Covid shot and NFLY
#21
I guess you missed the good things we got from that negotiation.
“In exchange for this relief, the LOA secures protections for pilots who utilize sick leave or are quarantined as a result of the COVID-19, reintroduces an improved LOA #2 - Special Incenve Line, addresses Military Leave of Absence (MLOA) considerations, and finalizes an additional LOA which contains improvements to MOU #16-04 - Fitness Review Board (FRB).”
“In exchange for this relief, the LOA secures protections for pilots who utilize sick leave or are quarantined as a result of the COVID-19, reintroduces an improved LOA #2 - Special Incenve Line, addresses Military Leave of Absence (MLOA) considerations, and finalizes an additional LOA which contains improvements to MOU #16-04 - Fitness Review Board (FRB).”
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: Left seat of a little plane
Posts: 2,396
You missed all the pilots taking them because Ed nixed the idea almost as soon as they were agreed to by the company negotiators--"optics" to the non-cons and all that. You know, the move that almost everyone on these boards (correctly) vilified? Have you already forgotten? Kind of an important thing to remember.
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 2,544
We already had sick time available. All this did was partially remove the "abuse" nuisance crap for Covid19, which was probably more relief for the company than the pilots. And SILs were a great bait and switch move. MLOA is governed by USERRA the union and the company have no say. FRB was a joke anyway with 95+% paid fitness issues.
This is YUUUUUGE stretch, even for you.
This is YUUUUUGE stretch, even for you.
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,261
We already had sick time available. All this did was partially remove the "abuse" nuisance crap for Covid19, which was probably more relief for the company than the pilots. And SILs were a great bait and switch move. MLOA is governed by USERRA the union and the company have no say. FRB was a joke anyway with 95+% paid fitness issues.
This is YUUUUUGE stretch, even for you.
This is YUUUUUGE stretch, even for you.
#25
You missed all the pilots taking them because Ed nixed the idea almost as soon as they were agreed to by the company negotiators--"optics" to the non-cons and all that. You know, the move that almost everyone on these boards (correctly) vilified? Have you already forgotten? Kind of an important thing to remember.
I think the pilots correctly saw that the slowdown in flying would be temporary and SIL would help a lot more than a huge displacement, training and reinstatement.
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,261
No, I remember it well - I was bringing it up to Sailing to point out that the "SIL win" from that LOA never happened. I know he cut and pasted but he should of noted that the SIL never happened.
I think the pilots correctly saw that the slowdown in flying would be temporary and SIL would help a lot more than a huge displacement, training and reinstatement.
I think the pilots correctly saw that the slowdown in flying would be temporary and SIL would help a lot more than a huge displacement, training and reinstatement.
#29
Lets not give 60 days of SIL’s mythical status. It was a fairly small cost saving and the union specifically stated the company was allowed to post them at the companies discretion. As it turned out the company not offering SIL’s during that 60 days was probably a good thing for the pilot group as the flying collapsed far faster than predicted and a large number of pilots sat home and got full pay and in many cases above full pay as they picked up trips that never operated. It certainly provided nice checks for a lot of pilots me included.
Optics be dammed - we needed to save money. And SIL would have been voluntary and saved money. What's not to like about it? You could have not taken a SIL and still had your nice check. Also, it would of provided a intermediate solution between PLOA and a full paycheck for those who wanted some time off but didn't want to lose their whole paycheck.
In the end, Ed torpedoed it and ended up paying a lot of pilots to sit around, only to spend MORE money to displace them, train some of them, and reinstate them. Now we've got maybe 1500 NQAT (150 from the old AE and all the UNA) pilots ALL being paid to sit around while the seriously overwhelmed training department tries and figures it out.
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,261
About ten years ago we used to have SILs posted somewhat regularly in the winter for wide bodies. Like you said, it provided some cost savings - maybe not tons but some. A year ago it the company was trying to save every penny as refunds rushed out the door. Why not take the cost savings and tell the other departments "we need every penny" and focus on their departments for cost savings too?
Optics be dammed - we needed to save money. And SIL would have been voluntary and saved money. What's not to like about it? You could have not taken a SIL and still had your nice check. Also, it would of provided a intermediate solution between PLOA and a full paycheck for those who wanted some time off but didn't want to lose their whole paycheck.
In the end, Ed torpedoed it and ended up paying a lot of pilots to sit around, only to spend MORE money to displace them, train some of them, and reinstate them. Now we've got maybe 1500 NQAT (150 from the old AE and all the UNA) pilots ALL being paid to sit around while the seriously overwhelmed training department tries and figures it out.
Optics be dammed - we needed to save money. And SIL would have been voluntary and saved money. What's not to like about it? You could have not taken a SIL and still had your nice check. Also, it would of provided a intermediate solution between PLOA and a full paycheck for those who wanted some time off but didn't want to lose their whole paycheck.
In the end, Ed torpedoed it and ended up paying a lot of pilots to sit around, only to spend MORE money to displace them, train some of them, and reinstate them. Now we've got maybe 1500 NQAT (150 from the old AE and all the UNA) pilots ALL being paid to sit around while the seriously overwhelmed training department tries and figures it out.