I can see the logic in the fact 67 would be more expensive, both for LTD and just the general having employees at the top of our various accruals around for 2 more years (5 weeks vacation, 270 hours sick leave, ect.)

when 65 happened our LTD was worse than it is now. If 5 years didn’t destroy our LTD/ negotiating ability for improved LTD and other items, I find it hard to believe 2 more years will. If anything I would think our DC % would be an easier target. Don’t need as high of a % if you can stay longer.

70+ is a different story, but I don’t think 67 will break the bank. I hope we don’t have to find out.

never got it either, but there are plenty of people who are just looking for anything to justify their cause. And complaining to the generation who will never see ANY SS really won’t get them the sympathy they think it will.

according to my AME, most people who are going to have serious issues have them long before they get to their 60s. If you have made it to 65 with no big health issues, the odds are very good you will continue to be healthy.

That might be true for new LTD recipients*. But there are a not-small number of existing and permanent LTD recipients who would get 2 more years of LTD, which is the equivalent of carrying them as a full time employee for a full year, including 401(k).

* I'd be willing the bet there will be some folks who will finally fess up to a condition they have been hiding/minimizing, and initiate LTD somewhere around 65 (when they have been expecting to retire anyway), and collect a year's pay spread over the following 2. No idea how many, but it won't be zero... 10% of the monthly retirements are above/beyond mandatory numbers... Just saying.

The only fair punishment is to make anyone 65 and older have to fly with another pilot that’s 65 and older. For. Every. Rotation.

Modern problems require modern solutions. I like this idea.

Well that shouldn't be a problem because the FAs get LTD, so do the mechanics and, and, and. We should add all these cost considerations to negotiations too, right?

Human nature indicates that's likely.

Over my career, I've observed a slight tendency towards discretionary LTD on the part of people who have some grievance (real or perceived) with the airline. Commonly merger victims.

Depending on their prior DPMA use, they might even collect up to a year and a half of pay spread over two years. That might be even more of an incentive.

Good Point (though I would note, getting both LTD and DPMA approved does required physician records and several pages of forms. The disability has to be proven legitimate, but still). There are also the ALPA insurances that kick in after 1 year on LTD.

I’ve heard rumor of a AME near the mothership that has asked older pilots if they want to go out on LTD, because he can help them…

A charitable interpretation of that might be, “you’re on the verge of losing your medical, it’s time...” I mean, it’s no surprise that as we age things start to fall apart. So, to be fair, I’m sure there are borderline cases, that you might be able to argue either way. My wife always says medicine is often as much art as it is science. 🤷‍♂️

But still…

How does that even work? “Let me help you falsify medical and legal documents”? What physician is willing to risk his own livelihood on that?

Throwing a bone to senior for once, it's probably more like:

"Hey Jughead, today you pass and meet all standards, but you gotta keep an eye on XYZ, if it continues to progress, there's a realistic chance you may not meet standards next time you come in. It may be time to start considering taking the disability route. If you make that decision I'm here to help. I just want to inform you now so you have time instead of being blindsided by this if/when you no longer are able to hold a medical".

Pretty much what I was attempting to say also...

I've been out on LTD twice, once for a motorcycle accident and once because of my hearing due to the TBI that resulted from the accident years later. Nobody is gaming the system to go in LTD, Delta isn't going to pay someone unless they have a condition that disqualifies them. There are however, plenty of guys who are flying with conditions that disqualifie them.


Hopefully, I'll be back in a couple of months.

I'm early 60s. I take no prescription meds. I still don't need glasses. My AME and PCM are still pretty amazed that at my age I'm not on at least 2-3 meds like most of people my age.

I've always been active. I surf and eat well although on the road it's not easy. I'm pretty sure I'd be good to go at 67, 70 or whatever. As someone posted earlier if you're at 60 and not on anything, you're probably good to go for some time.

My weight is well under control (6ft 2" and 175 lbs). It's not hard. There's plenty of us out there that don't comport to some of the venom spitting vipers on here about us " older" folks. Like to see them when they hit 60+ thirty years from now. But I'll be pushing up the daisies by then.

My dad was the exact same as you. Played hockey, golfed, lifted weights, etc. into late 60’s. Retired at mandatory age of 65. He was diagnosed with brain cancer at 70. He aged 10 years in the last year and is now 71 and looks 71. Now he can’t do much. At 69 years old, he looked like he was in his 50’s. Aging happens differently for different people, but it doesn’t happen linear.

My point is you might not be as well off as you think at 67 or 70. It sounds like you’re doing well now. Enjoy it.

All the best to your Dad, Hockey.