Deleted for lack of interest. NO to any fairy tale of a restored DB. Quit wasting time chasing fantasies.

It's one thing to be aware of past contracts and use that knowledge to join the efforts to secure an even better one. It's a complete lie to somehow claim ownership of "sacrifices" you never were even around to make.

Might as well claim how much you sacrificed in WWII, when it was your grandfather that fought there.

I was using hyperbole. No way it will happen. However, it would be a drop in the bucket compared to the wasted buy backs. And you young guys shouldn't pay for it. Corporate will do the same to you if they can.

Of course corporate would do the same to younger guys.... that's my point. Why waste one nanosecond of time pursuing a fairy tale of a DB plan, when mgmt would either terminate it again, or use the threat of termination against us? Fool me twice and all that.

Sheesh.

You been here long enough to hear force majeure? Oil hits 200 a barrel and feet will hit the street, senior muffs will be flying green slips. It can work both ways.

Hey Buck... 2001. NWA. Furloughed 5years and 10 months. Most of Delta 2007 hires are senior to me. I don’t have any pension. I was too junior. That good enough for you? Am I worthy to say what I said? When were you hired since we’re on the playground comparing our pricks...

Oh yes. 22 years. I'm not sure what your point is. Maybe we even agree on something, or perhaps not. When guys were furloughed the words green slip were not in my vocabulary.

Buck... God man. You sure are a jerk. Just because I joined this forum in 2014 doesnt mean I was hired then. So being a complete jerk and ASSuming the same for you, I’d be careful... you’re still on probation newb....

That good for you man. I sacrificed a lot. The chips fell. I love Delta. But I am also not patient for games. I am patient for the right contract though. I voted the Donatelli turd down. Did you? We’re you even here? You sure do jump to conclusions fast. Chill out cowboy.

I'll bet the boys on the 4th floor are laughing their collective arses off at this thread.
Unity.
Nothing else matters.

The entire purpose of any company is to take the money from the shareholders and generate a profit on their investment.....they kind of have to pay the shareholders their profits. It's how an actual business works.

I ran my own business before joining Delta, and if I had to choose between paying my investors back or trying to make my employees the heightest paid wokers in the industry, I think you can guess which one I actually did.

You can't just say "they should be able to pay"....prove it!

Here are the numbers I came up with, my bar napkin very basic assumptions keeping everything in today's dollars to KISS:

- I used the retirement numbers per year from APC
- I used the heightest current pay rate (A-350 at $354 per hour and 1,000 hours of pay for the year. This equals $354,000, so 60% FAE would be $212,400.
- I assumed each pilot works all the way to 65, then lives for 25 years. So the "worst" year for the company in terms of amount paid out per year would be year 25: its the last year before the first round of guys die, and its the first round of payments to the guys just starting out....that year alone the company would have to pay $2.5B just in pensions, or 1/2 of the profit we made this year.

During the first 25 years, the company would pay out $37.5B in retirement payments, and that's just to the folks on the list right now for the next 25 years....no retro for those already retired.

If the company has to make those payments, then what aren't we getting....we aren't getting new planes paid for in cash...we aren't getting a new SEA, or a new LGA.

Or we would get those things by taking on huge amounts of debt...in which case, we become just like the financial sh!tshow that is AAL or UAL currently.

If the company stays strong, they stay in business, and if they stay in business, then we all continue to get paychecks...I like that!

I don't want to come across as being non-sympathetic to what happend to everyone....even though I've only been with the company two years, I have read up on my history best I could....mergers, bankrupcy, 9/11, age 60-65, furloughs, concessions to try to prevent bankrupcy....I get it, the guys that got hired at the "wrong" time got the short end of the stick at every down turn....some very sh!tty times indeed!

But you can't walk into the board room and say "Make all deadzoners whole" when no one can define who a deadzoner is, and what dollar amounts makes that person whole in their eyes.

Show me how the company keeps it current strong financial footing while making needed upgrades and buying new airplanes AND using 50% of profits to pay pensions....I just don't see the math working out.