dckozak

Happy Father's day!! With a little too much time on my hands, reading the Delta TA section of this forum, you think the TA being sent down for membership ratification is a done deal for being voted down. Thing is, we've seen this before, both among the DAL posters here and even the FDX "12 angry men" on this site.

So as a bystander, what can we glean from all this? Can APC, Jet something or other, and other websites trolled by pilots, impact either the opinion of the pilots at large (outside the group that read and post here), pilots who are regular at forums, the union leadership, and lastly, does it have any affect on flight management/company negotiators ??

I'd like to believe we can all benefit from an open dialog about pay and benefits, either within our respective airline or the industry as a whole.
The problem is the dialog leans so heavy negative I wonder if most non passionate readers are swayed by the volume of arguments and if we will all be better off as of the result of these discussions.

Share your opinion

Mark2792

No.

Nice try though-

HIFLYR

Well if the Union road shows would show the good and the bad then there would be no need for airing shortcomings on social media. All I know is FedEx regarding union info road shows and from my experience they have been largely one sided towards the unions wishes. I support the Union and just want straight answers not selling something to me like a used car salesman in a leisure suit.

BigWheelsTurnin

I was recently having the same discussion and I believe you are on point. This will be my first time to go through contract negotiations and vote on a TA. I asked a buddy who had been here a while how the whole process works with voting and if we got some sort of presentation about the TA. At first I thought it made sense when he told me that ALPA made that presentation. The more I thought about it though, the less sense it made... Once a TA is reached, the ALPA negotiating team has basically told us, the members, that "this is as good as we can get for you." Since that is their mentality, of course they will try to sell it to us with their presentation to get a positive vote... Doesn't seem like it would be in their best interest to tell us about the concessionary parts of the TA...

Having said that, regardless of what happens, I do appreciate all the time that the negotiating committee members have put into this. Just like for us line guys, all those trips to DC mean time away from family just the same. Also, since I don't have a solution on who would do a better job with the TA presentation, I don't feel like I can really complain about it... I do agree that we probably have a number of individuals on this and other forums that will go through it with a fine tooth comb and post their findings on here/jetflyers/etc. I thank them in advance for their diligence as well! Just my 2˘...

Flybywyr

Here's an example of what someone did with the Delta TA, pro's and con's. It would cool if someone smarter than I put something like this together if we get a TA.


https://tafacts.com/home

Nightflyer

It would be nice if we had a website like that, but I won't hold my breath.

I always enjoyed reading the papers stuffed in my locker. At least they gave you the other side of the story, so you could make an informed decision.

MaydayMark

I'm disappointed to say that I have to agree with you ...

Interestingly, the FPA did not mail copies of the TA until AFTER their Roadshow. I left the Roadshow thinking I'd probably vote for it. Several days later a copy of the TA arrived in the mail; I spent several days reading it (I'm one of those guys that does that).

After reading the actual document I felt as if the Union Negotiating Committee Chairman had only discussed the GOOD point in his presentation. I felt as if I had been deceived by my own Union and voted NO!*?

And ... that Negotiating Committee Chairman was subsequently promoted to Vice President of Flight Operations. The next Negotiating Committee Chairman was promoted to System Chief Pilot! It seems like there should be laws against that? Did Management buy them off in an attempt to "sell" us a less than desirable CBA?

So ... we'll have to read it and decide for ourselves. Unfortunately, that the only way

It shouldn't be that way!*?

Jetjok

Mayday, it should be that way. You shouldn't rely on someone else to ferret out the details for you on something so important. You should be doing your own due diligence. If for no other reason than you might have major heartburn on one obscure topic, that others don't even care about. Would you expect a roadshow-like event to cover each and every aspect of the TA? How long would that take? Face it, pilots have the attention span of a teenager. Whose going to suffer through a presentation of the entire TA? Do your own reading and draw your conclusions based on what you know, not what you heard in some presentation. It's too important.

busdriver12

"Face it, pilots have the attention span of a teenager. Whose going to suffer through a presentation of the entire TA? Do your own reading and draw your conclusions based on what you know, not what you heard in some presentation. It's too important. "

Okay, it's true about the attention span.....look, squirrel!!!

I hope we have something to look at soon.

Commando

The issue is ALL NC members feel that an agreed upon TA is their Baby. They are "attached" to it. This is a problem in my opinion.

So during the Roadshows, they spend 90% of the Time going over the positive points and how great their "Baby" is.

And Membership just says OK.