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Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?

Old 07-14-2009, 05:23 AM
  #10171  
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Freebird - it was less than 10%. Now we argue whether it is 50% or 66%. Depends on what metric you measure. When you tell your reps that DCI flies a majority of block hours, they reply that DCI only operates 30% of seat miles. They deflect the argument by changing the metric used to measure the level of outsourcing.

That might go down a few percentage points:
Court approves Republic's Frontier bid
Tuesday July 14, 2009

Republic Airways Holdings moved a step closer to acquiring Frontier Airlines after a bankruptcy court judge approved the regional operator's proposal to purchase the Denver-based carrier for $108.8 million.

Frontier reportedly has solicited other bids. If other offers come in before Aug. 10, the court will hold an auction. The airline filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection in April 2008.

Republic operates as Republic Airlines, Chautauqua Airlines and Shuttle America. Under the Republic proposal, Frontier and its regional subsidiary, Lynx Aviation, would maintain their current names and continue to operate as usual. It is not clear whether headquarters will be moved from Denver to Republic's headquarters in Indianapolis.
Frontier said its post-emergence strategy would be to continue to position Frontier as one of the industry's lowest unit-cost operators, and that it would continue its plans to transition from Airbus A318 aircraft to A320 aircraft.
There had been a rumor that maybe there was a E175 Airbus swap in the works, public statements seem to say otherwise.

But Republic is a hedge fund at this point. Who knows what they are up to.

Last edited by Bucking Bar; 07-14-2009 at 05:39 AM.
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:32 AM
  #10172  
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Originally Posted by Bucking Bar View Post
Freebird - it was less than 10%. Now we argue whether it is 50% or 66%. Depends on what metric you measure. When you tell your reps that DCI flies a majority of block hours, they reply that DCI only operates 30% of seat miles. They deflect the argument by changing the metric used to measure the level of outsourcing.
Thanks BB, lets hope that the scope report card actually does some good. Im afraid DALPA will Neuter the #'s to their liking. Ya know, almost like we need an outside source to track this stuff?
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:35 AM
  #10173  
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Guys,
Scope is not a Junior vs. Senior issue- it is a Delta Pilot issue. The issue is very complex as was said. Yeah, some guys may say things like "Chicken Little," but don't let it bother you - keep on issue, don't get emotional, and lastly dont get drawn into an argument over who has been screwed more - even if you could win such an argument, which you will not, we all lose. Our goal should be to educate and keep the Scope issue on the front burner. This is going to be a drawn out fight - lets direct it at management and not each other.

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Old 07-14-2009, 05:40 AM
  #10174  
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yesterday i was told there were around 40 more PIRPS on the desk waiting to get processed so we should see more than 178 Even at 178, thats more than most of us expected so thats great!

I conquer, free beer for all PIRPS

Originally Posted by Scoop View Post
Guys,
Scope is not a Junior vs. Senior issue- it is a Delta Pilot issue. The issue is very complex as was said. Yeah, some guys may say things like "Chicken Little," but don't let it bother you - keep on issue, don't get emotional, and lastly dont get drawn into an argument over who has been screwed more - even if you could win such an argument, which you will not, we all lose. Our goal should be to educate and keep the Scope issue on the front burner. This is going to be a drawn out fight - lets direct it at management and not each other.

Scoop
I agree, great post
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:46 AM
  #10175  
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Originally Posted by sailingfun View Post
I tend to be a results oriented guy. When I look around the industry I see virtually every major airline with pilots on furlough except Delta! Many of these airlines have much tighter scope then Delta. We just had a announcement from flight ops that no furloughs are planned for the future based on current fleet projections. There is one reason that we don't have pilots furloughed at the moment.

Sailing, so going from near 10,000 pre chapter 11 DAL S pilots down to 7000 has nothing to do with it???????
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:50 AM
  #10176  
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Originally Posted by alfaromeo View Post
What I can do is point to facts. First, most of the concessions made in the last 5 years have been pay and and retirement. Those two affect the most senior pilots to a much greater degree than junior pilots. Second, you can add that in the years prior to 2001, the senior pilots pushed a lot of money into the junior end of the list by increasing the first officers percentage of captain pay and eliminating the B-Scale. That is why the junior Northwest pilots got a much bigger raise than their captains.

