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-   -   jetBlue, Competition, Seniority, and You (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/150196-jetblue-competition-seniority-you.html)

marcal 05-01-2025 09:45 AM

jetBlue, Competition, Seniority, and You
 
https://onemileatatime.com/news/jetb...d-partnership/

Purely for conversation:

I think JB is a radioactive concern for us.

The best thing for Delta and us, is they remain independent.

A UAL/JB partnership is not great for us, and a merger is awful as they would massively dominate NYC. Not a ton of overlapping routes since UAL has zero JFK flying.

Another overlooked option that I’d be looking at if I’m Ben Mininucci(Alaska CEO) is a JB merger catapulting Alaska into Global network carrier overnight. Again, simply
more competition.

And finally a potential DL/JB merger. I don’t think this would work with overlapping routes but a Delta/JB seniority integration would be a nightmare with their much younger pilot group.

Any thoughts?

I just hope our execs are paying attention.

saltbae 05-01-2025 10:19 AM


Originally Posted by marcal (Post 3908792)
https://onemileatatime.com/news/jetb...d-partnership/

Purely for conversation:

I think JB is a radioactive concern for us.

The best thing for Delta and us, is they remain independent.

A UAL/JB partnership is not great for us, and a merger is awful as they would massively dominate NYC. Not a ton of overlapping routes since UAL has zero JFK flying.

Another overlooked option that I’d be looking at if I’m Ben Mininucci(Alaska CEO) is a JB merger catapulting Alaska into Global network carrier overnight. Again, simply
more competition.

And finally a potential DL/JB merger. I don’t think this would work with overlapping routes but a Delta/JB seniority integration would be a nightmare with their much younger pilot group.

Any thoughts?

I just hope our execs are paying attention.

competition is good. Could see us getting 350’s in NYC or something to compete with AA 787 and UAL 787/777.. our old 767’s are not going to be able to compete with that product. UAL is already the biggest carrier fleet wise at Mainline. Growing organically is better for our pilot group for growth and being risk adverse - DL stepped up the game in SEA with Alaska 787’s coming in there

Trip7 05-01-2025 11:00 AM


Originally Posted by marcal (Post 3908792)
https://onemileatatime.com/news/jetb...d-partnership/

Purely for conversation:

I think JB is a radioactive concern for us.

The best thing for Delta and us, is they remain independent.

A UAL/JB partnership is not great for us, and a merger is awful as they would massively dominate NYC. Not a ton of overlapping routes since UAL has zero JFK flying.

Another overlooked option that I’d be looking at if I’m Ben Mininucci(Alaska CEO) is a JB merger catapulting Alaska into Global network carrier overnight. Again, simply
more competition.

And finally a potential DL/JB merger. I don’t think this would work with overlapping routes but a Delta/JB seniority integration would be a nightmare with their much younger pilot group.

Any thoughts?

I just hope our execs are paying attention.

Excellent topic for discussion. JB/UAL merger would be a big problem for Delta as the new United would become a force to be reckoned with globally.

Unfortunately I believe this is the Ace under Kirby's sleeve and he know he can pull it off under the Trump Administration just by telling him how good his leadership is and how nice his hair looks. It's highly likely jetBlue gets bought and UAL is the front-runner. Alaska the dark horse.

Maybe Delta can get Sun Country. Next few years will likely be interesting to say the least

notEnuf 05-01-2025 11:09 AM


Originally Posted by Trip7 (Post 3908823)
Excellent topic for discussion. JB/UAL merger would be a big problem for Delta as the new United would become a force to be reckoned with globally.

Unfortunately I believe this is the Ace under Kirby's sleeve and he know he can pull it off under the Trump Administration just by telling him how good his leadership is and how nice his hair looks. It's highly likely jetBlue gets bought and UAL is the front-runner. Alaska the dark horse.

