time to build 1000 hr in 121
 

How long will it take to fly the 1000 hours required for upgrade? ATP license but zero 121 flt time
Thanks

About 18 months after you get a line. Possibly faster if you live in base

As usual, it depends on a lot of factors.

I hit the line early this year. Did 4 months on reserve at roughly 50 hours a month, or 200 hours. I then bid min credit at 70 hours in order to get (and keep) a line. I've flown on average 60-65 hours a month despite having a line due to wx cancellations. As a result I'm figuring 15 months to get the time to upgrade.

That said, people coming here recently have not been flying as much because the FO:CA ratio isn't ideal and more people are stuck on reserve because growth is hampered by a lack of captains. I don't see anything improving in the near term as the mothership turns down flying a few notches for the winter.

I suppose the light at the end of the tunnel is that we're slated to begin contract negotiations this month. If we can sign a good contract later this year I think more people will flock here, particularly if they continue to offer the $50K DEC bonus, and that should allow growth to continue and more people to get lines.

Word around town is less than 15 hours a month for FOs on reserve, and as the previous poster said, will not be improving anytime in the near future.

If captains are the limiting factor, perhaps captain seniority should be determined by upgrade date rather than hire date.

It would undoubtedly encourage a lot of senior FOs to move up.

It’d be better to do forced upgrades like Southwest. Or something along the lines like you have 1-2 years after your seniority can hold it. At my previous employer I held off for a year to really enjoy my base seniority. It was nice being number 3 out of 120 or so. From the chief the other day he said come April a lot of guys will have time to upgrade.

Yikes!!!!

I guess the silver lining is that I’ll be able to finish my online 4 yr degree sooner.

Not to drift off centerline too much, but can anyone give me advice about whether I should go with Thomas Edison State or Utah Valley?

Looking for which school would award me the most credit for ATP and already having a 2 yr deg. Thanks

There's no one eligible to upgrade that hasn't upgraded. There's no reason to not upgrade, you'll get paid more and have an equivalent schedule as long as you're not a DEC.

Not a solution and not necessary either. As someone else said earlier, every eligible FO has upgraded because there's already a huge incentive to upgrade -- the pay differential between FO and CA.

The problem is, as usual, not a shortage of pilots but a shortage of pay. Captains have little incentive to come to C5 as it's now one of the lowest paid gigs among the 121 regionals. The $50K DEC bonus is a bandaid over a gaping chest wound. The sooner management realizes this and increases pay across the board, but particularly for captains, the sooner we'll be able to attract the necessary talent.

thanks for the info

I would love to be a fly on the wall at the recruiting events. Apply now to C5, we offer the following:
- Want long reserve time with little to no flying for FOs? You’re in luck! You can join the ranks of more than half the FOs here!
- Why look for an airline that is giving pay raises, when you can join one that will slash the pay of half the FOs in a couple months.
- Flow or preferential interview, no, we have the nonexistent CPP.
- Looking to get bumped off flights by that new day one mainline intern, we have that! You are lower priority than all mainline, no matter how senior you are! Vacation passes..What are those?

Luckily the crews are awesome, and you will have a blast when you do fly! Hopefully the Union can pull off a stunning victory with the contract like the 2016 election! #MakeC5GreatAgain

Just out of curiosity what makes you think you will sign a contract a few months after it opens. Usually it takes a long time. Just wondering because I heard others say this too that it could be a quick one.

The last one was very quick. I think people are hoping the company is going to roll over and give us what we want (especially in the current environment).

I doubt it's going to be fast or friendly. If it was a simple pay increase, the company would happily sign industry leading pay rates for the PR value. But the QoL improvements are going to be infinitely harder to negotiate.

You're killing me! All true though. Maybe waiting for a later class date somewhere else would have been a better idea.... I hope things improve here. While we do have some great people working here, that doesn't pay the bills. Contract negotiations need to make this crystal clear.

The last one was quick because C5 was shriveling and dying. There's no threat of that now, and plenty of new hires. There is zero motivation for the company to not drag out negotiations.

Well when you factor 50% of the FOs will have their pay reduced, and other regionals offering better QoL, pay, and DEC bonuses, it wouldn’t be surprising to see a large portion of them move on elsewhere. Then who’s going to replace them? I doubt the FOs on the bottom of the reserve list are going to stick out flying 10 hours or so a month, when they are watching their peers flying significantly more at other places. Plus, we are only fighting for industry standard items, not anything game changing or making us stand out. So what incentive would the company have to hold out past the LOA expiring?

Forced upgrade is an absolutely stupid idea. If an FO doesn't feel ready, the company shouldn't be able to force a potential checkride on someone which could result in a failure. What you are advocating could be career suicide for you fellow union brothers and sisters. God knows that we have enough FOs that shouldn't be upgrading at the first possible chance.....

Zero motivation? Hardly.

Due to the timing and volume of FOs hired, as well as the pathetic state of the current contract, the only reprieve the company may enjoy will come in 14-18 months when all the FOs hired in the last few months start to upgrade -- assuming they don't bail for greener pastures before then. And with the bottom FOs getting at most 10-15 hours a month and a few starting to fail to consolidate, I wouldn't blame them for leaving.

If a new contract doesn't arrive soon we will continue to lose CAs and not attract enough new ones to replace them. That will make the CA:FO ratio worse and lead to cancellations and 300%, neither of which the company (and our mainline owner) will tolerate for very long. In short, we are set up for another "extinction event" and if the company doesn't get on the ball and agree to an acceptable contract it's a foregone conclusion of when, not if, the proverbial turd hits the cooling appliance.

Losing CAs is the nature of the game right now. It's where you lose the CAs to that shows how good your contract/culture is. If you're losing them to other regionals, then you have problems. No CA should think that the grass is greener coming in as a new hire at another regional vs keeping their seniority here.

Attracting street CAs is a totally different ballgame.

Nearly every CA with 3+ years of service I fly with here has one foot out the door and apps out, and most say they have no interest in becoming a LCA or sim instructor despite the decent schedules and pay overrides. They just want out. That is quite telling, especially considering the current financial incentives for CAs (nearly daily 200%).

That said, I've also flown with a ton of DECs from a variety of companies, some even with widebody experience, and they're happy to be flying with a line and making bank (for a regional, anyway).