Pay Banding in C2019...
10-20-2018, 07:31 AM
#221
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
Originally Posted by Baradium
Do you even know the answer to this question? Didn't you say it was too complicated to calculate earlier?
And yes, we are paid an "effective rate" to fly the airplane. ADM, work rules, and yes, profit sharing, are all part of our compensation package. Everything is calculated off of an "hourly rate" but that is not how we're actually paid to fly the plane. To use your own words, you don't seem to get that.
I've actually flown an airplane for a company with no work rules and simply an hourly rate before. I promise you the difference in how you are actually paid to fly the airplane is substantial. And that is why you can't arbitrarily say they are paid more to fly the airplane if you ignore everything else in the contract. Even our much ballyhooed requirement that we have 2ca/2fo pairings instead of 1ca/3fo is worth a lot as you are turning FO positions into higher paying CA positions.
So my question for you is, would you trade all of our work rules and profit sharing for United's rate?
Also, if you use [/quote.] and [quote.] (without the period) when inserting text it will make it easier to respond to everything you say.
And yes, we are paid an "effective rate" to fly the airplane. ADM, work rules, and yes, profit sharing, are all part of our compensation package. Everything is calculated off of an "hourly rate" but that is not how we're actually paid to fly the plane. To use your own words, you don't seem to get that.
I've actually flown an airplane for a company with no work rules and simply an hourly rate before. I promise you the difference in how you are actually paid to fly the airplane is substantial. And that is why you can't arbitrarily say they are paid more to fly the airplane if you ignore everything else in the contract. Even our much ballyhooed requirement that we have 2ca/2fo pairings instead of 1ca/3fo is worth a lot as you are turning FO positions into higher paying CA positions.
So my question for you is, would you trade all of our work rules and profit sharing for United's rate?
Also, if you use [/quote.] and [quote.] (without the period) when inserting text it will make it easier to respond to everything you say.
10-20-2018, 10:20 AM
#222
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,522
Originally Posted by Baradium
Except they aren't offering fast and free internet either.
We offer streaming on personal devices in addition to seatback entertainment... how many people do you see actually using the streaming? I can tell you I see many more using the screens.
We offer streaming on personal devices in addition to seatback entertainment... how many people do you see actually using the streaming? I can tell you I see many more using the screens.
I disagree that the long term future revolves around setback screens. People use them now because the wifi is slow, unreliable, spotty and in may cases expensive, while the screens are "free". Yet even those are temperamental with inferior interfaces that border on obsolete even in newer planes.
As the novelty continues to blur into the commodity, simply nothing will beat one's own device. In seat stuff (for coach at least) is like new car "nav". Obsolete the day it rolls off the showroom floor and it only goes downhill from there, with one's own device being vastly superior from the first moment of its use.
10-20-2018, 10:52 AM
#223
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: Kickin’ Back
Posts: 6,971
Originally Posted by Baradium
Do you even know the answer to this question? Didn't you say it was too complicated to calculate earlier?
And yes, we are paid an "effective rate" to fly the airplane. ADM, work rules, and yes, profit sharing, are all part of our compensation package. Everything is calculated off of an "hourly rate" but that is not how we're actually paid to fly the plane. To use your own words, you don't seem to get that.
I've actually flown an airplane for a company with no work rules and simply an hourly rate before. I promise you the difference in how you are actually paid to fly the airplane is substantial. And that is why you can't arbitrarily say they are paid more to fly the airplane if you ignore everything else in the contract. Even our much ballyhooed requirement that we have 2ca/2fo pairings instead of 1ca/3fo is worth a lot as you are turning FO positions into higher paying CA positions.
So my question for you is, would you trade all of our work rules and profit sharing for United's rate?
Also, if you use [/quote.] and [quote.] (without the period) when inserting text it will make it easier to respond to everything you say.
I’m done with this discussion any way. You want to make it into something bigger than a simple X is greater than Y, which is all I’m trying to say.
