View Poll Results: Approve a mutual training swap?
Mutual training trades are harmless, I would never block one
65
90.28%
It endangers my seniority so I would block it
5
6.94%
I would reluctantly approve
2
2.78%
Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll
FDX - training trade
06-28-2015, 08:32 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,756
Aren't you just waiving passover pay for that one junior pilot going in front of you? It really shouldn't matter if they put anyone senior to you in front, should it? You weren't going to get passover pay for them anyways.
06-28-2015, 10:43 PM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: let it snow, let it snow, let it snow
Posts: 828
95% to 5%... When I last requested a trade i had 36 people to ask for permission. Ironically, a non-member and a Union officer were the only 2 that blocked. They both did change their mind and eventually approve. However, they both "offered" a 3-way trade so they could take the spot I had arranged to trade for. Swell guys.
06-29-2015, 06:02 AM
#14
Bourgeoisie
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: 787 SO
Posts: 616
Originally Posted by NoHaz
However, they both "offered" a 3-way trade so they could take the spot I had arranged to trade for. Swell guys.
If a brother or sister asks for a training trade (or a jumpseat), you let them. End of story.
And we wonder why we cannot get the company to play ball.
06-29-2015, 08:37 AM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: MD-11 Captain
Posts: 4,304
On a different but related subject ...
When I was a brand new MD-11 f/o I would call folks asking if they'd mind if I bumped their trip (I needed the hours, they got paid to stay home ... REALLY GOOD DEAL FOR THEM!).
I was surprised how many guys refused to let me BUMP them unless they got the associated per diem!*? At first I assumed they were joking ... I'd explain again that you get paid to stay home and I get the per diem and any extra pay associated with the trip. I'd explain that they are released from ALL duty assignments during that trip period unless they request to pick up another trip (and maybe end up getting paid 200% or 250%). In the end, probably half the guys said NO? YGTBFKM!
Hello? If anybody wants to BUMP me off ANY trip at ANY TIME, it would be nice if you asked before I left home to commute to MEM, you're welcome to keep the per diem!
When I was a brand new MD-11 f/o I would call folks asking if they'd mind if I bumped their trip (I needed the hours, they got paid to stay home ... REALLY GOOD DEAL FOR THEM!).
I was surprised how many guys refused to let me BUMP them unless they got the associated per diem!*? At first I assumed they were joking ... I'd explain again that you get paid to stay home and I get the per diem and any extra pay associated with the trip. I'd explain that they are released from ALL duty assignments during that trip period unless they request to pick up another trip (and maybe end up getting paid 200% or 250%). In the end, probably half the guys said NO? YGTBFKM!
Hello? If anybody wants to BUMP me off ANY trip at ANY TIME, it would be nice if you asked before I left home to commute to MEM, you're welcome to keep the per diem!
06-29-2015, 10:05 AM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 202
Here's my story FWIW. The last time I went to training (keyword being last), I was brand new at the company and held Mem/11FO on one of those super bids. Training letter came out and I was waiting a good year before I went. I sent multiple requests to senior pilots to swap trading dates but all were denied. After about 20 training letter revisions, I was within 2 weeks of going to training. Couldn't wait to get off the back of Boeing and make some real money. WRONG.
That's when all the purple nuggets rolled into town and the company trained ALL of them before the last few that had been waiting over a year. Different domicile meant no Passover pay. Why is this significant? Because during this second delay, we got our contract. Most of the purple nuggets were up and running by then and when the TA was finalized, guess who got the wide body FO bonus? Not me. 10k gone from bonus and a good ~50+ k gone from the extra 10 months of waiting.
To throw more salt in the wounds, the company was short of mem/11F pilots, so what did they do? They transferred a junior pilot from ANC into Memphis, of which they couldn't even hold the MEM FO seat! After the grievance was settled, SOME of the affected bunch received a whopping $150 settlement from the company.
The reason I'm re-telling this story is that there is the potential for the loss/gain of serious money. It's a definite gamble. For me and my only training experience, I lost thousands of dollars. For those that didn't swap training with me, well, let's just say they most definitely made out better than I. So buyer beware because we could be in a very similar predicament regarding a possible contract and the length of these training letters.
That's when all the purple nuggets rolled into town and the company trained ALL of them before the last few that had been waiting over a year. Different domicile meant no Passover pay. Why is this significant? Because during this second delay, we got our contract. Most of the purple nuggets were up and running by then and when the TA was finalized, guess who got the wide body FO bonus? Not me. 10k gone from bonus and a good ~50+ k gone from the extra 10 months of waiting.
To throw more salt in the wounds, the company was short of mem/11F pilots, so what did they do? They transferred a junior pilot from ANC into Memphis, of which they couldn't even hold the MEM FO seat! After the grievance was settled, SOME of the affected bunch received a whopping $150 settlement from the company.
The reason I'm re-telling this story is that there is the potential for the loss/gain of serious money. It's a definite gamble. For me and my only training experience, I lost thousands of dollars. For those that didn't swap training with me, well, let's just say they most definitely made out better than I. So buyer beware because we could be in a very similar predicament regarding a possible contract and the length of these training letters.
06-29-2015, 11:42 AM
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,756
^^I don't think that issue is relevant as far as swaps go. You should stay the same number on the training list, shouldn't you, if people swap? Yours was more a case of you would have been better off going earlier, as opposed to going later.
06-29-2015, 12:43 PM
#18
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: B-767 Captain
Posts: 53
I'm not sure I agree with the "automatically approve any training swap date request" (although I just approved one myself).
To me it's a matter of motive. Are you asking for an earlier date to get to the line earlier just to increase your income, or do you have a need beyond a financial benefit. It would be appropriate for the requestor to explain the reason for the trade, then you can decide whether to approve it or not.
To me it's a matter of motive. Are you asking for an earlier date to get to the line earlier just to increase your income, or do you have a need beyond a financial benefit. It would be appropriate for the requestor to explain the reason for the trade, then you can decide whether to approve it or not.
06-29-2015, 01:44 PM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 1,804
Originally Posted by champ42272
I'm not sure I agree with the "automatically approve any training swap date request" (although I just approved one myself).
To me it's a matter of motive. Are you asking for an earlier date to get to the line earlier just to increase your income, or do you have a need beyond a financial benefit. It would be appropriate for the requestor to explain the reason for the trade, then you can decide whether to approve it or not.
To me it's a matter of motive. Are you asking for an earlier date to get to the line earlier just to increase your income, or do you have a need beyond a financial benefit. It would be appropriate for the requestor to explain the reason for the trade, then you can decide whether to approve it or not.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
