 



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Who's a security risk? Sniper Major 3 02-09-2012 08:54 PM
FDX - Keep Growing That International Market! DLax85 Cargo 18 04-09-2010 09:03 AM
The 30 Busiest Passenger Airports in the World Bristol Hangar Talk 3 04-13-2006 10:58 AM
SWA to go international? Sr. Barco Major 21 04-09-2006 11:42 PM
DALs 1 Bright Spot SWAjet Major 0 05-31-2005 09:35 PM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:11 PM.