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JamesBond 12-19-2020 11:59 AM


Originally Posted by 123494 (Post 3172298)
I've never messed with options before. I've strictly been a long-term investor focused on good ETFs and a few individual stocks (~40 years until retirement).

How did you guys learn about options? Any recommended reading/videos? I'm planning on continuing my long-term plan but would like to throw some "fun money" into something else.

Start by trading covered calls. You cannot lose money. (Standing by for the arguments about that, but I will win them). After you learn to do covered calls, try cash secured puts. Then branch out into naked calls and puts. I think I already said it, but all that exotic crap you hear about.. condors, butterflies, straddles, strangles... is a waste of time and money. And the best thing I ever read about options is that you never make money buying anything. Find the right horse, and it can be a very lucrative ride

dyodd, ymmv, etc etc

JamesBond 12-19-2020 12:06 PM


Originally Posted by LandGreen2 (Post 3172617)
Are any of you using the Snider Method? I remember there were quite a few Delta pilots doing this. For the middle age crowd a little more risk wary I remember them saying it was a little like hitting singles and doubles consistently. No home runs though?!?!

Oh no please don't bring that in here.... Start another thread. Ever see Good Will Hunting? Why pay a lot of money for something you can learn for free at the public library?

mispoken 12-19-2020 12:11 PM


Originally Posted by JamesBond (Post 3172688)
Start by trading covered calls. You cannot lose money. (Standing by for the arguments about that, but I will win them). After you learn to do covered calls, try cash secured puts. Then branch out into naked calls and puts. I think I already said it, but all that exotic crap you hear about.. condors, butterflies, straddles, strangles... is a waste of time and money. And the best thing I ever read about options is that you never make money buying anything. Find the right horse, and it can be a very lucrative ride

dyodd, ymmv, etc etc

I thoroughly disagree with you here, saying that spreads are a waste of time and money. Assuming you understand them and know how to manage them they’re far more capital efficient than your typical covered call. If I can buy a cheap wing for say, .25 and preserve $2-$3k in buying power, this allows me to do a lot more with my buying power versus devoting all to a few trades. The key is trading small and trading often to tip the probabilities in your favor.

however, I prefer naked puts to maximize my premium and for management purposes. It’s much easier to keep rolling a naked put and collecting premium as you go versus a spread. The more spreads, the more difficult to manage.

Trip7 12-19-2020 12:19 PM


Originally Posted by TegridyFarms (Post 3172601)
I’ll respectfully disagree. https://www.computerworld.com/articl...s-history.html



I remember when AMZN has its first full profitable year. I spent an entire semester of college in business school discussing AMZN vs WMT. Logistics. Balance sheets. Supply. Demand. Everything. Amazon would never ever ever ever exceed WMT. AMZN was around $45-50 at that time. We all had the same consensus. I watched for two years using the same little tools and everything you had in your post. Amazon was over priced. Revenue wasn’t enough, wasn’t sustainable, etc.



That was at $50-200 a share. Now $3,229 a share. Insane.



Same concept with Netflix. The biggest effing fail of my life was listening to some zacks or morning star garbage about how a company that mailed DVDs was overvalued at $40.



Not even a decade later my small investment would be worth $600,000 had I kept that money in NFLX.



Bottom line is—do your own due diligence and look at the future, study a company, and know the financials behind what they’re doing. Don’t give a rip what some widget on a website says about a stocks share price.



Trip 7–I have TSLA. I had 68 shares. Then reverse split this summer announced. 5:1. $17,700 is what I paid for that. That investment is now worth a small house.



Same with AAPL. That thought process that you presented isn’t a blanket approach.

