Western global airlines
09-12-2018, 01:00 PM
#331
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Position: Heavy
Posts: 187
Originally Posted by Asiabound
Honestly, very competitive and you can probably go in as DEC. Bear in mind, you're very competitive for a Legacy, UPS, or Kalitta as well (if you have a four year degree).
As for our schedule, the company owns you for at minimum, 17, up to 20 days per month. All our work days are blocked together, no split lines. We can't bid actual flying anymore (we used to be able to bid the type of flying, AMC vs. LAN Cargo etc) only days you want to work. You will basically get the beginning, the middle, or the end of the month off. They can extend you by 3 days, up to 20 days total, which are marked on your bid awards for planning purposes (the days you could be extended I mean). Just plan to be gone the entire time, and you won't be surprised. In actuality, I have spent a fair amount of time in the slow season on home reserve, one of my fav parts of the job.
As for the actual flying it depends. If we do more than 1 leg and have to pick up cargo somewhere it usually takes 1-2 hours depending on how much they have to load, the paperwork, slot times, etc. When we do the UPS stuff in SDF, we can use the crew rest area and the sits are longer (as much as 6 hours) as we wait for the sort. We also have 1 leg days too where you fly for 10 hours and sit in Brazil or Africa for 5 days, or fly 12 hours to the sandbox and get 10 hours rest then fly back or anything in between. They give a lot of consideration to fatigue here, and in my exp min rest overnights are rare, I've never had a problem making a fatigue call.
In summary, you work 17 days ON/ 13 OFF, or 17 ON/14 OFF in a 31 day month, everything blocked together. W2 at the end of the year comes out to about the same as Atlas, at least until year 5 or so. Atlas and K4 have business class travel though, we don't.
Hope that helps, good luck in your decision. Can someone on the 747 PM me?
As for our schedule, the company owns you for at minimum, 17, up to 20 days per month. All our work days are blocked together, no split lines. We can't bid actual flying anymore (we used to be able to bid the type of flying, AMC vs. LAN Cargo etc) only days you want to work. You will basically get the beginning, the middle, or the end of the month off. They can extend you by 3 days, up to 20 days total, which are marked on your bid awards for planning purposes (the days you could be extended I mean). Just plan to be gone the entire time, and you won't be surprised. In actuality, I have spent a fair amount of time in the slow season on home reserve, one of my fav parts of the job.
As for the actual flying it depends. If we do more than 1 leg and have to pick up cargo somewhere it usually takes 1-2 hours depending on how much they have to load, the paperwork, slot times, etc. When we do the UPS stuff in SDF, we can use the crew rest area and the sits are longer (as much as 6 hours) as we wait for the sort. We also have 1 leg days too where you fly for 10 hours and sit in Brazil or Africa for 5 days, or fly 12 hours to the sandbox and get 10 hours rest then fly back or anything in between. They give a lot of consideration to fatigue here, and in my exp min rest overnights are rare, I've never had a problem making a fatigue call.
In summary, you work 17 days ON/ 13 OFF, or 17 ON/14 OFF in a 31 day month, everything blocked together. W2 at the end of the year comes out to about the same as Atlas, at least until year 5 or so. Atlas and K4 have business class travel though, we don't.
Hope that helps, good luck in your decision. Can someone on the 747 PM me?
09-12-2018, 03:16 PM
#332
Disinterested Third Party
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,998
Originally Posted by Colt45
The dude has zero heavy time, zero 121 experience, and you make the suggestion that he start as a DEC? I guess the FOs over at WGA are fine with sitting right seat for a while. ��
The "dude" said nothing about "heavy" time, but does have 3,000 hours turbojet PIC, and 1200 hours 121 SIC.
Originally Posted by Irishblackbird
I have 8000 hours, multiple types, and 3000 hours jet pic, 1200 121 sic, but no 121 pic.
Your response, on the contrary, is entirely useless and helpful to no one.
WGA and other supplemental ACMI's offer lower wages than legacy carriers; this is not news. WGA and other supplemental ACMI's have faster upgrades, smaller numbers of crew, and other differences than legacy or passenger carriers, and also different duty rules and regulations. Some supplemental carriers, WGA in this case, offer direct entry for some individuals. This appears to offend you.
Given your lack of a dog in the hunt or employment with WGA, is your view really of any significance?
You sneer at WGA F/O's and suggest that because WGA hires direct-entry captains, the F/O's must approve. What suggests to you that the F/O's have anything whatsoever to say about the company's decision to hire whom it will?