So the facts are that the bulk of concessions have fallen on more senior pilots and if you look ten years back to today, you will find the junior end of the list fared much better situated than the senior end.

At DAL we were told by ALPA that using modest assumptions the allocation of the $650M note, in conjunction with the MPPP rollover and PBGC benefits made up for 100% of the qualified losses due to the DB plan termination. Additionally, the senior pilots, who took the lions share of the $650M note, also enjoyed the lion's share of the the $2.1B claim.

So your statement that the senior pilots have suffered the most must be tempered by the fact that the senior pilots received the most in claims and notes.

The senior pilots also cashed in on a larger chunk of the equity distribution due to the merger.

I've yet to see a note or claim model that addressed the outsourcing of 153 mainline aircraft and the captains' positions lost due to the outsourcing of the 76 seat mainline jet. Perhaps because some on the MEC don't really consider that a big concession, which might be part of the problem.

Last edited by Reroute; 07-14-2009 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 07-14-2009, 05:57 AM
  #10177  
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Originally Posted by Rather B Fishin View Post
Sailing, so going from near 10,000 pre chapter 11 DAL S pilots down to 7000 has nothing to do with it???????
While scope is part of that I think the other parts would be; increasing Intn'l block hours,PBS or CBS(I hate computers),leaving unprofitable routes and contract items that reduced the # of pilots (less vacation,sick pay etc).
I agree that scope is huge and is one of the cornerstones of our contract.
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Old 07-14-2009, 06:45 AM
  #10178  
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Originally Posted by Fly4hire View Post
Seems to me the thought police is out in force. Never seen so many new members. I bet it's quiet over on the MEC board
Here's a prime example of the "fair and balanced" viewpoint I discussed earlier. I've been a member for 18 months, thanks. Btw, there's two threads on the MEC board on this topic, with very few active posters. The poliitcs section is way more active. Is that some of the "scope fatigue" you write about later? Why do you come here and foment disunity rather than man up and take it where business can actually get done?

You continue to misrepresent my position and try and put words on paper that I didn't say. When a different point of view is presented to you, you talk of "thought police." You don't rebutt the substance...hmmm.

Hey, I get it. You're not happy. Your issue isn't getting the public attention that you believe it deserves. Yet you fail to acknowledge any of the work that was done to address your issue...

Originally Posted by Fly4hire View Post
Thank you for keeping to the high road even if we don't agree.
Why don't you try joining us there with some intellectually honest argument?

I hope my participation here helps you sharpen those arguments. (the last part is serious).
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Old 07-14-2009, 06:51 AM
  #10179  
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Just a little look down the road:
Flightglobal confirms prelim talks with Embraer:


Industry sources say that Delta Air Lines is interested in studying a
130- to 140-seat airliner that could offer equivalent per seat operating
economics to its larger mainline narrowbodies,
and has spoken to Embraer about the possibilities.
A separate source says Embraer and Delta held talks as early as last year.
According to Flight's ACAS database, Delta operates 113 Boeing MD-88s and 16 MD-90s.
Its merger partner Northwest Airlines operates over 60 McDonnell Douglas DC-9s, some over 40 years old.
Northwest was previously considered a prime candidate for the CSeries.
Kern does not confirm any specific discussions between Embraer and Delta,
calling the airframer's conversations with airlines very "general". He adds:
"We understand the airlines may have some need for some specific sizes of airplanes
and what we are doing today is it is all still very general."
Embraer chief Frederico Curado has said that a decision on a next-generation
aircraft will probably not come before 18 to 24 months.
"So [with] any new airplane, the soonest will be probably in the second half
of the next decade," says Kern.
Cheers
George
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Old 07-14-2009, 06:57 AM
  #10180  
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Finis, you are correct sir! Our employee group has become far more productive since CH11 through the measures you mentioned. That productivity equates profits at the corporate level. Now our union is faced with a dilemma. Do they fight to "take it back" which would roll back the productivity clock an I think would be harmful to our ability to compete, or do they take our productivity gains and and use them to increase the percentage of the work that our union members do?

Here is where i see the junior/senior fissures. Both groups are looking forward in a way but each has a different perspective on what is more important. The union's job is to blend the two extremes and pursue a strategy that benefits the whole, without sacrificing a part.
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