Maybe Delta can get Sun Country. Next few years will likely be interesting to say the least

where did we decide spirit fits into this thought experiment?

runinonfumes 05-01-2025 11:29 AM


Originally Posted by notEnuf (Post 3908829)
where did we decide spirit fits into this thought experiment?

with F9….

back to JB, merger’s are mostly about reducing competition. It would benefit us if UA and JB tie up. They would have to decrease service along the east coast to Florida. That a win for us. It would distract UA and perhaps add a marketing challenge as to how to keep UA product on tract and able to capture the JB hVC . Hard to say all mergers are a gamble and most really cost more in long run and don’t really add long term market gains. No more then if the weaker company just shut down the remaining ones slowly added in the capacity in a productive, strategic and profitable manner.

marcal 05-01-2025 11:33 AM


Originally Posted by runinonfumes (Post 3908839)
with F9….

back to JB, merger’s are mostly about reducing competition. It would benefit us if UA and JB tie up. They would have to decrease service along the east coast to Florida. That a win for us. It would distract UA and perhaps add a marketing challenge as to how to keep UA product on tract and able to capture the JB hVC . Hard to say all mergers are a gamble and most really cost more in long run and don’t really add long term market gains. No more then if the weaker company just shut down the remaining ones slowly added in the capacity in a productive, strategic and profitable manner.

They typically need to shed overlapping routes in a merger but the DOJ looks at EWR-FLL and JFK-FLL as not overlapping, even though it is obvious they both serve NYC to SoFla. They may not need to shed much. I hope DL is paying their lobbyists and congressman whatever they need to prevent that.

notEnuf 05-01-2025 11:55 AM


Originally Posted by runinonfumes (Post 3908839)
with F9….

back to JB, merger’s are mostly about reducing competition. It would benefit us if UA and JB tie up. They would have to decrease service along the east coast to Florida. That a win for us. It would distract UA and perhaps add a marketing challenge as to how to keep UA product on tract and able to capture the JB hVC . Hard to say all mergers are a gamble and most really cost more in long run and don’t really add long term market gains. No more then if the weaker company just shut down the remaining ones slowly added in the capacity in a productive, strategic and profitable manner.

UA + JB just means every other company will find a dance partner but from the stags left (second choice at best) UA won't just dominate from a merger unchecked.

PilotJ3 05-01-2025 11:58 AM


Originally Posted by notEnuf (Post 3908829)
where did we decide spirit fits into this thought experiment?

Maybe with AA? F9 or SW with DAL. :rolleyes:

Trip7 05-01-2025 12:25 PM


Originally Posted by PilotJ3 (Post 3908854)
Maybe with AA? F9 or SW with DAL. :rolleyes:

AI says there is no viable merger strategy to counteract a UAL/JB tie up. Delta would probably devote max resources to stopping the deal


Delta's options to counter a hypothetical United-JetBlue merger are even more limited:
  • No Major U.S. Airline Remains Unaligned: All other large U.S. carriers (American, Southwest, Alaska, and now the combined Alaska-Hawaiian) are either too large for regulatory approval or already merged.
  • Regional/Niche Carriers: Delta could look at smaller regional airlines, but these would not provide the scale or network boost of a JetBlue-United combination.
  • International Partnerships: Delta may deepen or expand its global alliances (such as with Air France-KLM, Virgin Atlantic, LATAM, or WestJet) to strengthen its international reach.
  • Organic Growth and Product Investment: With few domestic merger options, Delta could focus on expanding its own network, improving its product, and investing in loyalty or technology to differentiate itself.
In summary, with Alaska having acquired Hawaiian, Delta has no obvious large-scale U.S. merger partner left. Its most viable responses would be expanding international partnerships or investing in organic growth, as a major domestic merger is highly unlikely under current regulatory conditions.




notEnuf 05-01-2025 12:36 PM


Originally Posted by Trip7 (Post 3908866)
AI says there is no viable merger strategy to counteract a UAL/JB tie up. Delta would probably devote max resources to stopping the deal

Your trust in AI is misplaced. There would be a divestment requirement for some assets. If spirit and JB couldn't get unfettered approval, what makes you think UAL will? That last sentence says it all... "a major domestic merger is highly unlikely under current regulatory conditions"


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