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Old 04-27-2018, 05:22 AM
  #241  
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Originally Posted by Fredturbo View Post
12B in stock buy backs and sustained profitability are also highly unusual. Times, they are a different. Keep thinking in the past, however. Hope you don’t invest that way.
You seem to think pay is directly tied to the profitability of the company. That is simply not correct. Delta currently enjoys a profit margin that is pretty much average for most companies. That margin in this industry can vanish in the blink of a eye. I have lived it doing exactly that. The process is what determines how long a contract will take and frankly the process sucks for us. It drives contracts to a industry matching plus maybe a percent or two more solution.
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Old 04-27-2018, 05:42 AM
  #242  
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Originally Posted by Han Solo View Post
This would be true if DAL couldn't put butts in seats, but I don't think this will be an issue for C19. Think about it, does JB or Spirit have a hard time filling their classes? Both companies have significantly substandard pay compared to us and I don't think either one is having trouble hiring pilots. There are things the company wants/needs but filling new hire classes probably won't be a tick mark in our favor during the next round of negotiations. Just a guess.



Retro is not guaranteed. If we go 3 years there's no way retro is part of the signing bonus. Even with retro pay it's like the people who get big tax returns. They've given the gov't an interest free loan for a year which is in the gov't favor.
Retro is on the table until we take it off the table....
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Old 04-27-2018, 05:48 AM
  #243  
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Originally Posted by TED74 View Post
Is there ever a time not to?
No. But we all secretly want ours to be better.
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Old 04-27-2018, 05:54 AM
  #244  
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Originally Posted by Han Solo View Post
This would be true if DAL couldn't put butts in seats, but I don't think this will be an issue for C19. Think about it, does JB or Spirit have a hard time filling their classes? Both companies have significantly substandard pay compared to us and I don't think either one is having trouble hiring pilots. There are things the company wants/needs but filling new hire classes probably won't be a tick mark in our favor during the next round of negotiations. Just a guess.
I would agree unless start getting dragged in the 3 year negotiation. Then the movement becomes problematic, at least to the point of being in our favor.
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Old 04-27-2018, 05:56 AM
  #245  
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Originally Posted by Gooner View Post
No. But we all secretly want ours to be better.
If their contract is signed before ours, I want theirs to be better.
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Old 04-27-2018, 06:43 AM
  #246  
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Originally Posted by crewdawg View Post
If their contract is signed before ours, I want theirs to be better.
You want their contract to be way better!
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Old 05-03-2018, 07:56 AM
  #247  
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
I find your line of thinking very interesting. What issues do you think the new demographic will pursue that will **** you over?
They aren't going to care about anything that would make us whole for past theft. It is realistic.
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Old 05-03-2018, 07:57 AM
  #248  
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Originally Posted by tunes View Post
Retro is on the table until we take it off the table....
While true, it's liklihood diminishes with each passing year. Of course time/value of money is a unicorn, right?
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Old 05-03-2018, 09:04 AM
  #249  
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Originally Posted by JamesBond View Post
They aren't going to care about anything that would make us whole for past theft. It is realistic.
I happen to think you're wrong. I think a vast majority of the new demographic support the right effort to correct the past theft. Any cost for such effort needs to be squarely on the shoulders of one individual at the company making $13mil/ yr who personally had a role bringing about the current DB disposition. If anyone is ****ing you over, I'd say there's a short list of people that doesn't include the new demographic.
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Old 05-03-2018, 10:42 AM
  #250  
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Originally Posted by trustbutverify View Post
I happen to think you're wrong. I think a vast majority of the new demographic support the right effort to correct the past theft. Any cost for such effort needs to be squarely on the shoulders of one individual at the company making $13mil/ yr who personally had a role bringing about the current DB disposition. If anyone is ****ing you over, I'd say there's a short list of people that doesn't include the new demographic.
Not if it is perceived to be at their expense. And I am not saying anyone is ****ing me over. I am saying that the chances of us getting any kind of significant restoration (whole) is slim to nil. And I don't blame the new demographic. This happens all the time, every contract. Placing blame on management is politically correct, but does nothing to solve the problem. To make the DZers whole, somebody newer will have to take less. It's math. It's not envy, or castigation. It is just reality. But we will see who's right come contract time.
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