Or are you simply talking out your backside, as you appear to be?
Last edited by JohnBurke; 09-12-2018 at 03:26 PM.
09-12-2018, 04:04 PM
#333
VHR-very happily retired
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Retired
Posts: 1,409
Originally Posted by JohnBurke
Roll your eyes elsewhere. You have a reading comprehension problem.
The "dude" said nothing about "heavy" time, but does have 3,000 hours turbojet PIC, and 1200 hours 121 SIC.
The "dude" asked a legitimate question, respectfully, and was answered in kind by an employee. Your answer infers that you are not. The individual who answered the "dude" said nothing about a desire to sit in either seat, as it's irrelevant to the question and to the reply.
Your response, on the contrary, is entirely useless and helpful to no one.
WGA and other supplemental ACMI's offer lower wages than legacy carriers; this is not news. WGA and other supplemental ACMI's have faster upgrades, smaller numbers of crew, and other differences than legacy or passenger carriers, and also different duty rules and regulations. Some supplemental carriers, WGA in this case, offer direct entry for some individuals. This appears to offend you.
Given your lack of a dog in the hunt or employment with WGA, is your view really of any significance?
You sneer at WGA F/O's and suggest that because WGA hires direct-entry captains, the F/O's must approve. What suggests to you that the F/O's have anything whatsoever to say about the company's decision to hire whom it will?
Or are you simply talking out your backside, as you appear to be?
The "dude" said nothing about "heavy" time, but does have 3,000 hours turbojet PIC, and 1200 hours 121 SIC.
The "dude" asked a legitimate question, respectfully, and was answered in kind by an employee. Your answer infers that you are not. The individual who answered the "dude" said nothing about a desire to sit in either seat, as it's irrelevant to the question and to the reply.
Your response, on the contrary, is entirely useless and helpful to no one.
WGA and other supplemental ACMI's offer lower wages than legacy carriers; this is not news. WGA and other supplemental ACMI's have faster upgrades, smaller numbers of crew, and other differences than legacy or passenger carriers, and also different duty rules and regulations. Some supplemental carriers, WGA in this case, offer direct entry for some individuals. This appears to offend you.
Given your lack of a dog in the hunt or employment with WGA, is your view really of any significance?
You sneer at WGA F/O's and suggest that because WGA hires direct-entry captains, the F/O's must approve. What suggests to you that the F/O's have anything whatsoever to say about the company's decision to hire whom it will?
Or are you simply talking out your backside, as you appear to be?
09-12-2018, 08:33 PM
#334
Disinterested Third Party
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,998
Originally Posted by maxjet
To suggest that someone with no PIC wide-body or 121 time just jump in the left has me wondering who is talking out their backside
You don't know if he has PIC wide body or not, but he has 3000 turbojet PIC.
You have a reading comprehension problem, too, don't you?
09-13-2018, 05:36 AM
#335
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2018
Position: recliner
Posts: 142
Originally Posted by Colt45
The dude has zero heavy time, zero 121 experience, and you make the suggestion that he start as a DEC? I guess the FOs over at WGA are fine with sitting right seat for a while. ��
I try to help out other pilots to a fault, even at my own detriment. Though right now, upgrades are running about a year so DE CAs don't really make much of difference. That said, we aren't getting many qualified people for DE CA, anyways. I was just making a suggestion to the OP, not everyone can handle that. Truth is though, the MD-11 is an airplane like any other, heavy or not. The learning curve is steep, is we've had guys with minimal or no jet at all time come in and upgrade within a year. We have a CA right now with less than 3000TT or so I'm told. It's all about attitude, cognitive ability, and willingness to learn. We've had ex-military fighter pilots and CA's with thousands of TPIC in the MD-11 wash out also. The OP has some 121 time and 3000 TPIC isn't bad even if it's in a Learjet. No guarantees, but he's a got a decent shot, just a suggestion. We have had at least two DE CA's that I can think of with no prior heavy time.
Another hurdle for upgrade, is that we have a fair amount of ex corporate pilots coming in with no 121 time. Meaning, they need 1,000 hours right seat to be qualified (IRO time doesn't count towards this) and as I'm sure most of you know, ACMI isn't exactly a time building job. To one of your original comments, despite the movement we do have a fair amount of comfortable FO's that aren't in a rush to upgrade either. If we were furloughing or stopped hiring, DE CA's would be a different story. The way I say it is that when the time comes and I want to upgrade, I'll have that much more seniority.