Denny
10-20-2018, 11:06 AM
#224
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,273
Originally Posted by gloopy
That's because we're not where we need to be yet. The wifi is still in its infancy. Heck, so is the smartphone/tablet for that matter. The whole industry (the way we see it with the zombie hoards screen staring 24/7) is well under one decade old.
I disagree that the long term future revolves around setback screens. People use them now because the wifi is slow, unreliable, spotty and in may cases expensive, while the screens are "free". Yet even those are temperamental with inferior interfaces that border on obsolete even in newer planes.
As the novelty continues to blur into the commodity, simply nothing will beat one's own device. In seat stuff (for coach at least) is like new car "nav". Obsolete the day it rolls off the showroom floor and it only goes downhill from there, with one's own device being vastly superior from the first moment of its use.
I disagree that the long term future revolves around setback screens. People use them now because the wifi is slow, unreliable, spotty and in may cases expensive, while the screens are "free". Yet even those are temperamental with inferior interfaces that border on obsolete even in newer planes.
As the novelty continues to blur into the commodity, simply nothing will beat one's own device. In seat stuff (for coach at least) is like new car "nav". Obsolete the day it rolls off the showroom floor and it only goes downhill from there, with one's own device being vastly superior from the first moment of its use.
10-20-2018, 01:00 PM
#226
Sick of whiners
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Position: 767 VEOP
Posts: 507
Originally Posted by sailingfun
The streaming is excellent. No problems with video quality or speed. WiFi is terrible unless the flight is empty.
"The streaming is excellent. No problems with video quality or speed.
Fixed it for you
.
10-20-2018, 03:00 PM
#227
:-)
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,339
Originally Posted by gloopy
That's because we're not where we need to be yet. The wifi is still in its infancy. Heck, so is the smartphone/tablet for that matter. The whole industry (the way we see it with the zombie hoards screen staring 24/7) is well under one decade old.
I disagree that the long term future revolves around setback screens. People use them now because the wifi is slow, unreliable, spotty and in may cases expensive, while the screens are "free". Yet even those are temperamental with inferior interfaces that border on obsolete even in newer planes.
As the novelty continues to blur into the commodity, simply nothing will beat one's own device. In seat stuff (for coach at least) is like new car "nav". Obsolete the day it rolls off the showroom floor and it only goes downhill from there, with one's own device being vastly superior from the first moment of its use.
I disagree that the long term future revolves around setback screens. People use them now because the wifi is slow, unreliable, spotty and in may cases expensive, while the screens are "free". Yet even those are temperamental with inferior interfaces that border on obsolete even in newer planes.
As the novelty continues to blur into the commodity, simply nothing will beat one's own device. In seat stuff (for coach at least) is like new car "nav". Obsolete the day it rolls off the showroom floor and it only goes downhill from there, with one's own device being vastly superior from the first moment of its use.
10-20-2018, 03:27 PM
#228
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2015
Position: A350 Both
Posts: 7,292
Originally Posted by Mesabah
When/If SpaceX completes the BFR, they plan to launch a 14,000+, 1 Gbit satellite based internet service. At that time, seatback IFE would become obsolete to personal devices. The airlines might be better off simply installing an iPad into the back of the seat.
10-20-2018, 06:21 PM
#229
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2006
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 2,370
Originally Posted by JamesBond
Interesting thought. What about the Delta 1 and Premium select Screens? I highly doubt that everybody up there wants to boot up a laptop to watch a movie. I have seen more children in Delta 1 in the last year than ever. They aren't gonna watch on laptops or iPads. Not for $6K a pop.
We also have some movies in the IFE that are not available otherwise outside of theaters. I'd also like to add in the live TV we have. I've seen people put CNN or Fox News on the IFE while they're doing something with their computer for work.
10-20-2018, 07:31 PM
#230
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,522
Originally Posted by sailingfun
The streaming is excellent. No problems with video quality or speed. WiFi is terrible unless the flight is empty.
Or we can keep flying hundreds of individual obsolete monitors all around forever.
Maybe its still somehow cheaper though. I don't know how it could be other than provider fees I guess. But we're paying that now anyway so who knows.
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