I hear ya. Story stocks do have a track record of providing life changing returns provided you aren't left holding the bag when the story ends up not being as optimistic as the price. Also, IMO it's alittle bit of a dangerous precedent to compare TSLA and Amazon. Even in its early days Amazon had a track record of positive cashflow from Operations. Will be interesting to see how the next decade shapes up

Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk

Gunfighter 12-19-2020 12:45 PM

Question for the Options Crowd
 
With a hypothetical play portfolio of $100,000:
-How many positions would you hold?
-Do you keep them equal in size?
-How far out would you be buying/selling premium?
-How often are you trading in/out of positions?
-How much time are you spending per day/week/month managing the positions?

biggun 12-19-2020 12:49 PM


Originally Posted by freezingflyboy (Post 2594361)
I do the rental property thing. It's not exciting or glamorous but it is easy (most of the time) and having someone else pay for you to build equity is great. I use a managmemt company which eats into profits some but then all I have to do is cash a check each month.

How has the C19 impacted your rental property business? Is it a fulltime rental or a vacation property?

Trip7 12-19-2020 01:12 PM


Originally Posted by Gunfighter (Post 3172706)
With a hypothetical play portfolio of $100,000:

-How many positions would you hold?

-Do you keep them equal in size?

-How far out would you be buying/selling premium?

-How often are you trading in/out of positions?

-How much time are you spending per day/week/month managing the positions?

-15 positions

-Equal Weight

-No options aside from maybe long SPY put for hedging.

-Trading in and out of maybe 25% of positions(mostly when stock reaches intrinsic value or above)

-1 hour a week browsing company and industry updates via weekly email alerts. At least 30 mins per stock when Annual Reports drop

Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk

TegridyFarms 12-19-2020 05:41 PM


Originally Posted by Trip7 (Post 3172699)
I hear ya. Story stocks do have a track record of providing life changing returns provided you aren't left holding the bag when the story ends up not being as optimistic as the price. Also, IMO it's alittle bit of a dangerous precedent to compare TSLA and Amazon. Even in its early days Amazon had a track record of positive cashflow from Operations. Will be interesting to see how the next decade shapes up

Sent from my SM-N986U using Tapatalk

Not following the TSLA cash flow argument:

https://www.thestreet.com/investing/tesla-gains-after-reporting-strong-cash-flows-7-key-takeaways-earnings-elon-musk

Not comparing TSLA and AMZN (two completely different industries). I am just saying that it isn’t right to say that TSLA is over valued at its current SP.

LandGreen2 12-19-2020 06:03 PM


Originally Posted by JamesBond (Post 3172690)
Oh no please don't bring that in here.... Start another thread. Ever see Good Will Hunting? Why pay a lot of money for something you can learn for free at the public library?

one of my fav movies! Ok where do the rookies start with covered call education? Is there an outline, book, reputable YouTube out there to start the education ? Thx


Note: NM I found replies earlier Talking about tastytrades. Illl check that out

Seneca Pilot 12-19-2020 06:34 PM


Originally Posted by LandGreen2 (Post 3172805)
one of my fav movies! Ok where do the rookies start with covered call education? Is there an outline, book, reputable YouTube out there to start the education ? Thx


Note: NM I found replies earlier Talking about tastytrades. Illl check that out


Tasty Trade is good.

Covered calls are really simple. Option contracts are 100 shares. You can do weekly expirations and monthly expirations. You pick a stock you like, buy 100 shares and then you can sell calls against your shares.

Example:

Stock XYZ you buy for 100$ and sell 120 calls against it. Calls sell for .40cents and expire in 8 days. You collect 40 dollars and if the stock is below 120 on expiration you keep the 40 and the stock and then rinse and repeat. If the stock closes above 120 then the option buyer has the right to call the stock away and pays you 120 per share. You made 20 per share and keep the collected premium. You could lose money on the stock but you can't lose money on the option. The option premium acts as a small hedge as you can lose on the stock as long as it is less than the premium. The premium has the effect of lowering your cost basis.

This is a Buffet play, he sells a lot of calls against his positions. I have sold calls against my positions in my self directed IRA for decades and it juices the returns without increasing risk or using up capital.


Edit: Almost forgot. This is not trade advice or a solicitation. Seek advice from a qualified investment advisor. Past performance is not a guarantee of future gains. There is risk in trading levered products and only trade with risk capital. ETC. ETC. ETC.


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