09-13-2018, 05:40 AM
#336
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2018
Position: recliner
Posts: 142
Originally Posted by maxjet
Lighten up Francis. Colt’s point is well taken. You want a zero time DEC effecting your employment? I don’t mean seniority, I mean an accident and lots of you may be out of work for a while. To suggest that someone with no PIC wide-body or 121 time just jump in the left has me wondering who is talking out their backside
Last edited by Asiabound; 09-13-2018 at 06:18 AM.
09-13-2018, 06:34 PM
#337
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2017
Posts: 2,230
I’ve read it a few times on here that the MD-11 is a difficult plane to fly and can be unforgiving. Why is that? I’ve had my dad’s friend (who was a CA in that frame for many years) tell me that the MD-11 is a pilot’s plane and extremely fun to fly. Anyone care to share?
09-13-2018, 07:33 PM
#338
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 692
Originally Posted by SoFloFlyer
I’ve read it a few times on here that the MD-11 is a difficult plane to fly and can be unforgiving. Why is that? I’ve had my dad’s friend (who was a CA in that frame for many years) tell me that the MD-11 is a pilot’s plane and extremely fun to fly. Anyone care to share?
...in a nutshell.
09-14-2018, 01:01 AM
#339
On Reserve
Joined APC: Sep 2018
Posts: 23
How important is to be current
Originally Posted by zerozero
I'm not an MD driver, but my understanding is, the fuselage is larger than the DC10, but the elevator/horiz stab is smaller for fuel efficiency. At certain times crews are left without enough control authority.
...in a nutshell.
...in a nutshell.
But never heard back from any one .
Any info would appreciated .
Thank you
09-14-2018, 02:37 AM
#340
Down 4 Green Lights
Joined APC: May 2012
Position: MD-11 FO
Posts: 169
The application selection system is neither robust nor complex. It’s an email inbox and it’s scope only reaches down as far as the person is willing to dig through the stack. Keep applying often and when they dig into it hopefully you’re near the top.
DEC are still going on as needed but don’t expect it without significant experience in the theaters western operates.
Upgrades are still around a year and success is completely based on multiple levels of evaluation and recommendation. They are trying to upgrade based on seniority but there is a high washout rate. If you’re asked to upgrade, SERIOUSLY ASK YOURSELF AND MAKE SURE YOU ARE READY. It’s a put up shut up moment. They will give you everything you need but will not hold your hand through upgrade. The guys who are sitting at the top of the FO list have either tried and not made it, been passed up by others feedback, are not qualified, or just don’t want to. The 11 is a different animal and they make you take it into less than nice places. Regardless, god bless the MD.
All said it was a great and an invaluable experience. It was an difficult job but I loved it. The experiences were great and the people were even better.
Western has had people leave for UPS, American, FedEx, Delta, Southwest, Spirit, Jet Blue, Corp, regional, Kalitta, Atlas, Emirates, Etihad... point is it’s what you make of it.
If you’re negative or that guy... do the Western Pilot group and yourself (in that order) a favor and look elsewhere.
DEC are still going on as needed but don’t expect it without significant experience in the theaters western operates.
Upgrades are still around a year and success is completely based on multiple levels of evaluation and recommendation. They are trying to upgrade based on seniority but there is a high washout rate. If you’re asked to upgrade, SERIOUSLY ASK YOURSELF AND MAKE SURE YOU ARE READY. It’s a put up shut up moment. They will give you everything you need but will not hold your hand through upgrade. The guys who are sitting at the top of the FO list have either tried and not made it, been passed up by others feedback, are not qualified, or just don’t want to. The 11 is a different animal and they make you take it into less than nice places. Regardless, god bless the MD.
All said it was a great and an invaluable experience. It was an difficult job but I loved it. The experiences were great and the people were even better.
Western has had people leave for UPS, American, FedEx, Delta, Southwest, Spirit, Jet Blue, Corp, regional, Kalitta, Atlas, Emirates, Etihad... point is it’s what you make of it.
If you’re negative or that guy... do the Western Pilot group and yourself (in that order) a favor and look elsewhere.
Originally Posted by Dragon Jet
One of my friend with over 6000 Hrs and 5000 multi 4000 Jet and 2000 Hrs PIC corporate jet with 2 Type Rating applied a few times .
But never heard back from any one .
Any info would appreciated .
Thank you
But never heard back from any one .
Any info would appreciated .
Thank you
Last edited by Muredhawk; 09-14-2018 at 03:00 AM.
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